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<blockquote data-quote="wkmac" data-source="post: 472066" data-attributes="member: 2189"><p>I guess in my case I'm an extreme atheist as I believe Israel as we know it today has no God granted claim on this land to begin with but for that fact I believe the same in the claim that the muslims make. The bible has many great things within it's pages and lessons of life that are priceless but the simple fact this document is man created. In the case of the old testament, it is written for jews, about jews and by jews so of course in that context how could they not ultimately win at the end of the day. Christians came along and added their own flavor to the mix that in the end is exactly the same.</p><p> </p><p>I believe Jesus the greatest of men to walk the earth and his teachings alone are manna from heaven if you will but if I have to believe that every word in Holy Writ is all from God, then yes I'm an atheist. Does this mean I have to stop looking to Jesus for example and saying grace before I eat? Does this mean my kids must stop attending church and my daughter stop being a musician performing christian and worship music?</p><p> </p><p>Far be it from me to violate another man created rule in my atheistic actions!</p><p><img src="/community/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/FeltTip/wink.png" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":wink2:" title="Wink :wink2:" data-shortname=":wink2:" /></p><p> </p><p>By the way Chev, the bible is a wonderful book but 2 suggestions. Either learn hebrew and greek or easier yet, obtain lexicons and other tools to dysect into the words used in the bible. Sure opens up a whole new wonderful world of undertanding and along with that, learn the histories of ancient Mesopotamia with details on Sumer, Babylon and Assyria. Learn about ancient Egypt with close attention to the shepard kings of the 12th dynasty known by the name of hyksos. Find who Zoraster was and what Zorasterism is. Very important influence on biblical monotheistic thought. Learn about the Mesopotamian king Sargon that predates Moses who also as a baby was set adrift in a river only to be taken later and becomes king. Oddly enough, this same story can be found in ancient India concerning one of it's great leaders. Imagine that! Read about Hammurabi and the Hammurabi code. Read about Sargon the Great, the semitic king of but more importantly understand that Abraham came out of this culture. </p><p> </p><p>Read the Epic of Gilgamesh and it's creation story and the great flood which both predate Israelite writtings. Do you think Abram who came from Ur in the Sumer kingdom might have brough with him stories like Gilgamesh and then later his pogeny crafted those stories into a new national context for their own purpose?</p><p> </p><p><img src="/community/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/FeltTip/surprised.png" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":surprised:" title="Surprised :surprised:" data-shortname=":surprised:" /> Say it ain't so!</p><p> </p><p>Besides, Israel today came about because England in the spoils of WW1 was granted Palestine by mandate and remained so until 1948' when actions of jewish terrorist know as the Irgun used bombings to chase England from it's position of power and the United States in it's global standing recognized these acts of terror by publically recognizing Israel as an independent State. This region has always been in violent conflict because of man created religious dogma and I see nothing to change that so again, we should extract ourselves completely out of the middle of this mess of death and bloodshed.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="wkmac, post: 472066, member: 2189"] I guess in my case I'm an extreme atheist as I believe Israel as we know it today has no God granted claim on this land to begin with but for that fact I believe the same in the claim that the muslims make. The bible has many great things within it's pages and lessons of life that are priceless but the simple fact this document is man created. In the case of the old testament, it is written for jews, about jews and by jews so of course in that context how could they not ultimately win at the end of the day. Christians came along and added their own flavor to the mix that in the end is exactly the same. I believe Jesus the greatest of men to walk the earth and his teachings alone are manna from heaven if you will but if I have to believe that every word in Holy Writ is all from God, then yes I'm an atheist. Does this mean I have to stop looking to Jesus for example and saying grace before I eat? Does this mean my kids must stop attending church and my daughter stop being a musician performing christian and worship music? Far be it from me to violate another man created rule in my atheistic actions! :wink2: By the way Chev, the bible is a wonderful book but 2 suggestions. Either learn hebrew and greek or easier yet, obtain lexicons and other tools to dysect into the words used in the bible. Sure opens up a whole new wonderful world of undertanding and along with that, learn the histories of ancient Mesopotamia with details on Sumer, Babylon and Assyria. Learn about ancient Egypt with close attention to the shepard kings of the 12th dynasty known by the name of hyksos. Find who Zoraster was and what Zorasterism is. Very important influence on biblical monotheistic thought. Learn about the Mesopotamian king Sargon that predates Moses who also as a baby was set adrift in a river only to be taken later and becomes king. Oddly enough, this same story can be found in ancient India concerning one of it's great leaders. Imagine that! Read about Hammurabi and the Hammurabi code. Read about Sargon the Great, the semitic king of but more importantly understand that Abraham came out of this culture. Read the Epic of Gilgamesh and it's creation story and the great flood which both predate Israelite writtings. Do you think Abram who came from Ur in the Sumer kingdom might have brough with him stories like Gilgamesh and then later his pogeny crafted those stories into a new national context for their own purpose? :surprised: Say it ain't so! Besides, Israel today came about because England in the spoils of WW1 was granted Palestine by mandate and remained so until 1948' when actions of jewish terrorist know as the Irgun used bombings to chase England from it's position of power and the United States in it's global standing recognized these acts of terror by publically recognizing Israel as an independent State. This region has always been in violent conflict because of man created religious dogma and I see nothing to change that so again, we should extract ourselves completely out of the middle of this mess of death and bloodshed. [/QUOTE]
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