mngmt stealing our time

[DS]

This may get a bit long winded because I want to include all the facts and I want some opinions on
this .
I`ve had the same sup for about 2 years now.He used to be a driver and he`s always been fair to me,but he`s been doing something to the junior guys that I`m not sure is entirely legal.

A fellow FT driver of about 2 years now with a heavy commercial industrial area called in at 13:00 pm and said he needed delivery help.Sup asked if he would code 05 and get it done.They agreed and the night sup swears they put the code 05 in the computer.The next day he looks at the op report and sees that he ran scratch the day before,which is next to impossible.When he confronted the sup he confided that indeed he had taken out the code 05...because his numbers did not warrent it!
I check the report every morning to make sure I`m getting paid for what I worked,and I`ve never had a problem with my hours,but this just seems wrong.Is this him trying to bring up his numbers for his MIP?
The kid says he`s filing a grievance,but this seems to me like this has to be stopped altogether.What about the new kids that are afraid to say anything.
Should I take this sup to the side and tell him that he can be fired for stealing time?
What do you guys think?

 

[canon]

Should I take this sup to the side and tell him that he can be fired for stealing time?

I wouldn't, it's not your place.

05 is paid actual, so this guy skipped lunch to get it done only to have the Supe reverse it and take the hour out... meaning the guy worked an hour for free.

Yup, that's the only way you can come close to scratch. Good job UPS... your time allowances are so far off it makes you look like you don't know what you're doing. I used to be able to look in the back of my truck before I left the building and know if it was going to be a late night... now EDD can't tell if a driver is going to be under dispatched or over 9.5. Quit subcontracting the thinking portion of the job to people who have never done the job. Sorry, got a little side tracked.

If this supervisor doesn't already know it is wrong to steal time, then I'm not sure why you would want to "save" him from the only thing UPS excels at: discipline. But in this case, the only way he can receive paid actual is when he is also under 8 hours right? Otherwise he falls into DOT regulations of requiring a lunch? Just guessing here... his numbers might not have warranted 05 only because he went over 8 hours. If that's the case, he only needs to see if the sup tacked on the missing lunch, or deducted the time worked. I'll bet we already know the outcome of that if he ran scratch.

 

[SmithBarney]

Ctr mgr is the only one here allowed to authorize a 05(non standard lunch skipping)
On-cars can authorize a non standard (long lunch)

 

[tieguy]

This may get a bit long winded because I want to include all the facts and I want some opinions on
this .
I`ve had the same sup for about 2 years now.He used to be a driver and he`s always been fair to me,but he`s been doing something to the junior guys that I`m not sure is entirely legal.

A fellow FT driver of about 2 years now with a heavy commercial industrial area called in at 13:00 pm and said he needed delivery help.Sup asked if he would code 05 and get it done.They agreed and the night sup swears they put the code 05 in the computer.The next day he looks at the op report and sees that he ran scratch the day before,which is next to impossible.When he confronted the sup he confided that indeed he had taken out the code 05...because his numbers did not warrent it!
I check the report every morning to make sure I`m getting paid for what I worked,and I`ve never had a problem with my hours,but this just seems wrong.Is this him trying to bring up his numbers for his MIP?

It will help his numbers it won't do anything for his MIP. He is either trying to inflate his numbers or he is trying to avoid getting his but kicked for an 05. Either way he's wrong.

The kid says he`s filing a grievance,but this seems to me like this has to be stopped altogether.What about the new kids that are afraid to say anything.
Should I take this sup to the side and tell him that he can be fired for stealing time?
What do you guys think?

Are you a shop steward? If not then I think its not your place to counsel the sup unless you two have some type of long term friendship where you feel you owe him a favor. I don't have any love for dishonest management because I waste too much time cleaning up their mistakes. If you feel the sup deserves a break then the steward should be the one to warn the sup that anymore timecard edits will result in a whole lot of hell being raised.

 

[wornoutupser]

This may get a bit long winded because I want to include all the facts and I want some opinions on
this .
I`ve had the same sup for about 2 years now.He used to be a driver and he`s always been fair to me,but he`s been doing something to the junior guys that I`m not sure is entirely legal.

A fellow FT driver of about 2 years now with a heavy commercial industrial area called in at 13:00 pm and said he needed delivery help.Sup asked if he would code 05 and get it done.They agreed and the night sup swears they put the code 05 in the computer.The next day he looks at the op report and sees that he ran scratch the day before,which is next to impossible.When he confronted the sup he confided that indeed he had taken out the code 05...because his numbers did not warrent it!
I check the report every morning to make sure I`m getting paid for what I worked,and I`ve never had a problem with my hours,but this just seems wrong.Is this him trying to bring up his numbers for his MIP?
The kid says he`s filing a grievance,but this seems to me like this has to be stopped altogether.What about the new kids that are afraid to say anything.
Should I take this sup to the side and tell him that he can be fired for stealing time?
What do you guys think?

The supervisor should be fired. Period.
We have lost two supervisors for the exact same situation. One did it on their own and one did it under instruction from the center manager. Of course, only the supervisors were fired!

 

[Channahon]

The kid says he`s filing a grievance,but this seems to me like this has to be stopped altogether.What about the new kids that are afraid to say anything.
Should I take this sup to the side and tell him that he can be fired for stealing time?
What do you guys think?

When the grievance gets filed, all this will come to the attention of the management team division and labor manager. My guess is an investigation will be started by Security/IE to audit reports to see exactly how timecards are being coded. Sadly, too many management people lose their jobs over issues like this.

 

[disneyworld]

FIRE HIM. If it was a driver, he'd be gone for dishonesty.

 

[scratch]

A person's integrity is very important in this job, no matter what your title is. My reputation for honesty has gotten me out of a couple of jams over the years. DS, this particular person has lost your trust, you will wonder from now on if they are honest and fair to you. JMHO

 

[tireknocker]

Call the hot line number for dishonesty!!!

 

[toonertoo]

A while back with a team not the caliber of the one I have now, told me "yeah go ahead and skip your lunch to get the commercial off and we will 05 your card", when I got in they told me to sit at the picnic table and take my lunch, as they were not allowed to 05 the card, or go home and lose that 1/2 hr.

It was a very long half hour as sitting in a cold building, or going up to burger King was not my plan for my arrival. Never did it again. I think someone thought he had the authority to do what he didn't. If you know the guy and hes cool then I would ask the juniors to let it slide, and never do it again. Everyone makes mistakes. If you think he intentionally screwed them, then you have to tell them to do what they think is right. Its hard for people to stand up when they are new, heck its hard for all of us. I would rather not be put in that position at all, but we are, daily.

 

[cachsux]

What this is called is falsifying a timecard and is,or used to be,a cardinal sin for mgmt. If you did it you would be fired,so it`s up to the driver on how he wants to persue this.

 

[over9five]

I agree the sup should be fired for dishonesty, falsifying a time card, and just being an idiot. The shop steward should report this to the center manager, and the center manager should make it right.

 

[canoworms]

Folks, as we all know, there is a lot of pressure on our sups to make their numbers and as human beings we all make mistakes. If this is the guys first bonehead screwup he should be made aware by the steward in the presence of the center manager that this will not be tollerated. Keep it in the center this time. Pay the driver his lunch plus one article 17 and make it a learning experience. Doing it like this makes the driver whole and lets the young sup live another day.

 

[DS]

Folks, as we all know, there is a lot of pressure on our sups to make their numbers and as human beings we all make mistakes. If this is the guys first bonehead screwup he should be made aware by the steward in the presence of the center manager that this will not be tollerated. Keep it in the center this time. Pay the driver his lunch plus one article 17 and make it a learning experience. Doing it like this makes the driver whole and lets the young sup live another day.

Although other people made some good points,canoworms advice would be my best bet.Thx for your input.

 

[satellitedriver]

A person's integrity is very important in this job, no matter what your title is. My reputation for honesty has gotten me out of a couple of jams over the years. DS, this particular person has lost your trust, you will wonder from now on if they are honest and fair to you. JMHO

Integrity is important in all aspects of ones life. It defines who one truly is. I totally agree with your post.

 

[canoworms]

Integrity is important in all aspects of ones life. It defines who one truly is. I totally agree with your post.

I agree fully that that ones reputation is the only thing that will always follow us and to sully that is inexcusable. However, who among us has never done something that we regret. A second chance is warrented in this situation.

 

[HazMatMan]

Folks, as we all know, there is a lot of pressure on our sups to make their numbers and as human beings we all make mistakes. If this is the guys first bonehead screwup he should be made aware by the steward in the presence of the center manager that this will not be tollerated. Keep it in the center this time. Pay the driver his lunch plus one article 17 and make it a learning experience. Doing it like this makes the driver whole and lets the young sup live another day.

I agree, I have seen plenty of union guys get their jobs back after doing something they should have been fired for..

 

[over9five]

"A second chance is warrented in this situation."

So once again they don't have to abide by their own "Code of Business Conduct". From the UPS Policy book (which can be read by all employees at www.upsers.com ):

We Insist Upon Integrity in Our People. Operating with integrity means we provide an
atmosphere in which our people can perform their jobs in an
ethical manner.

It goes on to say:

The great majority of our people are of high moral character.
However, when we do discover a dishonest person in our
organization, we deal with that individual quickly and firmly.

Sorry, this man LIED to an employee, and then STOLE money from his paycheck. He is dishonest, and we (as a company) have to get rid of him.

The UPS Code of Business Conduct can be found at UPS Global Home .

 

[gamer282]

I to have the same situation. I have filed 2 grievances in the past 3 months. The first, Management has agreed to pay, but has not yet given me the actual pay and have grieved now for the penalty. The second I filed 3 weeks ago. I called the center manager on his cell phone, told him my situation. He didn't say yes or no only asked me about some misloads. The next morning a lunch was taken out so another grievance was filed. I haven't gotten that one back. The Key here is that I am not a "BONUS" driver. I don't really run under because of the horable time studies. So I choose not to be involved in Bonus, it is unethical. It is standard practice for Bonus drivers to skip their lunch and come in getting bonus pay. If they can skip their lunch so can I.
I will file another for Monday because I have a Co-worker that has Church on Wednesdays at 7 PM. Management knows this. This past week he ran my route, bumping the less senior kid. I usually have 110 stops. He ended with 144 and had to skip his lunch. He told the Manager this and they still took a lunch out. The rookie he bumped worked only 61/2 hours next to him and went home..........
I believe California had a settlement on the lunch hour with it being taken out automatically and won millions $$$$$$$$$...
Any other info on this feel free to email me, thanks
P.S. I have been a Shop Steward for 16 years

 

[canoworms]

I to have the same situation. I have filed 2 grievances in the past 3 months. The first, Management has agreed to pay, but has not yet given me the actual pay and have grieved now for the penalty. The second I filed 3 weeks ago. I called the center manager on his cell phone, told him my situation. He didn't say yes or no only asked me about some misloads. The next morning a lunch was taken out so another grievance was filed. I haven't gotten that one back. The Key here is that I am not a "BONUS" driver. I don't really run under because of the horable time studies. So I choose not to be involved in Bonus, it is unethical. It is standard practice for Bonus drivers to skip their lunch and come in getting bonus pay. If they can skip their lunch so can I.
I will file another for Monday because I have a Co-worker that has Church on Wednesdays at 7 PM. Management knows this. This past week he ran my route, bumping the less senior kid. I usually have 110 stops. He ended with 144 and had to skip his lunch. He told the Manager this and they still took a lunch out. The rookie he bumped worked only 61/2 hours next to him and went home..........
I believe California had a settlement on the lunch hour with it being taken out automatically and won millions $$$$$$$$$...
Any other info on this feel free to email me, thanks
P.S. I have been a Shop Steward for 16 years

First things first. Set up a meeting before start time with the other drivers and tell them that contractually they are required to take a lunch. Get some key drivers to back you on this. Let the center manager know what is happening and then lead by example. Be willing to take some heat for this but stick to your guns. You will gain respect from both sides. Second: If i want to go to church on Wednesday night, I request in writing on Monday, an 8 hr request. If it is denied for no good reason I get my business agent involved on Tuesday and on Wed. evening at 7 I'm in Church. Third: If you have a grievance that the boss has agreed to pay and hasn't, Thats your fault my friend. Call your B.A. now and get it done. If the center manager is just being a jerk, tag article 17 onto that grievance and I guarantee there will be forward movement with your issue. Good luck and let me know how your meeting about lunch went. Remember that people are looking for good leaders.