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<blockquote data-quote="vantexan" data-source="post: 6063621" data-attributes="member: 24302"><p>Ukraine had been invaded by an enemy much larger and better armed than them.&nbsp; They had two choices, surrender their country or fight to preserve it.&nbsp; Anyone who believes Putin would&#039;ve accepted peace terms from a surrendering opponent with just carving off a bit of the country for Russia is terribly uninformed.&nbsp; Forgotten in all of this is Putin had designs on Moldova too.&nbsp; It also has a breakaway province of Russian separatists.&nbsp; But he had to finish off Ukraine to get to it.&nbsp; By fighting Russia to a standstill over three years, inflicting much heavier losses on the Russians, Ukraine gained the leverage it needed to negotiate keeping most of its territory.&nbsp; Keeping the occupied territory and an agreement to not enter NATO lets Putin save face.&nbsp; He can claim he was saving ethnic Russians from the abusive Ukrainians.&nbsp; This Monday morning quarterbacking by DIDO saying they&#039;re getting what he said they&#039;d get three years ago, should&#039;ve listened to him, is at best naive.&nbsp; And while everyone likes to say Washington is pulling all the strings, manipulating everything, they fail to recognize it&#039;s the Ukrainians from the get go who chose to defend their country.&nbsp; Who sent their wives and children out of the country and required every able bodied male between 16 and 64 to fight.&nbsp; I hope all those who are quick to say they&#039;d fight to defend the USA will show as much courage protecting our sovereignty.&nbsp; But they sure were quick to denigrate the Ukrainians efforts to defend their country.</p></blockquote><p></p>

[QUOTE="vantexan, post: 6063621, member: 24302"] Ukraine had been invaded by an enemy much larger and better armed than them. They had two choices, surrender their country or fight to preserve it. Anyone who believes Putin would've accepted peace terms from a surrendering opponent with just carving off a bit of the country for Russia is terribly uninformed. Forgotten in all of this is Putin had designs on Moldova too. It also has a breakaway province of Russian separatists. But he had to finish off Ukraine to get to it. By fighting Russia to a standstill over three years, inflicting much heavier losses on the Russians, Ukraine gained the leverage it needed to negotiate keeping most of its territory. Keeping the occupied territory and an agreement to not enter NATO lets Putin save face. He can claim he was saving ethnic Russians from the abusive Ukrainians. This Monday morning quarterbacking by DIDO saying they're getting what he said they'd get three years ago, should've listened to him, is at best naive. And while everyone likes to say Washington is pulling all the strings, manipulating everything, they fail to recognize it's the Ukrainians from the get go who chose to defend their country. Who sent their wives and children out of the country and required every able bodied male between 16 and 64 to fight. I hope all those who are quick to say they'd fight to defend the USA will show as much courage protecting our sovereignty. But they sure were quick to denigrate the Ukrainians efforts to defend their country. [/QUOTE]

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