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[TUT]

As Bernie Sanders pointed out, Hillary gave a closed doors speech to Wall Street exec's for $225k. "Must've been a pretty good speech" said Bernie. Please don't compare me to Democrats.

Hillary is more establishment than even Trump. She's the most republican running. Now Bernie, yeah he's more down the line of what one would consider a liberal. That said, I'm for whoever wins these days, thrown in the towel. We can't afford to keep having 1/2 the country pile on the prez. I have my favorite but whoever wins... please do good for us.

 

[TUT]

I'm no Hillary lover either, but she's better than what you've got.

Unsure.

 

[Brownslave688]

Spot on VanT. I wonder if BigWork realizes that in today's investment environment about a 3% return is about all you can be reasonably certain of then in order to have a modest retirement of $2,500 per month he would need an investment portfolio of ONE MILLION DOLLARS. I wonder how far along he is toward getting there. Remember in 2006 Bush wanted to privatize Social Security but just 2 years later we had the financial melt down and that was the last you heard of that idea along with the fact that transition costs would approach 2 trillion dollars,not to mention that scores of Americans saw their retirement nest egg shrink if not disappear all together. Keep in mind also that of the current 17 trillion deficit 5 trillion of it is owed to Social Security.

All the more reason not to give the government my money.

 

[bacha29]

Keep in mind something here. The banks were rather quiet when the idea of converting to an all private retirement system came up for discussion. The reason is that they didn't want to have to manage millions of small retirement accounts due to the expected implementation of caps on management fees making them unprofitable to manage because they couldn't get the big fees they wanted to handle them Furthermore the cold fact is that the brokerages and investment banks flat out do not want the small retail investor. The investment adviser I have had for many years recently left the firm he had been with for decades due to the fact that while they would not officially say they didn't want the small retail investor they treated the individual investor in a manner that clearly said "go away , go trade on line and good luck". So my adviser moved to one of the very few remaining firms that gladly welcomes the retail investor. Oh sure, anybody can open an online trading account and you will be most welcome especially welcomed by the short sellers, the option traders, the hedge funds etc.,standing there grinning like possums ready to take your money. Then as many of you have said there are those who want to keep their S.S. contribution but you know as well as I do they will spend it on the next instant gratification that comes along leaving them with nothing to retire on then run to the government for benefits. They want their cake and eat it too.

 

[dmac1]

Riiiiiight. So when the government screws me (either purposely or due to incompetence), my options are:

A) Take it
B) Take it AND like it

If I get screwed elsewhere, I have various avenues for recourse. Social Security? I'd give up 20% of my contributions to date in exchange for the remaining balance to manage on my own. In a New York minute.

When and exactly how did the 'government' screw you? You have likely gotten more in roads, schools, police, security, utilities, etc than you will EVER pay in taxes.

 

[dmac1]

All the more reason not to give the government my money.

I know several places on the planet you can move to where there is no government 'interference' in your life. Move.

 

[TUT]

When and exactly how did the 'government' screw you? You have likely gotten more in roads, schools, police, security, utilities, etc than you will EVER pay in taxes.

It is somewhat amazing how many people take all of that for total granted. That absolutely everything the gov't does is bad and wrong. There is only one party and station that sells this 24/7 to the point people just don't even think deeply anymore and just go right along. Think people.

 

[Brownslave688]

I know several places on the planet you can move to where there is no government 'interference' in your life. Move.

Lmao what a terrible argument. If you'd even call it that.



Growing up I never thought I'd leave this country. Now unless something happens there is the very real possibility I'll take my millions elsewhere when I retire.

 

[Brownslave688]

When and exactly how did the 'government' screw you? You have likely gotten more in roads, schools, police, security, utilities, etc than you will EVER pay in taxes.

He's strictly talking about the Ponzi scheme that is social security.


Just like my pension. I'd be much better off seeing that money come to me.

 

[TUT]

He's strictly talking about the Ponzi scheme that is social security.

Ahh yes labeling everything a pyramid or a ponzi. But what else can you do? You collect a bunch of cash from everyone, then give it out to fewer people at certain point in their lives. In the end if we hold it all together your payout time will come to. Wall Street is the same idea, if everyone took all their money out, the winners would be those out first and the losers would be those who waited too long as all stocks plummet to $0. All that money really isn't there.

My guess is 99.5% of people who talk about leaving the country never do it and for some odd reason most use Canada. Oh... isn't that even more socialistic? And colder? I'd say I'd leave for a tropical island, which in your case you might with the cash you have, just saying in general.

 

[Brownslave688]

Ahh yes labeling everything a pyramid or a ponzi. But what else can you do? You collect a bunch of cash from everyone, then give it out to fewer people at certain point in their lives. In the end if we hold it all together your payout time will come to. Wall Street is the same idea, if everyone took all their money out, the winners would be those out first and the losers would be those who waited too long as all stocks plummet to $0. All that money really isn't there.

My guess is 99.5% of people who talk about leaving the country never do it and for some odd reason most use Canada. Oh... isn't that even more socialistic? And colder? I'd say I'd leave for a tropical island, which in your case you might with the cash you have, just saying in general.

Lol yeah no way I'm going to Canada.


I've considered just living on an all inclusive resort. Fixed costs. Waited on hand and foot. Sounds pretty sweet.


The only reason I say Ponzi scheme is because of the money that was "borrowed" against it. We will never see that money paid back and because of that it is totally dependent on new money coming in.


My wife will max out her SS every year of her career. For what? 30k a year if she's lucky? That's a raw deal no matter how you slice it.

 

[bacha29]

It goes back to what you would need in order to generate 30K per year at 3% annually. That's ONE MILLION DOLLARS in principal that has to be established and never touched throughout the remaining years of a person's life.So Mr. Brownslave how close are you to having that 1 million dollar investment portfolio? The practice of borrowing off the S.S. surplus goes all the way back to the Vietnam War era when it was used to fund the war and has been ongoing ever since. The whole irony of it is that there was found in Kennedy's desk an executive order that would withdraw all U.S. military personnel from Vietnam by the end of 1965 and would have been announced after the 1964 presidential election.

 

[Brownslave688]

It goes back to what you would need in order to generate 30K per year at 3% annually. That's ONE MILLION DOLLARS in principal that has to be established and never touched throughout the remaining years of a person's life.So Mr. Brownslave how close are you to having that 1 million dollar investment portfolio? The practice of borrowing off the S.S. surplus goes all the way back to the Vietnam War era when it was used to fund the war and has been ongoing ever since. The whole irony of it is that there was found in Kennedy's desk an executive order that would withdraw all U.S. military personnel from Vietnam by the end of 1965 and would have been announced after the 1964 presidential election.

Well I've got over 30 years of work left and its already well into 6 figures so like I said I can do better with my money than the government can. We should retire with somewhere between 8-10 million and that doesn't count the land I own that's already worth almost a million dollars.


What ever happened to self responsibility?

 

[Brownslave688]

@bacha29 you are also not taking into account the fact that following the 3% rule you'd have a larg chunk if not all of that million dollars left to pass down to your kids when you die.

 

[TUT]

Well I've got over 30 years of work left and its already well into 6 figures so like I said I can do better with my money than the government can. We should retire with somewhere between 8-10 million and that doesn't count the land I own that's already worth almost a million dollars.


What ever happened to self responsibility?

Right some are better off self investing, but most aren't, self responsibility or not. Private investing would also be susceptible to market crashes. How about not so pessimistic with the peeps and say many will have unfortunate series of events. Because those happen to.

 

[Brownslave688]

Right some are better off self investing, but most aren't, self responsibility or not. Private investing would also be susceptible to market crashes. How about not so pessimistic with the peeps and say many will have unfortunate series of events. Because those happen to.

Here's the way I see it though if the market crashes like total melt down doesn't come back. SS isn't gonna be giving you any money either.


We are gonna be worried about survival not how much retirement income we have. Lol

 

[BigWork13]

It goes back to what you would need in order to generate 30K per year at 3% annually. That's ONE MILLION DOLLARS in principal that has to be established and never touched throughout the remaining years of a person's life.So Mr. Brownslave how close are you to having that 1 million dollar investment portfolio? The practice of borrowing off the S.S. surplus goes all the way back to the Vietnam War era when it was used to fund the war and has been ongoing ever since. The whole irony of it is that there was found in Kennedy's desk an executive order that would withdraw all U.S. military personnel from Vietnam by the end of 1965 and would have been announced after the 1964 presidential election.

1 million at 30k a year is 33 years. You plan on living 33 years longer after you retire? All income tax could be eliminated and we could still have money to pay for roads, schools, police and fire. Just impose a flat tax on all goods purchased. I'm a libertarian, the common sense party that this country needs. I encourage all of you to look towards the libertarian party this year.

 

[59 Dano]

When and exactly how did the 'government' screw you? You have likely gotten more in roads, schools, police, security, utilities, etc than you will EVER pay in taxes.

What an ignorant statement. Half of American filers pay 3% of the income taxes, the other half pays 97%. I'm in the half that pays 97%. Not only am I paying my freight, I'm also paying someone else's.

If you think you're getting a swell return on your taxes, good for you. I'm not.

 

[59 Dano]

Ahh yes labeling everything a pyramid or a ponzi.

That's exactly what Social Security is. Obligations are paid from incoming payments rather than from the growth of the investment. When practiced in the private sector, it's called fraud and you can go to prison for operating such a thing.

 

[59 Dano]

It goes back to what you would need in order to generate 30K per year at 3% annually. That's ONE MILLION DOLLARS in principal that has to be established and never touched throughout the remaining years of a person's life.

Or you can go with $500k at 6% annually, Cramer. You stink as a finance guy.