Global warming poll
- Thread starter over9five
- Start date
wkmac
Well-Known Member
That's not a good thing. IMO one major contributor to increase warming is the amount of land being cleared and concrete poured down on top of it creating a mass thermal heat sink!
Global warning, its a joke. Just another scheme by the democrats to take monies(by taxing) from all us hard working folks and piss it away on all those worthless science projects. Didnt they get enough of that garbage in high school(public, ha). So what if the earth gets 2 degrees warmer in a thousand years. Come on folks, lets not be stuuuuupid(dems). Hey look at the positive that would save on all those home heating bills(thats why I leave both my cars idling all night,to get that whole in the ozone bigger,just kidding), thus there is less consumption of fossil fuels, less bad air to punch a whole in the ozone. These eniromentalist are the biggest hypocrites Ive ever seen. Their so full of it their eyes are brown. I have a few on my route. Driving their little egg shell hybrids, but then living in a 2 story 16 room mansion. Lets walk the talk, let me see you start riding that bicycle, but as for me, I want something under the hood,give me a big V8. ( : (old school,icon)
BCFan
Well-Known Member
Scratch i was wondering if she flew over on a private broomI am sure that man does have a certain amount of impact on our environment. We clear cut forest, like the Amazon, and do add a lot of pollution to the air. But natural disasters like volcanoes and forests fires add a lot of stuff to the atmosphere too. The cow flatulence and waves breaking in the ocean add to the greenhouse effect to a certain extent too, I don't know what we can do about that. And the Earth does spin around the Sun in an orbit that we have no say about. While man does do a lot of damage to our world, Mother Nature has a remarkable ability to repair a lot of it. We shouldn't worry about this though. Our queen, Nancy Pelosi, is now in Europe solving this very problem. I wonder if she flew over there on a private jet since she is so concerned about our environment?
BC
tieguy
Banned
Many prominent scientists also deny the global warming scare is as bad as the doomsayers claim.
Our industry is heavily regulated with all types of emission controls that scientists said would prevent the conditions that cause global warming.
our cars, trucks buses and planes are heavily saddled with emission controls that scientists claimed would prevent the conditions that cause global warming.
we now pay for the privledge of having our emission tested yearly.
We are on a big green kick replanting trees whereever possible.
Build anything and you have all kinds of permits you have to get to ensure you don't do anything that harms the environment.
Despite the many things we do to prevent the global warming already we are led to believe the affects of global warming are accelerating.
But the best of all ironies to me was finding out that the main propenent leading the charge against global warming Al Gore is himself a resource hogging pig. If he ain't too worried about it I guess it ain't that bad.
"But the best of all ironies to me was finding out that the main propenent leading the charge against global warming Al Gore is himself a resource hogging pig. If he ain't too worried about it I guess it ain't that bad."
Yeah, and he invented the internet so its all his fault anyway.
__________________
Yeah, and he invented the internet so its all his fault anyway.
__________________
diesel96
Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by diesel96
Coming from a Californian,I'm sure your familiar with the smog and poor air quality on a bright sunny day in the valley with no wind in highly populated concentrated areas.
Tell us,was that from "Cow Farts" or Car emmissions?
I bet if you drive pass Mira Loma Horse farm your gonna smell Horse crap.And if you drive by a Pig Farm your gonna smell Pig Crap.Denial of Human execeleration of global warming(even a small contribution) will only hurt our future generations.
Typical two-faced Liberal democrat.
toonertoo"But the best of all ironies to me was finding out that the main propenent leading the charge against global warming Al Gore is himself a resource hogging pig. If he ain't too worried about it I guess it ain't that bad."
Yeah, and he invented the internet so its all his fault anyway.
Bad ozone forms near Earth's surface when the ultraviolet light in sunlight triggers a chemical reaction with "precursor pollutants" emitted by cars, power plants, and industrial sources. These precursor pollutants consist of nitrogen oxides (NOx) and volatile organic hydrocarbons (VOC). Ozone near ground level is a harmful pollutant. Ozone levels are carefully monitored during the summer months when the weather conditions are perfect for it to form. Sunshine, hot temperatures, and high emissions of NOx and VOC pollutants lead to high levels of ozone.
An Ozone Action Day is declared when weather conditions are likely to combine with pollution emissions to form high concentrations of ground-level ozone that may cause harmful health effects. People and businesses should take action to reduce emissions of ozone-causing pollutants.
The Environmental Protection Agency uses its Air Quality Index to provide general information to the public about air quality and associated health effects. An Air Quality Index (AQI) of 100 for any pollutant corresponds to the level needed to violate the federal health standard for that pollutant. For ozone, an AQI of 100 corresponds to 0.08 parts per million (ppm) over an 8-hour period -- the current federal standard. Over half of the U.S. population lives in areas where the AQI exceeds 100 and violates the federal health standard at least once per year. Some metropolitan cities have severe air pollution problems, and can see ozone AQI values in the 200s or even 300s.
Earth's Protection Shield is Being Destroyed -
Ozone Depletion and Global Warming
https://web.archive.org/web/2010031...e.com/news/global-warming/ozone-depletion.asp
Let's stay focused on a solution,instead of denial and resorting to name calling.This should'nt be political,unless some have to be told how to think and respond to justify and solidify their side of the political spectrum.Would you feel more secure if more Republicans/Conservatives go on record and lobby for more reduction in pollution emissions and solutions for more Earth friendly human consumption?
Can you look your children/grandchildren in the eyes and tell them with a straight face and say "I supported legislation to leave you a clean Earth".
Ask yourselves,do I align myself with my political party and remain selfish or do I DO THE RIGHT THING.
Coming from a Californian,I'm sure your familiar with the smog and poor air quality on a bright sunny day in the valley with no wind in highly populated concentrated areas.
Tell us,was that from "Cow Farts" or Car emmissions?
I bet if you drive pass Mira Loma Horse farm your gonna smell Horse crap.And if you drive by a Pig Farm your gonna smell Pig Crap.Denial of Human execeleration of global warming(even a small contribution) will only hurt our future generations.
over9five"...Al Gore is himself a resource hogging pig."
Typical two-faced Liberal democrat.
toonertoo"But the best of all ironies to me was finding out that the main propenent leading the charge against global warming Al Gore is himself a resource hogging pig. If he ain't too worried about it I guess it ain't that bad."
Yeah, and he invented the internet so its all his fault anyway.
Bad ozone forms near Earth's surface when the ultraviolet light in sunlight triggers a chemical reaction with "precursor pollutants" emitted by cars, power plants, and industrial sources. These precursor pollutants consist of nitrogen oxides (NOx) and volatile organic hydrocarbons (VOC). Ozone near ground level is a harmful pollutant. Ozone levels are carefully monitored during the summer months when the weather conditions are perfect for it to form. Sunshine, hot temperatures, and high emissions of NOx and VOC pollutants lead to high levels of ozone.
An Ozone Action Day is declared when weather conditions are likely to combine with pollution emissions to form high concentrations of ground-level ozone that may cause harmful health effects. People and businesses should take action to reduce emissions of ozone-causing pollutants.
The Environmental Protection Agency uses its Air Quality Index to provide general information to the public about air quality and associated health effects. An Air Quality Index (AQI) of 100 for any pollutant corresponds to the level needed to violate the federal health standard for that pollutant. For ozone, an AQI of 100 corresponds to 0.08 parts per million (ppm) over an 8-hour period -- the current federal standard. Over half of the U.S. population lives in areas where the AQI exceeds 100 and violates the federal health standard at least once per year. Some metropolitan cities have severe air pollution problems, and can see ozone AQI values in the 200s or even 300s.
Earth's Protection Shield is Being Destroyed -
Ozone Depletion and Global Warming
https://web.archive.org/web/2010031...e.com/news/global-warming/ozone-depletion.asp
Let's stay focused on a solution,instead of denial and resorting to name calling.This should'nt be political,unless some have to be told how to think and respond to justify and solidify their side of the political spectrum.Would you feel more secure if more Republicans/Conservatives go on record and lobby for more reduction in pollution emissions and solutions for more Earth friendly human consumption?
Can you look your children/grandchildren in the eyes and tell them with a straight face and say "I supported legislation to leave you a clean Earth".
Ask yourselves,do I align myself with my political party and remain selfish or do I DO THE RIGHT THING.
brazenbrown
Well-Known Member
"But the best of all ironies to me was finding out that the main propenent leading the charge against global warming Al Gore is himself a resource hogging pig. If he ain't too worried about it I guess it ain't that bad."
Yeah, and he invented the internet so its all his fault anyway.
__________________
A pig on the net... Good one tooner!!
brazenbrown
Well-Known Member
You quoted Tie's post maybe you should read it again. Pretty much sums up many of the things we are already doing and and we will continue to do more.
Do you think exaggerating and scaring your children with the likes of Al Gore horror stories who he himself doesn't even take seriously as shown by his lead by example, I'm a hypocrite with an astronomical energy bill attitude is going to help your children??
It's an example of, do as I say not as I do.Just curious how will you look your children in the eyes with a straight face because you selfishly bought into these scare tactics??
And in a few years when all the Global Warming hype is gone and junior is asking... when are we gona die daddy, what will you tell him??
I'll be able to look my child or grandchildren in the eyes knowing we're doing a lot to help with keeping the earth clean and we will continue to do so, personally I'm all for it. However, I don't think what political party we are or that we don't entirely buy into everything Al Gore says has any justification for your guilt ridden nonsense.
Just trying to do the right thing!
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diesel96
Well-Known Member
You quoted Tie's post maybe you should read it again. Pretty much sums up many of the things we are already doing and and we will continue to do more.
Do you think exaggerating and scaring your children with the likes of Al Gore horror stories who he himself doesn't even take seriously as shown by his lead by example, I'm a hypocrite with an astronomical energy bill attitude is going to help your children??
"A part of the Gore's family response is that they purchase all of the power for their...
Belle Meade home through the local Green Powerswitch Program.
The Green Power Switch is a NES program that allows its customers to buy power that is generated from clean, renewable resources.
Green power sources are primarily wind, solar and methane gas.
NES gathers its green power from the Tennessee Valley Authority.
The TVA runs several facilities across the state to make green power.
Wind power comes from a modern day windmill plant on Buffalo Mountain near Oak Ridge.
The TVA has 16 sites that gather solarpower.
The sites include the Adventure Science Center in Nashville, Dollywood in east Tennessee, and as far away as the University of Mississippi in Oxford.
Solar power is generated from photovoltaic panels that convert the sun's energy to electricity.
Energy from methane gas is provided by the city of Memphis wastewater treatment facility, which produces a methane by-product that is co-fired with coal. "
"Regardless of what Al Gore preaches about these matters, the way he lives strikes me as reasonable. He was of the manor born, to be sure, but he has earned a lot of money on his own. He has every right to a ginormous house, a fleet of cars, and to be flown around the world in private planes to speak out against the dangers of global warming. While it's funny in microcosm, it strikes me as a perfectly defensible trade-off to use a thousand times more energy than the average guy in an effort to influence macro-level energy and environmental policy. " End quote
Just curious how will you look your children in the eyes with a straight face because you selfishly bought into these scare tactics??What's so selfish about supporting a cleaner Earth?I'll look into their eyes with a clear conscience,how 'bout you?
And in a few years when all the Global Warming hype is gone Global Warmimg hype gone?yeah,let's do nothing,maybe it will all go away.Emission control,permits,etc...are'nt the answer.Alternative fuels ,bio-diesels,wind,solar etc..are.
Dependencey on Middle East oil,growing economys in China,India...hype isn't going anywhere.
and junior is asking... when are we gonna die daddy, what will you tell him??I'm gonna tell them Brazonbrown and his politically motivated friends said Global Warming was just hype.Then Junior is gonna ask "Can I go out and play?"...No junior,the air quality index is 300 today.
I'll be able to look my child or grandchildren in the eyes knowing we're doing a lot to help with keeping the earth clean
Don't forget to wear your ultra violet-gamma ray sunglasses and breathing filters when you look into their eyes.
Just trying to do the right thing!
brazenbrown
Well-Known Member
diesel,
"Tie's statement sounds like it's an inconvienance and a drag that emission controls,permits,replanting are implemented because we are "led to believe of Global Warming"
No matter how it sounds we've been doing many things for many years to reduce Man's effect on polluting our planet even way before the hyped-up Global Warming scare became popular..
Just look at one Company alone and some of their efforts, UPS.
PAS and the right hand turn..
The rule leads to a small reduction in fuel consumption per vehicle, but adds up when multiplied by 88,000 UPS vehicles. The combination of tracking technology and a right-turn only policy helped UPS save 3 million gallons of fuel and over 28 million miles in 2006, according to ABC News.
Not only is UPS saving money just imagine the effects of not burning 3million gallons of fuel.
These next two would be alternatives to fuel.
Hybrid electric trucks
UPS announced in May the addition of 50 hybrid electric delivery trucks to routes in four cities. The new trucks are expected to reduce fuel consumption by as much as 44,000 gallons a year and annual carbon dioxide emissions by 457 metric tons when compared with diesel-only
trucks, according to UPS.
Fuel cell powered vehicles
The company recently announced it is collaborating with DaimlerChrysler (NYSE: DCX) and the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency to add fuel cell-powered vehicles to its fleet.
These are only a few examples where UPS is making their contributions..
I guess it doesn't amount to much though!!
"The EPA and Air Quality Index ratings are an exaggerated ?Cities declaring Ozone action Day a scare tactic?Maybe YOU need to read my post again pertaining to Ozone Health warnings.As far as Gore's energy bill:"
Trends in Air quality AMERICAN LUNG ASSOCIATION
BEST PRACTICES AND PROGRAM SERVICES
JULY 2002
Summary
The Clean Air Act, regulated by EPA, sets standards to safeguard the public against the most common and damaging outdoor air pollutants. Those pollutants include ozone, particulate matter, nitrogen dioxide, carbon monoxide, sulfur dioxide and lead. Over the past 20 years, air quality levels for all six pollutants have improved and the emissions of each pollutant have decreased, with the exception of nitrogen oxide. However, over 160 million tons of air pollution was released into the air in 2000 and approximately 121 million people still live in counties that did not meet the primary standard for at least one of the criteria pollutants.
Indoor air pollution comes from a variety of sources including radon and environmental tobacco smoke. Like outdoor air pollution, indoor pollution can have detrimental effects on an individual’s health. People spend as much as 90% of their time indoors and studies have shown that indoor air levels of many pollutants may be 2-5 times higher than outdoor levels. Because indoor air pollution is not regulated, reduction of exposure is accomplished by removal of sources by building occupants.
Global Warming Hype
"What's so selfish about supporting a cleaner Earth?I'll look into their eyes with a clear conscience,how 'bout you?"
Nothing is selfish about supporting a cleaner earth. In fact if you had used my whole quote the very next thing I say is that I'm personally all for it. Your conscience will be clear in your eyes; I guess that's all that matters.
"Global Warmimg hype gone?yeah,let's do nothing,maybe it will all go away.Emission control,permits,etc...are'nt the answer.Alternative fuels ,bio-diesels,wind,solar etc..are.
Dependencey on Middle East oil,growing economys in China,India...hype isn't going anywhere."
Alternative ways are great!! It's the wrongly justified Global Warming hype you're spewing that's not.
"I'm gonna tell them Brazonbrown and his politically motivated friends said Global Warming was just hype.Then Junior is gonna ask "Can I go out and play?"...No junior,the air quality index is 300 today"
Has nothing to do with being politically motivated. It has to do with being misinformed and getting caught up in the nonsense. You see, I'm not against alternative fuels and finding new resources to make a better future. In fact it breeds an entrepreneurship and the possibilities for new discoveries we may not have made if we weren't looking.
Yeah, junior can stay indoors (referring to article above) where often times the indoor pollution is much worse than outdoors. Maybe he'll thank you later for being so well informed..
"Don't forget to wear your ultra violet-gamma ray sunglasses and breathing filters when you look into their eyes."
See what I'm talking about..You just keep on with that doomsday, environmentalist wacko hype.. I'm used to how the debate goes from your blinded point of view.
Keep on breathing!!
"Tie's statement sounds like it's an inconvienance and a drag that emission controls,permits,replanting are implemented because we are "led to believe of Global Warming"
No matter how it sounds we've been doing many things for many years to reduce Man's effect on polluting our planet even way before the hyped-up Global Warming scare became popular..
Just look at one Company alone and some of their efforts, UPS.
PAS and the right hand turn..
The rule leads to a small reduction in fuel consumption per vehicle, but adds up when multiplied by 88,000 UPS vehicles. The combination of tracking technology and a right-turn only policy helped UPS save 3 million gallons of fuel and over 28 million miles in 2006, according to ABC News.
Not only is UPS saving money just imagine the effects of not burning 3million gallons of fuel.
These next two would be alternatives to fuel.
Hybrid electric trucks
UPS announced in May the addition of 50 hybrid electric delivery trucks to routes in four cities. The new trucks are expected to reduce fuel consumption by as much as 44,000 gallons a year and annual carbon dioxide emissions by 457 metric tons when compared with diesel-only
trucks, according to UPS.
Fuel cell powered vehicles
The company recently announced it is collaborating with DaimlerChrysler (NYSE: DCX) and the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency to add fuel cell-powered vehicles to its fleet.
These are only a few examples where UPS is making their contributions..
I guess it doesn't amount to much though!!
"The EPA and Air Quality Index ratings are an exaggerated ?Cities declaring Ozone action Day a scare tactic?Maybe YOU need to read my post again pertaining to Ozone Health warnings.As far as Gore's energy bill:"
Trends in Air quality AMERICAN LUNG ASSOCIATION
BEST PRACTICES AND PROGRAM SERVICES
JULY 2002
Summary
The Clean Air Act, regulated by EPA, sets standards to safeguard the public against the most common and damaging outdoor air pollutants. Those pollutants include ozone, particulate matter, nitrogen dioxide, carbon monoxide, sulfur dioxide and lead. Over the past 20 years, air quality levels for all six pollutants have improved and the emissions of each pollutant have decreased, with the exception of nitrogen oxide. However, over 160 million tons of air pollution was released into the air in 2000 and approximately 121 million people still live in counties that did not meet the primary standard for at least one of the criteria pollutants.
Indoor air pollution comes from a variety of sources including radon and environmental tobacco smoke. Like outdoor air pollution, indoor pollution can have detrimental effects on an individual’s health. People spend as much as 90% of their time indoors and studies have shown that indoor air levels of many pollutants may be 2-5 times higher than outdoor levels. Because indoor air pollution is not regulated, reduction of exposure is accomplished by removal of sources by building occupants.
Global Warming Hype
"What's so selfish about supporting a cleaner Earth?I'll look into their eyes with a clear conscience,how 'bout you?"
Nothing is selfish about supporting a cleaner earth. In fact if you had used my whole quote the very next thing I say is that I'm personally all for it.
Your conscience will be clear in your eyes; I guess that's all that matters."Global Warmimg hype gone?yeah,let's do nothing,maybe it will all go away.Emission control,permits,etc...are'nt the answer.Alternative fuels ,bio-diesels,wind,solar etc..are.
Dependencey on Middle East oil,growing economys in China,India...hype isn't going anywhere."
Alternative ways are great!!
It's the wrongly justified Global Warming hype you're spewing that's not."I'm gonna tell them Brazonbrown and his politically motivated friends said Global Warming was just hype.Then Junior is gonna ask "Can I go out and play?"...No junior,the air quality index is 300 today"
Has nothing to do with being politically motivated. It has to do with being misinformed and getting caught up in the nonsense. You see, I'm not against alternative fuels and finding new resources to make a better future. In fact it breeds an entrepreneurship and the possibilities for new discoveries we may not have made if we weren't looking.
Yeah, junior can stay indoors (referring to article above) where often times the indoor pollution is much worse than outdoors. Maybe he'll thank you later for being so well informed..
"Don't forget to wear your ultra violet-gamma ray sunglasses and breathing filters when you look into their eyes."
See what I'm talking about..You just keep on with that doomsday, environmentalist wacko hype.. I'm used to how the debate goes from your blinded point of view.
Keep on breathing!!
wkmac
Well-Known Member
https://web.archive.org/web/20060314035445/http://www.greenspirit.com/logbook.cfm?msid=70
Comments to the US Congress 2 years ago by Dr. Patrick Moore who is head of Greenspirit and founder and former member of Greenpeace. His words are a growing voice among the environmental movement that has accepted a more pragmatic approach to the situation.
Comments to the US Congress 2 years ago by Dr. Patrick Moore who is head of Greenspirit and founder and former member of Greenpeace. His words are a growing voice among the environmental movement that has accepted a more pragmatic approach to the situation.
brazenbrown
Well-Known Member
Sammie
Well-Known Member
It has to be you and me!! A day doesn't go by that we don't receive an education about how we’re all ego, we’re spoiled, entitled, selfish and warped by luxury…) So…. Whatda we do?
Cars. The non green vehicles and SUV’s have to go. Spend 32 grand on a Prius that cost 5 grand to produce, or lease the new Lexus 450GS sedan for 1200 bucks a month.
But… what if a Prius really is harder on the environment than a Hummer?
http://www.ncsu.edu/iei/io/2007/03/is_a_prius_worse_for_the_envir.html
Light bulbs. We’re supposed to change our light bulbs to the compact flourscent ones, even though they contain mercury…
Energy. How about wind farms? But no, they kill birds…
Go easy on the H20. Stop buying bottled water for crying out loud. There’s nothing wrong with what comes out of your tap. How much co2 is produced carting this stuff around in trucks?
I tried living without the dishwasher for a day, naahhh…
Gasoline (I). Buy straight vegetable oil -- some restaurants will even give it and a conversion kit. Have a mechanic look over your shoulder on this one, though…
Gasoline (II). Do road construction at night. (Cooler for the workers and no bumper to bumper traffic for commuters)
But one of the real pissers IMO ….(sorry, not very lady like here…)
I have friends in the army who’ve been stationed in Germany twice now. According to them, once a European autobahn is built, it lasts for 50 years.
That makes us look like crap!! What’s up with our road crews repairing the same road every summer? Ah HAH!! Contractors like using shoddy materials to build highways because the roads that fall apart keep them busy!
With 4 million miles of roads and highways in this country, how much asphalt (petroleum) are we talking here for their never ending repairs and maintainence? State and local governments award competitive contracts to the lowest bidder, meaning they get the shoddiest materials and the sloppiest work.
My brother in law is an engineer and was an inspector at the Denver International Airport when it was built about a decade ago. The same applies even to airports - State and local governments award competitive contracts to the lowest bidder, meaning they get the shoddiest materials and the sloppiest work.
But you and I as individuals are the ones who are told to suck it up…
1
Raw
Raw Member
Al Gore or as Rush Limbaugh calls him, Algore such as Igor, Dr Frankensteins assistant!
diesel96
Well-Known Member
Cars. The non green vehicles and SUV’s have to go. Spend 32 grand on a Prius that cost 5 grand to produce, or lease the new Lexus 450GS sedan for 1200 bucks a month.
But… what if a Prius really is harder on the environment than a Hummer?
http://www.ncsu.edu/iei/io/2007/03/is_a_prius_worse_for_the_envir.html
Your article does point out in the long run Hybrids are more practical once production costs level out.
Does a Hummer use less energy to produce and drive than a hybrid compact car? Well, maybe they do today because of the huge upfront capital investments and R&D required to develop an entirely new product, such as the hybrid vehicle. But, in three years or so, when these costs of producing hybrids have been amortized over time and when the production of these cars becomes more efficient, the investment will pay off. Skeptics of hybrids won’t be chuckling for long.
Light bulbs. We’re supposed to change our light bulbs to the compact flourscent ones, even though they contain mercury…
If ever If every American home replaced their 5 most frequently used light fixtures or the bulbs in them with ones that have earned the ENERGY STAR, we would save close to $8 billion each year in energy costs, and together we would prevent the greenhouse gases equivalent to the emissions from nearly 10 million cars. (from the Energy Star program)
Put a CFL in place of a 60W incandescent bulb and you will save $30 over the life of the bulb.
According to a recent report by the Washington, D.C.-based Earth Policy Institute, a worldwide shift to CFLs would permit the closing of more than 270 coal-fired power plants. Switching to CFLs in the U.S. alone could save the energy output of 80 plants. For environmentalists, the clincher is that by requiring less energy, CFLs will actually cut down on mercury pollution produced by coal burning, and EPA agrees.
Recycling opportunities, however, should soon be increasing as CFLs become established as mainstream household lighting. Retailers such as Ikea have store-based collection centers for used bulbs, and a similar program is being developed by Home Depot in Canada. "Recycling programs are already in place in many areas," noted mercury clean-up expert Hogue. "Community leaders don't need to reinvent the wheel."
Energy. How about wind farms? But no, they kill birds…
Indeed wind turbines can kill birds.
The national average would suggest annual deaths of birds of all species, an infinitesimal fraction of the total number traversing these regions.
There is clearly a trade-off here but I believe that a cost-benefit analysis comes down on the side of the wind turbines. I join my birding colleagues in their concern for the death or injury of any bird, but I suggest that wind turbines represent the least of their worries. For example, a single feral cat kills more birds in a week than the average wind turbine kills in over three years.-
Go easy on the H20. Stop buying bottled water for crying out loud. There’s nothing wrong with what comes out of your tap. How much co2 is produced carting this stuff around in trucks?
"Bottled water is produced and regulated exclusively for human consumption," "Some people in their municipal markets have the luxury of good water. Others do not."
All goods are trucked,however home delivery is a little lazy unless it's the 5 gallon jugs.Too heavy for some people.
Your post reguarding poor road const.,lowest bidder,shoddy materials, is very true...can't argue with that.
wkmac
Well-Known Member
Comparing Hummer to Hybrid production and the associated energy costs is valid just as in the future once the Hybrid as production goes is fully established will IMO more than by-pass the Hummer as that argument goes. I've got nothing against the Hummer as they are awesome vehicles and our family happens to own a 3/4 ton SUV 4 wheel drive so I'm right there with it as far as that goes.
I do think the Hybrid as this point shows the most promise for at least the short term and I doubt anyone here would shed a tear if we were able to walk away totally from Mid-East Oil once and for all. Fossil fuel's present situation in our society at this point has a lot of negatives attached to it, some very real and proven and others open to debate but one thing is for sure, a lot of different people from various opinions would love to see alternatives that would change the dynamics on many fronts.
As for production costs being energy consuptive, yes that's true and has always been true but let's look back. Instead of going forward, our modern mode of transport has become a huge energy consumer and a source of pollution to varying degrees so in that respect instead of going forward, let's go backward to the horse and buggy. Consider the various costs if we decided today to return to that route. For the wood alone to build the buggies we'd strip what forests we have left in America and where would we keep all the horses we would need? Not to mention where would we get the foodstock to feed them and what would that cost to produce. The treehuggers talk about cow gas so could you imagine instead of 2 car families, 2 horse families and the added gas to the environment. While we're at it, get rid of heating oil and natural gas and return to heating with wood. For those of us who had days of smoke from the recent forest fires, imagine that day in and day out just from everyone burning wood to cook and heat!
Change always costs more upfront but those costs generally become of lesser importance as you get down the road and as better efficencies come into play.
As for the light bulb, whether true or not can't say but once heard that if every light in America went to Flourescent that it would save enough energy to totally shutdown 4 coal powered electricity plants. As the LED light further develops the savings is even greater and the longevity of the lamp also increases as well. Should we stop with this as I'm sure new production with have it's added costs even with energy or should we play this out in the hopes that as consumers we save on lamp and energy costs and the potential that with it less pollution from non-green energy souces?
A lot of environmentalist like Dr. Patrick Moore has come halfway so should we stand there with folded arms stomping our feet like "Spoiled Brats" or do we walk up to them and hear them out because at the same time, they are willing to listen to us and to agree that pragmatic, not dictatorial steps, can be taken together is which we lessen and maybe even totally cut the need for MidEast oil which would cuts the funds from many of the very terror groups we currently find ourselves locked in battle with and we snatch the wind right out from Al Gore's sails making him the meaningless politician that he really is and he will fall from the stage and in time become the answer to the Milloin dollar question on a gameshow when the show wants to save the money!
It's amazing to me that anyone would fight such a condition but then again we're human and one of our crowning achievements of our success in the 21st century is none other than Paris Hilton, Lindsey Lohan and Britney Spears. Those 3 right there have been the best recruiting tools for those who do hate our country.
Be Proud America, Be Proud!
I do think the Hybrid as this point shows the most promise for at least the short term and I doubt anyone here would shed a tear if we were able to walk away totally from Mid-East Oil once and for all. Fossil fuel's present situation in our society at this point has a lot of negatives attached to it, some very real and proven and others open to debate but one thing is for sure, a lot of different people from various opinions would love to see alternatives that would change the dynamics on many fronts.
As for production costs being energy consuptive, yes that's true and has always been true but let's look back. Instead of going forward, our modern mode of transport has become a huge energy consumer and a source of pollution to varying degrees so in that respect instead of going forward, let's go backward to the horse and buggy. Consider the various costs if we decided today to return to that route. For the wood alone to build the buggies we'd strip what forests we have left in America and where would we keep all the horses we would need? Not to mention where would we get the foodstock to feed them and what would that cost to produce. The treehuggers talk about cow gas so could you imagine instead of 2 car families, 2 horse families and the added gas to the environment. While we're at it, get rid of heating oil and natural gas and return to heating with wood. For those of us who had days of smoke from the recent forest fires, imagine that day in and day out just from everyone burning wood to cook and heat!
Change always costs more upfront but those costs generally become of lesser importance as you get down the road and as better efficencies come into play.
As for the light bulb, whether true or not can't say but once heard that if every light in America went to Flourescent that it would save enough energy to totally shutdown 4 coal powered electricity plants. As the LED light further develops the savings is even greater and the longevity of the lamp also increases as well. Should we stop with this as I'm sure new production with have it's added costs even with energy or should we play this out in the hopes that as consumers we save on lamp and energy costs and the potential that with it less pollution from non-green energy souces?
A lot of environmentalist like Dr. Patrick Moore has come halfway so should we stand there with folded arms stomping our feet like "Spoiled Brats" or do we walk up to them and hear them out because at the same time, they are willing to listen to us and to agree that pragmatic, not dictatorial steps, can be taken together is which we lessen and maybe even totally cut the need for MidEast oil which would cuts the funds from many of the very terror groups we currently find ourselves locked in battle with and we snatch the wind right out from Al Gore's sails making him the meaningless politician that he really is and he will fall from the stage and in time become the answer to the Milloin dollar question on a gameshow when the show wants to save the money!
It's amazing to me that anyone would fight such a condition but then again we're human and one of our crowning achievements of our success in the 21st century is none other than Paris Hilton, Lindsey Lohan and Britney Spears. Those 3 right there have been the best recruiting tools for those who do hate our country.
Be Proud America, Be Proud!
