Poll: APWA-Support or Oppose

[govols019]

Uhhh...single employer pensions don't exactly have an outstanding track record.

 

[govols019]

Our local might as well be for Yellow Freight employees only. I know people from our building and a few from two other hubs that went to the hall to put in their paperwork to get out of the IBT and they were all harassed by Yellow freight guys and maybe one UPSer. It's bad enough we all have to share our pension and dues with them and apprently we can't even withdrawl from the union without going through them as well.

And exactly how would you like people to react to a member withdrawing from the Union? Cupcakes and flowers?

 

[705red]

Uhhh...single employer pensions don't exactly have an outstanding track record.

The company alwasys discloses everything regarding it to, NOT. Call and ask about your ptime pension and see what response you will get. They dodge the questions as much as the apwa does.

 

[tieguy]

Tie did you get a call from eskew to come bash the apwa to cover up his involment with them?

Actually 705 I asked you a question on why you thought the company should be involved in this issue. Have not bashed APWA nor the teamsters. This is a good debate you guys need to have though it looks like most of the dialogue is pretty much bashing each other. You know there are a lot of UPSers out there who are looking at collecting a pretty crappy pension due to the problems these plans are having. I really don't think you do the discussion any good when you try to throw the company conspiracy with APWA in the debate simply to muddy the waters. What do you think?

 

[Overpaid Union Thug]

And exactly how would you like people to react to a member withdrawing from the Union? Cupcakes and flowers?

So verbal abuse for withdrawling is ok? That is typical Union Thug thinking. That is so counter productive. If a guy comes in and wants to get out you'd think the guys at the Union Hall would try and talk him out of it. But instead they make him want to get out even more by using union thug tactics. I'm don't claim to know everything but I do know that that kind of tactic doesn't have a chance in hell at convincing someone that they should stay in.

 

[Cole]

Please answer us how the mechanics get such a far superior pension than us in the Teamsters? Those under the machinists union get the same contributions, but get far better than us. If it's such an impossibility please explain?

 

[tieguy]

Please answer us how the mechanics get such a far superior pension than us in the Teamsters? Those under the machinists union get the same contributions, but get far better than us. If it's such an impossibility please explain?

Mechanics plan is private and its much better.

The other side of this that is often ignored is the insurance of the plans. If another poster here is correct and CS is 46 percent vested then its in serious danger of collapse. The insurance payout for a private plan is about 4 times greater then the payout for a multi-employer plan.

If the teamsters were smart they would move to privitization and squash the APWA threat.

 

[satellitedriver]

Mechanics plan is private and its much better.

The other side of this that is often ignored is the insurance of the plans. If another poster here is correct and CS is 46 percent vested then its in serious danger of collapse. The insurance payout for a private plan is about 4 times greater then the payout for a multi-employer plan.

If the teamsters were smart they would move to privitization and squash the APWA threat.

If the teamsters were smart, we would not be having this debate.

 

[705red]

If the teamsters were smart, we would not be having this debate.

At least not with you, they wouldnt let you do this job without a union card!

 

[705red]

Actually 705 I asked you a question on why you thought the company should be involved in this issue. Have not bashed APWA nor the teamsters. This is a good debate you guys need to have though it looks like most of the dialogue is pretty much bashing each other. You know there are a lot of UPSers out there who are looking at collecting a pretty crappy pension due to the problems these plans are having. I really don't think you do the discussion any good when you try to throw the company conspiracy with APWA in the debate simply to muddy the waters. What do you think?

Tie the apwa are using ups's attorneys, and its weird usually you find a sup with an opinion one way or the other but not here. Theres alot of name calling because they cant or wont answer the questions, they just spew lies! I would much rather debate the issues, because no matter what happens after this we will all be brothers again.

 

[govols019]

So verbal abuse for withdrawling is ok? That is typical Union Thug thinking. That is so counter productive. If a guy comes in and wants to get out you'd think the guys at the Union Hall would try and talk him out of it. But instead they make him want to get out even more by using union thug tactics. I'm don't claim to know everything but I do know that that kind of tactic doesn't have a chance in hell at convincing someone that they should stay in.

Common sense tells me that if I withdraw from the Union to expect a certain amount flak from the people I'm turning my back on.

I have no problem with people withdrawing. I do have a problem with people that do and then expect the very Union they walked away from to be there for them when the company screws them over.

 

[Overpaid Union Thug]

Common sense tells me that if I withdraw from the Union to expect a certain amount flak from the people I'm turning my back on.

I have no problem with people withdrawing. I do have a problem with people that do and then expect the very Union they walked away from to be there for them when the company screws them over.

These people I know didn't do anything to deserve the harassment they recieved from those @##holes at the Union Hall. They didn't deserve the "flak" the recieved. In fact, part of the reason why they got out was because they felt the IBT had turned their backs on them. All they did was tell the receptionist that they were interested in getting out and did so without cussing or making a scene. Within seconds they were being cussed by Yellow Freight guys and in one case a UPS person was there. They didn't all go down there together. This was several seperate incidents.

And like it or not the union is still required to represent them to the fullest. It is the law. So yes....they can expect the union to be there for them when the company screws them over. I doubt they'll come to bat for them 100% since they are non dues paying employees. But then again...some around here would say that would be the case even if they were members. I can't say I exactly agree with getting out because as much as I don't like the IBT I don't plan to get out because I don't like the concept of being a freeloader. At the most I'd go on the reduced dues plan. If that. But whether or not those guys deserve to be represented to the fullest is not up to us. The law says they are to be represented. That's how it should be wether you or I like it or not. We expect the company to abide by the contract, which is technically a book of laws, so why would we not expect the union to abide by laws as well? That's how I see it.

 

[tieguy]

Common sense tells me that if I withdraw from the Union to expect a certain amount flak from the people I'm turning my back on.

I have no problem with people withdrawing. I do have a problem with people that do and then expect the very Union they walked away from to be there for them when the company screws them over.

If they withdraw is it a complete withdrawl or are they still expected to pay the union a lesser amount?

 

[Cole]

Honestly as fas as withdrawing, you are then getting the benefits of the union without paying, so sure they're not going to be happy about that, and understandably so. Granted if the union is doing it's job the occurances will be minimal.

In our building we have gotten a non-union person their job back about 3 or 4 times and they still haven't joined the union, now to me that's plain wrong.

They don't pay the union squat, but they have to represent them, so it's a complete withdrawal in most cases. The union doesn't have to file their insurance papers etc...

 

[krash]

Honestly as fas as withdrawing, you are then getting the benefits of the union without paying, so sure they're not going to be happy about that, and understandably so. Granted if the union is doing it's job the occurances will be minimal.

In our building we have gotten a non-union person their job back about 3 or 4 times and they still haven't joined the union, now to me that's plain wrong.

They don't pay the union squat, but they have to represent them, so it's a complete withdrawal in most cases. The union doesn't have to file their insurance papers etc...

Cole,
I've seen a driver at another bldg who has gotten his job back a couple of times(via the Union) who will be the first to bash the union saying, "Theyve never dun nut'n fer me, Doh!" I believe he is a APWA charter member also

 

[Overpaid Union Thug]

If they withdraw is it a complete withdrawl or are they still expected to pay the union a lesser amount?

Here you can do a complete withdrawl or stay in on a lesser amount. I believe that goes for any state. Not just "right to work" states.

 

[badpas]

I can assure you that its the same in the southwest corner of ohio. I've even heard, from friends at other centers, a high majority signing without even having a meeting with any apwa officials. Believe what you want but the ball is off and rolling by people who want to take charge in changing their futures. Remember we have options with the apwa, we have only uncertainty with the ibt. Untested, unproved, call it what you want, if we get one thing and that is 100% of our retirement invested then we've already won.

 

[badpas]

705 its THEIR money and they've earned every dime.They should be able to do whatever, whenever, whyever they want because no matter if you are in the teamsters or not the company pays the individual that works at UPS not the ibt. This is a common mistake by all who think the teamsters have gotten us everything. Its quite the other way around. WE HAVE EARNED IT FOR THE TEAMSTERS, ITS BEEN OUR BLOOD, SWEAT AND TEARS THAT GOT US WHAT WE HAVE TODAY!!!!!!