Thread Themes

[satellitedriver]

I joined this site in December 2006 and the recurring theme is many threads are:

1. Hourly vs. management
2. Hourly vs. Teamsters
3. Teamsters vs APWA
4. Management vs.hourly
5. Disrespect for others opinions/disagreements

On the other hand, there are some intelligent people that post information that is useful, fun to read and amusing.

I would think all of us have enough stress working, why bring it to the board?.

I learn more from critisisim(sp)about my views than I gain from attaboy's. They make me think about my own position from a different perspective.
I say bring the (negative) viewpoint you have to this board and learn from the response you get.
Maybe I should just light a candle and sing Kumbaya.

 

[canon]

Is it me or does it seem like management is not really welcome here? I get that feeling. If so then maybe someone should create another similar site for management.


Guess what folks...there are some serious winds floating around the company that could have LOTS of people up and down the company having strong opinions in the near future.


UPS is in big trouble, the ship has hit an iceberg, and the band is still playing.

Seems like it would be nice to have a place where everyone is welcome without having to deal with the negativity. I can tell you that just about everyone I know in mgmt regularly visits this site and reads, but most just consider it a "union member" site due to many comments they read here.

It only seems like a union site because mgmt refuses to admit there's a problem at all and chooses to remain silent or advocates "making the best of it". We see the problems and discuss them. Mgmt sees our discussion of topics like this to be "anti-company".

It really isn't helpful to come in here with rose colored glasses and pretend we're flawless. The drivers aren't in a position to fix things, and mgmt isn't allowed to admit there's a problem. So if there's an ounce of truth in your post, the very last thing we should do is continue to hide the problems in the shadows. That's how we arrived at the situation you described.

And for anyone reading this who is "afraid" to speak up, come in without the Us vs Them attitude and leave the insults at the door. I'd love just once for someone in mgmt to stand up and address an issue without dismissing it as mere whining when they know for fact it's a problem. PAS remains broke in centers where covering up the problems is easier than fixing it, fudging numbers is commonplace to stay off the corporate blotter, nobody wants to be a pt supe because they are treated like crap in too many centers, and rocking the boat to get things fixed is a sure-fire way to get blacklisted.

I think the biggest issue for everyone involved is that we're all disposable. UPS pays well, and allows people to earn money they'd never be able to make outside the company without a degree. The provide the label of "leader", then hand you the script you have to follow.

I've seen real leaders before, they're in command of our troops. You establish a mission, then allow the leaders to accomplish the goals using the training they've received without dangling discipline out there for what should be a force improving learning experience. What I see now amounts to the comparison of a talented painter vs someone who is painting by numbers.

The difference in center performance is limited to nothing more than one managers abilities in motivational speaking. Those that aren't so good rely on discipline and scare tactics. It's not a slam against mgmt, quite the opposite. It's my confidence in the people I report to that aren't allowed to deviate from a blanket policy that too often suffocates instead of protects. I have confidence that if allowed to, those entrusted to the positions of ctr mgrs and driver supes could "win the war" all by themselves. Maybe that's why they aren't allowed to. If they ever became "valuable", they would then be in a position to ask for more money to keep them from leaving. Or ask for the job of one of the people who don't want them to be valuable.

Just my opinion... almost all responses are welcome. Don't be shy.

 

[j13501]

"...a trend in the negativity department lately,"

Do you think it's because there's sooooo many members now? I'm NOT saying that's a bad thing. 249 member visits in the last 24 hours. A year ago there would be less than half that.

BrownCafe has grown big-time.

Over9.5 is 100% correct IMO. This web site becomes more well known each year as more and more UPSers hear about it. And new people generally will ask questions or may make negative comments that may have been discussed multiple times in the last year. That's not bad, it's just a reality of discussion boards.

Regarding the comments by ANON19072007 that management is not really welcome here, I would say that - If the website is becoming more popular with UPSers and most UPSers are teamsters it follows that more comments will be from the driver or inside employee point of view. As some of the other people have posted, I know that many management people have been reading this site for years. I first heard about Brown Cafe when Cheryl was posting on the Motley Fool UPS discussion board and told everyone about the Brown Cafe. Moved over here and have been very happy with the quality of the discussions. If management people have something to say, they've always been welcome to voice an opinion. Not everyone will agree, but that's why it's called a Forum.

 

[tonyexpress]

Canon,

In this post you seem upset. There has obviously been some unfair treatment and you are expressing it here. To make blanket statements like this only lessons your credibility and puts any management person responding in a defensive position. I'll be happy to try and explain some of your concerns but I'm by no means an expert and can only speak from my experience.

It only seems like a union site because mgmt refuses to admit there's a problem at all and chooses to remain silent or advocates "making the best of it". We see the problems and discuss them. Mgmt sees our discussion of topics like this to be "anti-company".

When you say management refuses to admit there's a problem what are you referring to? Remaining silent or lurking does not mean that others are not reading/listening/learning and even considering other ways to approach things. I can't speak for others but I do have the tendency to do a lot more lurking than posting. Another way to look at it: if management were on here all the time debating or having confrontations it might stifle some of the good ideas being expressed.


I do think there is a lot of negativity but this is supposed to be a venting place for employees who might say things here that they wouldn't say at their workplace. If handled the right way negativity can breed success too. I believe that most management employees do not see most of the discussion topics to be "anti-company" - but rather see frustrated employees expressing their gripes.

It really isn't helpful to come in here with rose colored glasses and pretend we're flawless. The drivers aren't in a position to fix things, and mgmt isn't allowed to admit there's a problem. So if there's an ounce of truth in your post, the very last thing we should do is continue to hide the problems in the shadows. That's how we arrived at the situation you described.

I agree with you that it doesn't help to pretend everything is rosy when it's not.
The drivers may not be the ones to fix a problem but they certainly can make things better by communicating issues. The same thing goes for management; there must be an open line of communication.
As far as management not admitting a problem.. If there's a problem it should be addressed if it's not you take it up the chain of command until you get results.

And for anyone reading this who is "afraid" to speak up, come in without the Us vs Them attitude and leave the insults at the door. I'd love just once for someone in mgmt to stand up and address an issue without dismissing it as mere whining when they know for fact it's a problem. PAS remains broke in centers where covering up the problems is easier than fixing it, fudging numbers is commonplace to stay off the corporate blotter, nobody wants to be a pt supe because they are treated like crap in too many centers, and rocking the boat to get things fixed is a sure-fire way to get blacklisted.

How do I respond to this "afraid", fudging numbers, blacklisted nonsense? Re-reading this part of your post really makes me think your building or center has some real issues. Not all buildings are like this and if people are lying by covering up problems, fudging numbers...etc., then they should be fired. Rocking the boat is mandatory not only for ones own conscience but for the example they need to set as a leader and the service that needs to second to none.

I think the biggest issue for everyone involved is that we're all disposable. UPS pays well, and allows people to earn money they'd never be able to make outside the company without a degree. The provide the label of "leader", then hand you the script you have to follow.

UPS has one of the most loyal workforces, both hourly and management in the business world today, with people happily making careers of a lifetime there. Nobody is making anyone work there and if you see dishonesty you're obligated to report it...

I've seen real leaders before, they're in command of our troops. You establish a mission, then allow the leaders to accomplish the goals using the training they've received without dangling discipline out there for what should be a force improving learning experience. What I see now amounts to the comparison of a talented painter vs someone who is painting by numbers.

We do have creative painters and the paint by number types. There are drivers you can leave alone cause you know they can paint like a son of gun and there are others that need that extra attention and guidance to stay within the lines.

The difference in center performance is limited to nothing more than one managers abilities in motivational speaking. Those that aren't so good rely on discipline and scare tactics. It's not a slam against mgmt, quite the opposite. It's my confidence in the people I report to that aren't allowed to deviate from a blanket policy that too often suffocates instead of protects. I have confidence that if allowed to, those entrusted to the positions of ctr mgrs and driver supes could "win the war" all by themselves. Maybe that's why they aren't allowed to. If they ever became "valuable", they would then be in a position to ask for more money to keep them from leaving. Or ask for the job of one of the people who don't want them to be valuable.

Everyone must work together from the top on down and I agree that proven Managers should be allowed more control.

 

[canon]

holy crap, just forget it. everything is peachy. no problems at all.

Going to see "300".

 

[tonyexpress]

holy crap, just forget it. everything is peachy. no problems at all.

Going to see "300".

Hey...wait a minute... get back here...you can't have a life..

Just remember that the management team is like the victors in the movie you're about to see..We may be out numbered 300 to 200,000(I believe those are the numbers in that war) but victory will be ours....LOL

Have a good time!
T

 

[canon]

Hey...wait a minute... get back here...you can't have a life..

Just remember that the management team is like the victors in the movie you're about to see..We may be out numbered 300 to 200,000(I believe those are the numbers in that war) but victory will be ours....LOL

Have a good time!
T

there is absolutely no doubt in my mind about that

 

[tieguy]

Yikes!!) I also now realize that there are idiots everywhere, not just supervising feeders.

LOL, in fact looking at all the class action lawsuits it appears we have a much greater concentration in california.

 

[tieguy]

Anon1907...........
Good point.

Maybe we can petition Cheryl to change the name of this website to:
"wine and roses" cafe.com or;
"butterfly kisses and lollipops" cafe.com or;
"the good ship lollipop" cafe.com or;
"leave it to beaver" cafe.com.

With the exception of one frequent management poster, management has always been a rather secretive society to the extent that the aforementioned management poster does most of his communication with his "brotherhood" by PM.

I guess it depends on which end of the "screwing" you happen to be on would depend the nature of one's post's here.

Maybe management needs to start their own website to snuggle up on.

Trick must be having a rough week , really flying off the deep end. Everyone say a prayer for trick.

 

[tieguy]

And for anyone reading this who is "afraid" to speak up, come in without the Us vs Them attitude and leave the insults at the door. I'd love just once for someone in mgmt to stand up and address an issue without dismissing it as mere whining when they know for fact it's a problem.

unfortunately as I highlighted in another thread the attacks by the pack are getting even more vicious while you keep avoiding the issue or while you try to view the issue with rose colored glasses.

 

[helenofcalifornia]

Ohmigod!!!!! I am getting sooooooo.........sick of this same old same old!!!
Come up with something different.

 

[canon]

Come up with something different.

We need an exercise/health thread.

 

[DS]

I always figgered you`re born with only so many heartbeats,
all those joggers are running thier lives away.My job is my
exercise.

 

[canon]

I always figgered you`re born with only so many heartbeats, all those joggers are running thier lives away.

I was watching the Today show a couple weeks ago and Willard Scott was announcing the birthdays. For those that don't know, he says happy birthday to people who have turned 100 or better. On this particular day, a lady was turning 107 and the info provided for Willard to read said she had quit smoking at 96 for "health reasons".

Maybe exercise is irrelevant and we all have a certain number of heartbeats. For my sake, I sure hope not. If that's true tho, I've certainly extended my life since I've been on this board. Hit an all time high of 200.5 lbs this weekend as a result of a drastic decrease in workouts. Something has to change, I'm thinking tomorrow is it. Been watching Buakaw highlight films on youtube trying to psyche myself back into the proper frame of mind.

Is it possible to go off topic in a thead about thread themes? I'll contribute to the last argument with "nu uh!" just to be on the safe side.

 

[DS]

ok so its off topic but lets take it another step.
heres how I keep fit,after all you are what you eat
wake up...instant coffee and a smoke...
grab 2 real coffees from Tim hortons and one more when I get on area
(3 min pd brk)around 1:30 pm ...I heat my food on my heater...pea soup is my fav p800 meal...with lots of crackers...chili works good...or...I love the new triscuits with black pepper and olive oil......a few cheeze slices and a strawberry banana yogurt makes a nice lunch... last nights pizza does not work.
I weigh 155 lbs...have weighed that since I was 17...
I may have shrunk a bit and the weight is all in the boiler now

 

[canon]

ok so its off topic but lets take it another step.
heres how I keep fit,after all you are what you eat
wake up...instant coffee and a smoke...
grab 2 real coffees from Tim hortons and one more when I get on area
(3 min pd brk)around 1:30 pm ...I heat my food on my heater...pea soup is my fav p800 meal...with lots of crackers...chili works good...or...I love the new triscuits with black pepper and olive oil......a few cheeze slices and a strawberry banana yogurt makes a nice lunch... last nights pizza does not work.
I weigh 155 lbs...have weighed that since I was 17...
I may have shrunk a bit and the weight is all in the boiler now

lol, love the meal on the heater. I've always worked out off and on, then I quit smoking a little over a year ago and started a health campaign of sorts. But here lately I've been a frequent diner at the gas station... fried chicken in either wings, breasts, or tenders form. Was doing well for a long time, then became sick over christmas and lost my momentum. I still worked out, but not like I was for the last year.

Old routine (starting back this week):
Morning run Tue-Fri 2.5 miles
Work
Mon-Thurs Evening workout 1-1.5 hour
Friday evening social events
Eating good-for-me food
Saturday morning martial arts followed by workout
Sunday 10-13 mile run
Monday no morning run

 

[brownmonster]

Work..Beer..Bratwurst..Beer..Work

 

[DS]

canon,you are gonna kill yourself.
Just eat properly and eat less.
Walk that 10 miles,dont run.
As far as the amount of heartbeats goes,
I think our bodies are like cars.The pistons
firing are like heartbeats.If you use cheap
fuel and run the engine at 8000 rpm,(like
you plan on doing)its components will eventually
break down.(do you really want a valve job?)
Some people are born as fiats,some are vipers,
but god usually makes us a nice dependable
vehicle,like a VW beetle or a BMW .
Youll be fine if you just use clean fuel,change
your oil frequently,and rotate your tires every
10,000 miles.

 

[canon]

Work..Beer..Bratwurst..Beer..Work

Johnsonville Stadium brats

 

[brownmonster]

Johnsonville are OK but some of the local meat markets make better ones.