Why are some UPS employees members of two unions? I'm confused!

[bigpeck5]

i don;t bleed brown and i don;t bleed union i don;t trust niether one of them with my money but its a job and we made that choice so we have to live with it we don;t have to agree with it and we don;t have to like it,

 

[3peaks]

Where are you from? There are meetings scheduled by the APWA across the country for the next several months. Try attending one and get your questions answered. As far as the original question there are right to work states and non-right to work states. I'm in Ohio and it is non right to work, I can only "with draw" as an objector to the polictical view of the ibt. In right to work states you can stop paying all together any dues. As for me here in Ohio I have to pay a core fee for representation and other little needless things. Actually representation isn't needless just some of the other quirks. Stil paying for strike fund even though I cannot get pay if there is a strike. Of course ibt says there is no part of the dues that is strike fund. That is straight from the ibt.So dues went up $12.00 a month in 1997 for strike pay but they say there is no strike fund being paid through your dues, if anyone that says there is then please show me the article or where it is located saying there is a strike fund and it is paid for through our union dues.

so where is it posted on the AWPA web site for upcoming events? and why should I have to go to a meeting just to find out the basic's.....i am well aware of what the ibt has not done....the AWPA web site has pointed out all of that...but have not pointed out how much progress they have made so far...or how they plan to stick to all the promises thirty years from now...after all it's just another business...right?

 

[Gman24]

so where is it posted on the AWPA web site for upcoming events? and why should I have to go to a meeting just to find out the basic's.....i am well aware of what the ibt has not done....the AWPA web site has pointed out all of that...but have not pointed out how much progress they have made so far...or how they plan to stick to all the promises thirty years from now...after all it's just another business...right?

3peaks, you just hit the nail on the head. The TEAMSTERS unfortunately is ran LIKE a business. They don;t care who they have to sacrifice in the process (that being their own membership), as long as they get YOUR money.

That is EXACTLY what the APWA is trying to get away from. The APWA was founded on the priciple of A UNION BY ITS MEMBERS AND FOR ITS MEMBERS. That is a far cry from what the REAMSTERS are now.

Thanks for summing it up for all of those who don't get it yet.

 

[nervousjack]

"Confused"??--So am I !!----I belonged to 1 and still do, however I believe that is the limit.......

 

[3peaks]

3peaks, you just hit the nail on the head. The TEAMSTERS unfortunately is ran LIKE a business. They don;t care who they have to sacrifice in the process (that being their own membership), as long as they get YOUR money.

That is EXACTLY what the APWA is trying to get away from. The APWA was founded on the priciple of A UNION BY ITS MEMBERS AND FOR ITS MEMBERS. That is a far cry from what the REAMSTERS are now.

Thanks for summing it up for all of those who don't get it yet.

well I'm glad I summed it up for all those who don't get it yet.
So I guess I'm the only one left still clueless...all I wanted to know was how far along are they with any progress?....will the APWA be representing me in 2008 or will it be more like 2038? Or what exactly do they plan on doing to keep the honesty in and the corruptoin out? there must be some type of methods they plan to follow? How much will the union dues be? So I'm not saying it's a bad idea I just havn't found any info that make's me want to run and get my check book and join the cause...and so far I have only asked simple question's..

 

[Gman24]

Union dues will be what they are now for the first 6-12 months. The APWA will need to build buildings buy cars , computers, office stuff to "open shop" so to speak. After that the APWA says it can afford to slash what the TEAMSTERS are charging UPS employees in half. Through the TEAMSTERS UPS employees pay a higher percentage than any other TEAMSTERS represented company. Why wouldn't UPS employees be based the same as others percentage wise.

You speak of honesty. The APWA is only going to allow UPS employees to be officials or hold any type of office. Wouldn't you rather have UPS employees negotiate YOUR contract than someone who has never done anything at UPS. Also if any member of the APWA sees any corruption at any level, they will be able to go directly to a FCM (founding charter member) each state will have 200 of them, and the process of removal can immediately begin, won;t have to wait for an election.

3peaks, if you really want to know anything regarding the APWA, go to their web site and then contact them via e-mail, I assure you they will honestly answer whatever you have to ask. It may take a day or 2, but they will get back to you. These guys still have their daily UPS jobs to go to.

You ask how far along they are in progress. Within the next month cards will be passed out for a vote to occur. 2 years ago the TEAMSTERS never thought it would even get close to this. The media is starting to cover the APWA now as well. It would take many paragraphs to cover what the APWA would like to accomplish. Of course they will never accomplish those things if people who want change but will not stand up for change don't give them a chance.

The most common thing you hear TEAMSTER supporters say is the APWA can't back up what they say. The only way they won;t be able to back it up is if they aren't voted in. The TEAMSTERS are afraid this MAY happen and that's the propaganda they try to spread. The APWA also can't have a track record if they aren't voted in. IF that's the only battle cry the TEAMSTERS have, then they better give UPS employees more credit. Most of them (UPS employees) are smarter than they(TEAMSTERS officials) want us to be.

 

[ja4079]

Rocky the union does have a proven record, not one they should be proud of by any means! How can anyone think they are looking out for us? How can you trust them they have continued to rob us of our health and pension benfits?

 

[raceanoncr]

Some UPS workers belong to both the Teamsters and the APWA. You obviously want to replace the Teamsters with the APWA, but you are sending mixed signals. Why do you continue to support the Teamsters by paying union dues, when they are no longer in your best interest. While the Teamsters are planning further cuts to the cuts already in place, the APWA is trying to restore your benefits. By continuing to keep funding the Teamsters through union dues, they are using your money to fight the APWA. I understand that in non right-to-work states, you must be a member of the Teamsters, but in the right-to-work states, I can not comprehend supporting an organization (Teamsters) that is fighting a union (APWA) that you support. I suggest that you get out of the Teamsters, take your union dues, and help the APWA win the battle. Without your support, it is not going to happen, and then you will see all your benefits dwindle year after year. The choice is yours; keep supporting the Teamsters and lose your financial security, or support the APWA to achieve an honest union where we all win.

Uh...confused? Me too. Two unions? Where? Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought this APWA was an ORGANIZATION, not a union!
Eng...We appreciate your fervor but, with all due respect, you're confusing some of the rank and file also.
Also, I, too, want answers. I asked you for answers a few threads ago and you slyly disappeared. You accused your BA of "double-dipping", accepting a Teamster salary and pension and accepting a City Council salary and pension. I asked you to prove he was getting paid as a City Council member and you shot back to me that I was "naive" in thinking that they don't get paid. Well, that, kinda didn't answer my question. I asked you to prove that he was getting a pension from the City Council...no answer.
I asked you to prove that he was at City Council meetings during times that he should have been attending to Teamster business. No answer!
In one of the last posts in that thread, you close by saying the IBT was corrupt, the local was corrupt, and HE was corrupt! OK! Prove it!

 

[wildgoose]

No, Goose, I think Denver is Central States, for one. Security of benefits...if you're talking about health benefits for retirees, I'm on the fence there. I keep hearing about these companies dumping their retirees health benefits all together. From what you're saying, it sounds like UPS/Teamsters are reducing them. As I've said before, the retirement situation...I'D PUT YOU ON YOUR OWN!!!!! You can't expect the company/union/government to fund your retirement for you. This isn't Europe with the entitlement system, pal. That system makes me sick: get X just because you are ENTITLED to it?? I THINK NOT!!!! That's what I call freeloading.

Somebody above mentioned something about the South voting in who was in charge of their affairs. Sorry Goose, but you gotta take the good with the bad.

The Teamsters are marginally predictable as they're a known quantity. The APWA is an unknown quantity as it is very new. I'd take the Teamsters over the APWA based on that. I don't trust the APWA based on what I've seen here and read on their site. Time will tell if I was right or wrong. I have a very good "gut instinct" and the APWA is sounding alarms for me. -Rocky

talking about entitlement is not that? This is why you pay union dues to have a retirement and now that they fumbled that you say i should forget it ? Your nuts - I worked my nuts off for 18 + years in packages and you shortimer have balls to back someone who pilfered my retirement and say well you shouldn`t expect it ? You probably won`t make the retirement anyhow because of the mileage on your body won`t take it ! You have got it all twisted but your dream of only relying on your retirement may come true very soon !!!!!!!
The management of teamsters can work anywhere once they leave and receive their pension - your telling me what i can and can`t ? "I PAY THEM" not "THEM PAYING ME" !
Wait till they ask for insurance supplement of $200 amonth soon - will you say thats ok too ? Teamsters are not made for the investment world its obvious - They are idiots when it comes to that - "Everybody is seeing that" ! You have no clue what is and what should be ? Your like a puppy dog as long as they give you a treat your so happy !
Everybody needs to wake up and see it for what it is ? A piggy bank for teamsters -Central States !

 

[wildgoose]

talking about entitlement is not that? This is why you pay union dues to have a retirement and now that they fumbled that you say i should forget it ? Your nuts - I worked my nuts off for 18 + years in packages and you shortimer have balls to back someone who pilfered my retirement and say well you shouldn`t expect it ? You probably won`t make the retirement anyhow because of the mileage on your body won`t take it ! You have got it all twisted but your dream of only relying on your retirement may come true very soon !!!!!!!
The management of teamsters can work anywhere once they leave and receive their pension - your telling me what i can and can`t ? "I PAY THEM" not "THEM PAYING ME" !
Wait till they ask for insurance supplement of $200 amonth soon - will you say thats ok too ? Teamsters are not made for the investment world its obvious - They are idiots when it comes to that - "Everybody is seeing that" ! You have no clue what is and what should be ? Your like a puppy dog as long as they give you a treat your so happy !
Everybody needs to wake up and see it for what it is ? A piggy bank for teamsters -Central States !

And furthermore how stupid are you if you don`t know what fund you are in ?

 

[RockyRogue]

talking about entitlement is not that? This is why you pay union dues to have a retirement and now that they fumbled that you say i should forget it ? Your nuts - I worked my nuts off for 18 + years in packages and you shortimer have balls to back someone who pilfered my retirement and say well you shouldn`t expect it ? You probably won`t make the retirement anyhow because of the mileage on your body won`t take it ! You have got it all twisted but your dream of only relying on your retirement may come true very soon !!!!!!!
The management of teamsters can work anywhere once they leave and receive their pension - your telling me what i can and can`t ? "I PAY THEM" not "THEM PAYING ME" !
Wait till they ask for insurance supplement of $200 amonth soon - will you say thats ok too ? Teamsters are not made for the investment world its obvious - They are idiots when it comes to that - "Everybody is seeing that" ! You have no clue what is and what should be ? Your like a puppy dog as long as they give you a treat your so happy !
Everybody needs to wake up and see it for what it is ? A piggy bank for teamsters -Central States !

::::Sighs:::. Goose, you're puttin words in my mouth...AGAIN!!!! I'm not even gonna get into your point about post-retirement work, largely because I'm nowhere near that, so I don't have an opinion formed. From this board, it sounds like it depends on the local/fund whether or not that rule actually applies. And, yes, I am a short-timer. I make no-bones about it. I'm at UPS this time for very specific things--health benefits, in particular. And let's not drag the union/company thing into this, OK? Not really in the mood for that sparring match with you again. As to being a puppy dog...you don't play fair, do you? I don't generally name-call but you are a definite A-HOLE. I get what I want and a little more from UPS and I'm happy. Again, being short-timer, I have that luxury.

And furthermore how stupid are you if you don`t know what fund you are in ?

Stupid? You're one nasty, rude, hot-headed feeder-driver aren't you? Its not stupidity if it doesn't mean the world to you. As I said above and almost certainly in other posts, I'm a young guy with my life ahead of me. The pension mess is something MY generation is gonna have to clean up and knowing my generation, we'll screw up the last chance to clean things up and turn it around. If I wanted to know or cared THAT much about the pension fund I'm in, I could find out. But...I don't care. Sorry but that's a dead point, Goose. Anything else you really wanna talk about? -Rocky

 

[Anonymous Loader]

Boy, sure am glad I've started my 401k at 18. Won't have to deal with any of this pension bull****

 

[Bill]

]
Show us the proof of all this. You still haven't aswered my question,who do they represent now? NOBODY that's who they have no proven track record. You think you have pension problem's now? Go ahead and give them your money, And if you are paying a membership fee to the apwa you are nut's!!! They don't even represent you now and they are taking your money!!!

Do you think that the Teamsters really represent us. They only want your union dues to line their pockets. The Teamsters make deals all the time with UPS behind the scenes. We are losing our benefits and the Teamsters have done nothing to stop this, and still have no plan to stop this progression of cuts. At least the APWA has a plan.
The APWA does not represent us yet, but will if they can oust the Teamsters when the vote comes. As far as experience goes, I would rather go with a new entity than continue with the Teamsters who are sinking fast, with no way out. Did the pilots union (IPA) have any experience before they rid themselves of the Teamsters? NO!!! Where are they now? They broke away from the Teamsters, negotiated their own contract, and now receive a better pension, more money and more security. Can the Teamsters say that? Once again, NO!!! The only thing the Teamsters have done is raise union dues.

 

[Bill]

::::Sighs:::. Goose, you're puttin words in my mouth...AGAIN!!!! I'm not even gonna get into your point about post-retirement work, largely because I'm nowhere near that, so I don't have an opinion formed. From this board, it sounds like it depends on the local/fund whether or not that rule actually applies. And, yes, I am a short-timer. I make no-bones about it. I'm at UPS this time for very specific things--health benefits, in particular. And let's not drag the union/company thing into this, OK? Not really in the mood for that sparring match with you again. As to being a puppy dog...you don't play fair, do you? I don't generally name-call but you are a definite A-HOLE. I get what I want and a little more from UPS and I'm happy. Again, being short-timer, I have that luxury.



Stupid? You're one nasty, rude, hot-headed feeder-driver aren't you? Its not stupidity if it doesn't mean the world to you. As I said above and almost certainly in other posts, I'm a young guy with my life ahead of me. The pension mess is something MY generation is gonna have to clean up and knowing my generation, we'll screw up the last chance to clean things up and turn it around. If I wanted to know or cared THAT much about the pension fund I'm in, I could find out. But...I don't care. Sorry but that's a dead point, Goose. Anything else you really wanna talk about? -Rocky

When I just started working for UPS, the Pension was the last thing on my mind. Now that I am getting older it is a big concern. Eventually, you will be nearing retirement age, and if you aren't concerned about your future, or fix this mess now, you better start saving all your money, because you will not receive a pension if your body can make it through the demanding job that UPS requires.

 

[govols019]

Do you think that the Teamsters really represent us. They only want your union dues to line their pockets. The Teamsters make deals all the time with UPS behind the scenes. We are losing our benefits and the Teamsters have done nothing to stop this, and still have no plan to stop this progression of cuts. At least the APWA has a plan.
The APWA does not represent us yet, but will if they can oust the Teamsters when the vote comes. As far as experience goes, I would rather go with a new entity than continue with the Teamsters who are sinking fast, with no way out. Did the pilots union (IPA) have any experience before they rid themselves of the Teamsters? NO!!! Where are they now? They broke away from the Teamsters, negotiated their own contract, and now receive a better pension, more money and more security. Can the Teamsters say that? Once again, NO!!! The only thing the Teamsters have done is raise union dues.

You STILL didn't answer his question.

 

[raceanoncr]

I can see this now...LET'S ALL UNITE TO OVERTHROW THE TEAMSTERS...because of blah, blah, blah...
The APWA is the panecea for what ails you!
UNITE? One CENTER can't even unite it's hourly's to not work off the clock. Look at some of the past posts. "I have to come in and sort thru my car before start time, otherwise I can't go fast!" "I HAVE to skip my lunch or else I won't be able to go fast!"
Get almost 400,000 Teamsters to unite and QUIT? Yeah, right!
Get almost 400,000 former Teamsters to unite and join an ORGANIZATION?
Get UPS, a 100 yr-old company, to recognize (OK, let's have all the arguments on card-check and certification!), let alone, negotiate in good faith, with a couple-year old ORGANIZATION?
Knock yerself out! Run with it and continue to dodge my questions

 

[3peaks]

I can see this now...LET'S ALL UNITE TO OVERTHROW THE TEAMSTERS...because of blah, blah, blah...
The APWA is the panecea for what ails you!
UNITE? One CENTER can't even unite it's hourly's to not work off the clock. Look at some of the past posts. "I have to come in and sort thru my car before start time, otherwise I can't go fast!" "I HAVE to skip my lunch or else I won't be able to go fast!"
Get almost 400,000 Teamsters to unite and QUIT? Yeah, right!
Get almost 400,000 former Teamsters to unite and join an ORGANIZATION?
Get UPS, a 100 yr-old company, to recognize (OK, let's have all the arguments on card-check and certification!), let alone, negotiate in good faith, with a couple-year old ORGANIZATION?
Knock yerself out! Run with it and continue to dodge my questions

yeah ..you try to ask a simple question and the only answer i get is go to their web site, which still tells me nothing, come back here, ask more question's, the only answer i get is sign up for the news letter.....it would be nice if the people on brown cafe who claim to know so much about the APWA would just answer the simple question's for us.....if it is this hard to get the info now....what will it be like if they gain control....

 

[raceanoncr]

Well, Eng, am still waiting. Have to go out on my sleeper run tonight and make more $ for your pension. Still ain't got no answers for my questions. Will be gone for a week. Waiting...Waiting...Waiting...

 

[dragracer66]

I can see this now...LET'S ALL UNITE TO OVERTHROW THE TEAMSTERS...because of blah, blah, blah...
The APWA is the panecea for what ails you!
UNITE? One CENTER can't even unite it's hourly's to not work off the clock. Look at some of the past posts. "I have to come in and sort thru my car before start time, otherwise I can't go fast!" "I HAVE to skip my lunch or else I won't be able to go fast!"
Get almost 400,000 Teamsters to unite and QUIT? Yeah, right!
Get almost 400,000 former Teamsters to unite and join an ORGANIZATION?
Get UPS, a 100 yr-old company, to recognize (OK, let's have all the arguments on card-check and certification!), let alone, negotiate in good faith, with a couple-year old ORGANIZATION?
Knock yerself out! Run with it and continue to dodge my questions

Well Put...They know the apwa has no shot but, let's not take away their dream's. You have to admit it does make for funny reading. What's going to happen after the next contract when the teamster's are still in? There won't be nothing to write about? Somebody mentioned the pilot's did it, yea there isn't 400,000 pilot's either!!!

 

[RockyRogue]

When I just started working for UPS, the Pension was the last thing on my mind. Now that I am getting older it is a big concern. Eventually, you will be nearing retirement age, and if you aren't concerned about your future, or fix this mess now, you better start saving all your money, because you will not receive a pension if your body can make it through the demanding job that UPS requires.

I figure that's the way the older crowd thought: "Oh, this'll be around when I retire." Unfortunately, times change. This is one of the examples. Being a "short-timer" I don't really worry about this as I'm not one that's long-term affected by it. Again, very unfortunately, there are people that ARE affected by it. -Rocky