Cancer Cure?

[rickyb]

I guess if there are right wing socialists in Europe it could be right wing.
In America we don’t really have much of that and I admittedly don’t follow European politics at all because europe sucks and has a long history of sucking.

the term socialist has been very badly skewed but it fundamentally means worker self determination.

 

[rickyb]

we need a cure for politics

the economic system dominates the political system

 

[El Correcto]

its not hard to pin down. wiki and im pretty sure everyone i listen to very clearly has it pinned down.

i dont think nationalism is socialist either. could be wrong.

Then what did fascism do wrong that communism itself didn’t?
Mistreat gays? Che Guevara shot gays in the face in work camps. Stalin outlawed being a homosexual. Ethnic purges? Ask the Ukrainian people about the Holodomor.

Communism and fascism, hell all totalitarian governments are horrible. I’m not a special pleader for any of them. Can the people you listen to honestly claim they do not support communist governments?

 

[El Correcto]

the term socialist has been very badly skewed but it fundamentally means worker self determination.

You will not be able to determine anything once your individual rights are dissolved into group rights.
To me that’s the foundation of being right wing, loving America. The importance individual rights play in our government.

 

[Old Man Jingles]

the term socialist has been very badly skewed but it fundamentally means worker self determination.

That's total !

Socialism fundamentally means a Strong Centralized National Government with Autocratic Dictator-like leaders.

 

[rickyb]

That's total !

Socialism fundamentally means a Strong Centralized National Government with Autocratic Dictator-like leaders.

no its worker controlling their own jobs, and communities making their own democratic decisions.

soviet union in practice has nothing to do with socialism, they were slaves. they just called it that because socialism had support is parts of the world.

 

[Old Man Jingles]

no its worker controlling their own jobs, and communities making their own democratic decisions.

soviet union in practice has nothing to do with socialism, they were slaves. they just called it that because socialism had support is parts of the world.

I choose reality over fantasy myself ... it seems to provide more accurate projections.

 

[rickyb]

You will not be able to determine anything once your individual rights are dissolved into group rights.
To me that’s the foundation of being right wing, loving America. The importance individual rights play in our government.

i dont really get it. i view it more as money dominating society and using govt to ensure its dominance. you have nsa spying, 25% of the worlds prison pop. the country was founded against popular democracy and to protect the rich so maybe that ties into what ur talking about. the bottom 70% of the country has no influence over policy and its sharply concentrated at the top based on how much money you have.

 

[rickyb]

I choose reality over fantasy myself ... it seems to provide more accurate projections.

how can you tell the difference between a lie and the truth?

 

[rickyb]

You will not be able to determine anything once your individual rights are dissolved into group rights.
To me that’s the foundation of being right wing, loving America. The importance individual rights play in our government.

proportional represenation? i dont know.

when we show up to work our rights are severely lacking.

 

[rickyb]

Then what did fascism do wrong that communism itself didn’t?
Mistreat gays? Che Guevara shot gays in the face in work camps. Stalin outlawed being a homosexual. Ethnic purges? Ask the Ukrainian people about the Holodomor.

Communism and fascism, hell all totalitarian governments are horrible. I’m not a special pleader for any of them. Can the people you listen to honestly claim they do not support communist governments?

i dont know man. im sure not everything either of them did was bad, but they had tons of problems. soviet union suffered an anti worker controll counter revolution. they were slaves. orwell pointed out hte hypocrisy in animal farm and at hte beginning of that book he very clearly states the goal being worker control of the labour, it says it in the first chapter and ive quoted it here on the forum a few times.

 

[El Correcto]

i dont know man. im sure not everything either of them did was bad, but they had tons of problems. soviet union suffered an anti worker controll counter revolution. they were slaves. orwell pointed out hte hypocrisy in animal farm and at hte beginning of that book he very clearly states the goal being worker control of the labour, it says it in the first chapter and ive quoted it here on the forum a few times.

That’s why you have free markets Ricky. Did someone bust you over the head and force you to keep working at UPS when a supervisor treated you poorly? Nope. You used your self determination to walk out and go work somewhere else. You the worker controlled your labor.

You might have some valid complaints and there are regulations in place that could get a company in hot water for endangering an employee’s life in unsafe conditions. You don’t need a socialist utopia to control your own labor, you simply need a spine and some hard work.

 

[rickyb]

That’s why you have free markets Ricky. Did someone bust you over the head and force you to keep working at UPS when a supervisor treated you poorly? Nope. You used your self determination to walk out and go work somewhere else. You the worker controlled your labor.

You might have some valid complaints and there are regulations in place that could get a company in hot water for endangering an employee’s life in unsafe conditions. You don’t need a socialist utopia to control your own labor, you simply need a spine and some hard work.

no you dont understand. or actually you do lol but u pretend u dont.

controlling your labour means a capitalist is not profiting off ur labour firstly.

 

[rickyb]

I choose reality over fantasy myself ... it seems to provide more accurate projections.

no what you did is you looked at reality which is more htan many ppl on this site do, u thought it was fantasy, and went permanently into fantasy thinking it was reality.

 

[Old Man Jingles]

how can you tell the difference between a lie and the truth?

Is there a difference?

 

[rickyb]

Is there a difference?

not if ur a nihilist which is fitting lol

 

[El Correcto]

no you dont understand. or actually you do lol but u pretend u dont.

controlling your labour means a capitalist is not profiting off ur labour firstly.

Why do you care if someone is profiting off your labor? That doesn’t take control away from you over your labor, it is just the incentive people have to hire you. It’s what allows you to liquidize your labor into currency and trade it more freely with others.

 

[rickyb]

Why do you care if someone is profiting off your labor? That doesn’t take control away from you over your labor, it is just the incentive people have to hire you. It’s what allows you to liquidize your labor into currency and trade it more freely with others.

because they are ripping you off and it does take control away because you never decided what you were going to do with the surplus, they did.

secondly the job is undemocratic. you are only free to leave, and have mild democratic influence through govt.

 

[quad decade guy]

I guess if there are right wing socialists in Europe it could be right wing.
In America we don’t really have much of that and I admittedly don’t follow European politics at all because europe sucks and has a long history of sucking.

And mass murder.

 

[El Correcto]

And mass murder.

Plenty of that in American history.
I just have a hate boner for Europe, it runs in my American veins. If Europe was worth a I’d be European, my ancestors decided it wasn’t.