I'm all for hiring the best man for the job. I'm tired of working for people who do not know what they are doing. Our PT supes are an absolute joke. And I have yet to meet a female supe who was qualified for he job. If you have management skills, you should manage. If not, don't.
How Does Everyone Feel About Management Diversity?
- Thread starter LPGuy
- Start date
Covemastah
Hoopah drives the boat Chief !!
it don't matter what color what sex or religion you are, they screw with everyone equaly,on a side note no one should be promoted into the good old boys club,,storm troopers job also know as mngment unless they can do 1 full year in the concrete jungle,the real world of ups not the fictional clarkville crap you get from the ''book'' come out here and live it before you teach it or preach it!!!! i know tie will have a thing to say and i can take it but you all know that what is learned on a pkg/car cant be learned from a ''clarkville '' video
Ouch! I think you violated the 150 miles from the building rule!!! (Who was that? Was it D???)
Covemastah
Hoopah drives the boat Chief !!
i can not say who it was ovah, but you know it wasnt me or you and i sure wont give him up
Wow, no wonder people are leaving UPS. But UPS managers are still better than other companies. I remember Fed Ex Ground hiring a restaurant Manager to manage one of it's buildings in Moonachie... what a disaster!!!
I thought things were bad at UPS. I was upset that my boss at the time never loaded a truck in her life. She was a driver for 3 years, a college grad, and was only in the Army Reserves. They trained her to load a trailer and package car over two weeks along with other Supervisors. I thought it was a joke that she never sweated like the rest of us in a 53 footer loading 13' ceilings. But she still wasn't the idiots you guys are describing. She turned out to be an excellent boss. And had to fight for respect on the dock, because she wasn't, "Born" on the dock like the rest of us... she was from, "Package".
Believe it or not, UPS at least does it right in one respect, they don't hire managers from off of the street directly... Believe me, you NEVER want to see the aftermath of that. Diversity or no diversity, at least you guys hire from within. When you hire people off the street, not only are they not on the same page as everyone else, or in the same book as everyone else, they don't even use the SAME LIBRARY!!
I thought things were bad at UPS. I was upset that my boss at the time never loaded a truck in her life. She was a driver for 3 years, a college grad, and was only in the Army Reserves. They trained her to load a trailer and package car over two weeks along with other Supervisors. I thought it was a joke that she never sweated like the rest of us in a 53 footer loading 13' ceilings. But she still wasn't the idiots you guys are describing. She turned out to be an excellent boss. And had to fight for respect on the dock, because she wasn't, "Born" on the dock like the rest of us... she was from, "Package".
Believe it or not, UPS at least does it right in one respect, they don't hire managers from off of the street directly... Believe me, you NEVER want to see the aftermath of that. Diversity or no diversity, at least you guys hire from within. When you hire people off the street, not only are they not on the same page as everyone else, or in the same book as everyone else, they don't even use the SAME LIBRARY!!
Harley Rider
34 yrs & done!
The biggest problem I see with the promotion process at UPS is they no longer want people in management that have actually come up through operations. If you don't have a four year college degree you can forget it. I can understand that to a point. I hope I am retired when all we have left running operations are people that have never been on a package car and only have book knowledge. Years ago when I started it seemed that UPS valued job experience. Now we have part time sups and OMS personnel that have no idea what is really going on. Are these the center manager's of tomorrow?
I agree with Harley Rider. When I left UPS, I've seen what happens when you put, "Idiots in charge" who have not come from the rank and file. I learned a lot from college, I learned a lot from UPS training seminars, and then from UPS management people who mentored me.
But the group of people I learned most from was my fellow Union Brothers and Sisters before I went into management. They really taught me how to lead and how to treat people. Everyone said that it's hard to stand side by side with someone, and then be their boss the next day. Everyone wanted to see me succeed in management, and they trained me how to be a manager before I ever was trained by the company. I really learned how to talk to people.
To this day, I can hear some of the things other Loaders, Unloaders and Sorters would tell me about common sense in running an area. It was incredible when people found out I was willing to go into management. All of the Union guys in the Operation took me under their wing and showed me how things can go smoothly and how to work with people and not to be afraid to take charge. (I was 22 when I became a P/T Sup. A lot of the areas I ran had people in their 40's and 50's).
Out of over 200 people, there was always someone around I use to work side by side with to make sure I was never too big for my britches, I didn't make a blunder or forget where I came from as a supv. Diversity is nice and all, but there's a certain amount of grooming that takes place when you make the right choice. Heck, in my building managers had a habit of conferring with non-management on who to promote and who not to promote. Do they still do that? There were some people managers thought were ready, but when you ask the people they work along side of, you get a negative response -and more than likely, those people were held back. Respect from your peers was a big deciding factor. Is it still that way?
I am a Black female, and I embrace diversity, but it has to evolve too. The funny thing was that I did not choose to be a supv., nor did management first approach me. My peers started the ball rolling for me. The success in diversity starts from how you treat the peers around you.
But the group of people I learned most from was my fellow Union Brothers and Sisters before I went into management. They really taught me how to lead and how to treat people. Everyone said that it's hard to stand side by side with someone, and then be their boss the next day. Everyone wanted to see me succeed in management, and they trained me how to be a manager before I ever was trained by the company. I really learned how to talk to people.
To this day, I can hear some of the things other Loaders, Unloaders and Sorters would tell me about common sense in running an area. It was incredible when people found out I was willing to go into management. All of the Union guys in the Operation took me under their wing and showed me how things can go smoothly and how to work with people and not to be afraid to take charge. (I was 22 when I became a P/T Sup. A lot of the areas I ran had people in their 40's and 50's).
Out of over 200 people, there was always someone around I use to work side by side with to make sure I was never too big for my britches, I didn't make a blunder or forget where I came from as a supv. Diversity is nice and all, but there's a certain amount of grooming that takes place when you make the right choice. Heck, in my building managers had a habit of conferring with non-management on who to promote and who not to promote. Do they still do that? There were some people managers thought were ready, but when you ask the people they work along side of, you get a negative response -and more than likely, those people were held back. Respect from your peers was a big deciding factor. Is it still that way?
I am a Black female, and I embrace diversity, but it has to evolve too. The funny thing was that I did not choose to be a supv., nor did management first approach me. My peers started the ball rolling for me. The success in diversity starts from how you treat the peers around you.
No- I bet they show up as she's walking away!!
Wrenny- I like your posts and the down to earth logic in them. I have been around almost 33 years at UPS and I think that you are describing our corporate culture very well. Or at least the way it used to be. In business school they often talk about a Companies "core competencies"- the things that that particular corporation does better than anyone else. UPS has a number of them including our feeder network (many decades to build, constantly refined, more efficient than anyone elses in the world in ensuring service without running inefficient routes) our buildings (copied by almost everyone, we virtually invented the hub and spoke system, our boxlines are an extension of circular sorting platforms used by early drivers to ensure that if they didn't pull a parcel for their area the first time, it would come back around ,and are now used in airports worldwide for luggage. Our bullfrogs and tilt trays for Small Sorts are incredibly fast and accurate) our fleet (still the highest miles per car per breakdown, and the highest miles per vehicle total miles of any fleet anywhere which is well over a million miles per car stemming from our innovations in PMI'S, and scheduled replacement of high failure parts regardless of whether they have gone bad yet or not, as cited by FLEET magazine) and, lastly, our management. Trained in a part time environment where you learn skills that are applicable to being a leader in any group. Far from perfect, we still have a culture of service excellence in which many buildings that process several hundred packages a day have service failures in the single digits. And that includes the dubious and much disdained categories beyond our control such as bad labels/poor packs/late arrivals, tc. We ALWAYS get our sorts down, short of some catastropic weather disaster, while doing it far more efficiently in our cost per piece than anyone else anywhere. As the only union carrier left we have to be the best to make up for the huge disparity in cost that the others have over us. I still remember the first time I called someone in another hub thousands of miles from my facility to fix a problem with one of the loads we were receiving from them, and instead of being told to jump in a lake (as used to happen at another company I worked for,) I was treated as a partner, in a professional manner, and the problem was fixed. I thought "this is the place I want to work at" Warts and all UPS was still the best run, most efficient, and fairest place I had ever worked. So UPS management is respected throughout the business world because of our ability to excel, our constant drive to improve our processes and speed up our service to levels never seen before, all while doing it with less cost and with a diverse workforce including more than a hundred thousand part timers. Even a bad UPS manager is often the best person at another business where they seem to excel without trying. UPS and its culture of planning and improving, paying a fair wage for a fair days work, and accomplishing what other Companies see as impossible is our legacy. And I think it continues to this day although I agree with those critics who see that the promotion process when being led by the PC folks in HR is less fair, and provides less competent managers, then even when it was done by a "good old boys network" At least those people hired were competent and not chosen almost solely on their race, gender or national origin. We are, too often nowadays, successful in spite of HR- not because of them.
W
wrenny040
Guest
PaganPink I totally agree with you. You really appreciate the UPS culture more when you go outside of it and see absolute stupidity at work. It seems like UPS has gotten more diverse since I have left, but the strong point at UPS is that everyone is on the same page and works as a team. From the package handler all the way to the Center Manager.
You guys probably won't believe this, but Union and Management work more as a team at UPS than Management working together as a team at other companies. Diversity may need a little tweaking at UPS, but as a company... you guys have it going on!! ...Always have, and always will.
You guys probably won't believe this, but Union and Management work more as a team at UPS than Management working together as a team at other companies. Diversity may need a little tweaking at UPS, but as a company... you guys have it going on!! ...Always have, and always will.
"African-Americans, Hispanics, Asian-Pacific Americans and other minorities make up 35 percent of the company´s 348,400 employees in the United States.
Minorities accounted for half of UPS´s new employees in 2005.
Women represent 28 percent of the U.S. management team and 20 percent of the overall workforce...Among the company´s 63,000 U.S. managers, minorities hold nearly 30 percent of those executive positions."
Channahon certainly got it right in her post regarding diversity. To me, the critical sentence in the quote above is the one that states that in 2005, half of our new hires were minority men and women. We need to be a business that has a management team that reflects the diversity of our workforce.
Channahon wrote that "Ethnic businesses may be able to relate better to someone of their own background, who can speak their native language, who understands their work ethic and customs. That in itself may be a factor in a customer using UPS or another carrier. The same can apply toward new UPS employees, as well."
This is a case where a good business decision is also the right thing to do.
LP Guy,
I think this is at least the second post I read by you regarding the "unfairness" of UPS's policy on diversity. I won't pretend that some women haven't gotten promoted before they were ready, but its happened with men too. I see many, many opportunities for promotion that go to white men. If you haven't been promoted, perhaps it's one of two things. Either you're not doing as good a job as is required, or you are in a very small function- there is not as much opportunity for advancement in LP. You should request a lateral transfer into a package center. There is always opportunity for anyone that can get results. And it doesn't matter if your white or minority, male or female. A center manager has a tough job, but truly good managers are valuable to their employees and the organization.
JMO[/QUOTE]
Minorities accounted for half of UPS´s new employees in 2005.
Women represent 28 percent of the U.S. management team and 20 percent of the overall workforce...Among the company´s 63,000 U.S. managers, minorities hold nearly 30 percent of those executive positions."
Channahon certainly got it right in her post regarding diversity. To me, the critical sentence in the quote above is the one that states that in 2005, half of our new hires were minority men and women. We need to be a business that has a management team that reflects the diversity of our workforce.
Channahon wrote that "Ethnic businesses may be able to relate better to someone of their own background, who can speak their native language, who understands their work ethic and customs. That in itself may be a factor in a customer using UPS or another carrier. The same can apply toward new UPS employees, as well."
This is a case where a good business decision is also the right thing to do.
LP Guy,
I think this is at least the second post I read by you regarding the "unfairness" of UPS's policy on diversity. I won't pretend that some women haven't gotten promoted before they were ready, but its happened with men too. I see many, many opportunities for promotion that go to white men. If you haven't been promoted, perhaps it's one of two things. Either you're not doing as good a job as is required, or you are in a very small function- there is not as much opportunity for advancement in LP. You should request a lateral transfer into a package center. There is always opportunity for anyone that can get results. And it doesn't matter if your white or minority, male or female. A center manager has a tough job, but truly good managers are valuable to their employees and the organization.
JMO[/QUOTE]
JustTired
free at last.......
[/quote]
My question is....How can you tell a "truly good manager" from a bad one these days? Does it take a "truly good manager" to repeat the commands from above? Does it take a "truly good manager" having to call and check if what he/she wants to do is alright with those above?
Seems to me that a "truly good manager" should "truly be allowed to manage". But it doesn't seem to be the case anymore.
Fighting4yourRights
Heavy Weight
Why does no one complain when an overweight, crotchety, unskilled, White man gets advanced into management regardless of his qualifications?
We could spend the rest of our lives debating the merits that sometimes good people get promoted and sometimes others find their way into the mix. It's an issue far greater than gender.
Also, please visit "The Doctor is in" thread, under the heading: "Life after Brown" for more tremendous advice - Uncensored, uncut and unmoderated.....It's totally raw.
We could spend the rest of our lives debating the merits that sometimes good people get promoted and sometimes others find their way into the mix. It's an issue far greater than gender.
Also, please visit "The Doctor is in" thread, under the heading: "Life after Brown" for more tremendous advice - Uncensored, uncut and unmoderated.....It's totally raw.
