New Democrat Plan To Tax The Rich, Taxing Assets. Will It Work?

[Up In Smoke]

How do we go about taxing appreciating and depreciating assets that are bought or sold.

 

[Up In Smoke]

People like to point out Rich Folk who pay no income tax but often fail to understand those two words “income tax”.

Example: I start with a billion dollars, invest half a billion in something and lose half of it during the year all while living large on a couple million dollars. At the end of the year, I’m still living large with still nearly 3/4 a billion dollars in wealth. But I had no “income” I lost money on investment and did not work all year (I am a party animal!) so I owe nothing. I could keep spending two million a year on lifestyle and never pay a penny of income tax.

Thats our income tax system. But if we tax spending instead of income then the only way Rich Folk don’t pay is to not spend any of their money…which isn’t gonna happen.

The wealthy also skirt paying income taxes by borrowing against an asset (stock portfolio), invest part of that loan against the asset (options), pay down the debt over time and write off the interest of the loan. This process is repeated over and over. The vast majority of wealthy folk operate through shelters and trusts.

 

[rickyb]

So you believe that taxes on corporations have no effect on consumers? Interesting world view.

Some people always believe that corporations and governments have unlimited magic pots of money.

governments create money

taxes on corporations can be a good thing.

for example in america, for 150 years americans standard of living rose. they were able to buy more every year. this ended 1973. your worldview doesnt believe in rising standards of living, you just think if costs go up, prices automatically go up too.

another example would be lead in oil i believe. they charged more when they put it in, and they charged more when they got rid of it LOL. corporations will simply try and maximize profits, they are free to choose to adjust their prices. no cause and effect.

 

[rickyb]

Corporations can't just absorb costs. They have a fiduciary responsibility to their shareholders to produce profits. They can't just print money like the government. If the government increases their taxes they will pass that along to their consumers in the form of higher prices. Ask yourself how often do corporations just absorb the costs and take a loss? At some point they'd cease to be solvent.

corporations can choose to raise or lower prices.

 

[AKCoverMan]

How do we go about taxing appreciating and depreciating assets that are bought or sold.

Don’t. Instead, tax the money the person profiting spends after they make the profit.

 

[AKCoverMan]

The wealthy also skirt paying income taxes by borrowing against an asset (stock portfolio), invest part of that loan against the asset (options), pay down the debt over time and write off the interest of the loan. This process is repeated over and over. The vast majority of wealthy folk operate through shelters and trusts.

Yes. So instead take away the game and just tax spending, and avoid all these shenanigans.

 

[AKCoverMan]

corporations can choose to raise or lower prices.

So market pressures supply and demand have no bearing on pricing, it’s just the whim of the big bad oppressive corporations?

 

[rickyb]

So market pressures supply and demand have no bearing on pricing, it’s just the whim of the big bad oppressive corporations?

Corporations ultimately set prices unless govt does it

 

[vantexan]

corporations can choose to raise or lower prices.

Corporations are often in competition with other corporations and can't raise prices if the other corporations aren't. And they often can't just choose to lower prices because they have costs they have to pay for like supplies, fuel, etc that are high too. But when taxes are raised that affects everyone as those costs are passed along to the consumer.

 

[AKCoverMan]

Corporations ultimately set prices

This is so oversimplified. A business sets prices but ultimately must deal with market consequences of the price that it set.

unless govt does it

This generally speaking never ends well. See Every Socialist Country Ever for context.

 

[vantexan]

The wealthy also skirt paying income taxes by borrowing against an asset (stock portfolio), invest part of that loan against the asset (options), pay down the debt over time and write off the interest of the loan. This process is repeated over and over. The vast majority of wealthy folk operate through shelters and trusts.

And it's that investing by the wealthy that underpins the economy and creates jobs. That's why they are allowed to do this. And you are allowed to participate if you create enough wealth that needs to be sheltered from tax and spend schemes.

 

[Gotta Go]

 

[rickyb]

Good luck with him. We've been telling him this for years but he sees the rich, unless they're in complete lockstep with his views, as evil. Gets old but he does let everyone see what indoctrination looks like.

Power corrupts

 

[rickyb]

Corporations are often in competition with other corporations and can't raise prices if the other corporations aren't. And they often can't just choose to lower prices because they have costs they have to pay for like supplies, fuel, etc that are high too. But when taxes are raised that affects everyone as those costs are passed along to the consumer.

american corporations are not in competition

we live in an age of monopoly

corporations set the price. they will set it to make money probably for short term profits

when corporations are taxed, it does not automatically mean its passed onto consumer

 

[vantexan]

american corporations are not in competition

we live in an age of monopoly

corporations set the price. they will set it to make money probably for short term profits

when corporations are taxed, it does not automatically mean its passed onto consumer

FedEx competes with Amazon and UPS. Supermarket chains compete. The list is endless. And yes, corporations send money to the taxman. Provided by their customers.

 

[rickyb]

FedEx competes with Amazon and UPS. Supermarket chains compete. The list is endless. And yes, corporations send money to the taxman. Provided by their customers.

corporations pay taxes. corporations set prices.

not their customers.

amazon is not in competition LOL. it has large market control along with walmart.

 

[vantexan]

corporations pay taxes. corporations set prices.

not their customers.

amazon is not in competition LOL. it has large market control along with walmart.

You obviously don't understand the package delivery business. Amazon is delivering most of their own pkgs now where it used to be FedEx and UPS and the Post Office delivering for Amazon. Has nothing to do with Amazon competing with Walmart.

 

[vantexan]

corporations pay taxes. corporations set prices.

not their customers.

amazon is not in competition LOL. it has large market control along with walmart.

If customers think a company charges too much they go to a competitor. Capitalism 101 which you don't understand.

 

[rickyb]

You obviously don't understand the package delivery business. Amazon is delivering most of their own pkgs now where it used to be FedEx and UPS and the Post Office delivering for Amazon. Has nothing to do with Amazon competing with Walmart.

im talking about monopolies not package delivery

package delivery may very well have a few companies dominating the market as well.

 

[rickyb]

If customers think a company charges too much they go to a competitor. Capitalism 101 which you don't understand.

customers dont always act in their own best interests

for example i use google and i think google sucks

ppl buy ty apple hearing stuff and beats.