Objections to Upcoming ABC 9/11 Program

[Slothrop]

Everytime I fly I am required to show my picture I.D. It's usually a couple times a year and to Hawaii. I have to show it 2 or 3 separate times. That's just my experience.

I still feel that if it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, quacks like a duck etc. it probably is a duck. Check it out thoroughly!! I don't give a flying crap what the Supreme Court says. I don't believe in protection for "insane radical nuts".

Are you required to show it, or do you just show it when asked? Have you ever been denied travel on an airplane for refusing to show ID?

Most crimes are committed by men. Should all men be subject to increased scutiny because thay are more likely to be criminals? Is being a man reason enough to be searched by law enforcement?

Nice to know you don't care about the laws of the land. It speaks volumes about you.

 

[moreluck]

When it comes to the safety of Americans, yes, some rights may have to be taken from those that fit the terrorist profile....middle eastern descent, Muslim or whatever they are called.

It gripes me that those that fit the profile are here on EXPIRED visas, attending our universities.....taking the spot that could go to a home-grown kid.....AND their sole purpose after we educate them is for them to turn around and do the most glorious thing.....Kill Americans. That's what they are taught when they are young.

It really gets to me when I find out that we are paying to help these loonies go to school here. It's ludicrous!!

Your visa expires? Go back from where you came.

I know you'll find ways to twist this around too. I don't care. I want Americans to be safe.

And to answer your question......the lady at Aloha Airlines desk asked for my driver's license. I didn't question anything, I just showed her my driver's license. I guess for folks who don't have a driver's license there are state issued ID's they can get.

Your little article about flying without picture ID.....that guy probably caused lots of folks in line to wait extra long just because he wanted to be an about the whole thing.

 

[cheryl]

BTW, you don't need ID to travel domestically, at least not yet.

How to fly without ID!

As one more point, the 4th & 14th Amendments make it illegal to profile based on race. This has been upheld by the Supreme Court more than once.

Every time I fly I am required to show my picture I.D. It's usually a couple times a year and to Hawaii. I have to show it 2 or 3 separate times. That's just my experience.

Slothrop, I do not agree with the point of view expressed in the link you recommend, the writer seems to be a bit paranoid about the government and not at all concerned about terrorism. After all of the repeated attempts to blow up airliners I cannot support anyone boarding a flight without having their identification verified.

I've flown domestically several times since 9-11, and just like moreluck, I have had to show my id at least three times at every US airport I have flown out of. I've also flown on several international flights. At Heathrow security agents with machine guns pulled a group of young Middle Eastern men out of line right in front of us. Racial profiling doesn't seem to be an issue there. Although the screening at Heathrow appeared to be thorough when we returned home my daughter discovered that she had accidently placed a 3" souvenir KGB pocket knife in a pocket of her carry on bag. That bag had been x-rayed and searched twice by Heathrow security...

In Russia the only security screening was to check our passports once and then run our bags through a scanner. On a second flight within Russia they didn't check our id's at all.

Anyway I seem to have gotten off the topic here.

The message I got from the docu-drama is that our government, the CIA and the FBI are all equally guilty of failing us. The government and the security agencies were too bloated with bureaucrats playing politics to respond to the situation with the speed and sense of urgency that were necessary for a better outcome.

I don't think it matters which of the two major political parties was, is or will be in power. I have lost confidence in both of them.

 

[tonyexpress]

I thought the "Path to 9/11" was a well-crafted dramatic interpretation of what rendered the United States vulnerable to terrorist attack under both the Clinton and Bush administrations. The bureaucracy is what has failed us and continues to do so and until something dramatically changes we will have trouble reacting swiftly.

Why all the hysteria by the left in not showing this film?? Condi was just as inept as some in the Clinton administration yet you didn't see the Republicans crying. I just don't get it!!

The flim makes it's point and we should, even more importantly Washington should, learn something from it.

 

[Slothrop]

Cheryl,

I was not endorsing flying without ID, just pointing out that it is not REQUIRED for DOMESTIC travel.

The events shown in the Disney/ABC production regarding Atta boarding the AA flight in Boston DID NOT HAPPEN.

It is a shame that people take away any lessons from this presentation, because it is not factual, yet pretends to be.
There is no delineation between fact and fiction in this production at all, and that is the problem many people had with it.

Interesting to note that Bush sitting in the Florida classroom was not shown, yet a fictional scene highlighting Sandy Berger was the climax of the first episode.

Tony (Mr. Cheryl?),

If you consider 'The Path to 9/11 to be well crafted, suffice it to say we have different tastes.

 

[moreluck]

"It is a shame that people take away any lessons from this presentation, because it is not factual, yet pretends to be."

On the contrary......I think people should take away lessons from every experience in life.....real or imaginary.

 

[Slothrop]

On the contrary......I think people should take away lessons from every experience in life.....real or imaginary.

If one cannot differentiate between reality and imaginary, I would hazard to guess that any lessons learned would be tenuous, at best.

 

[moreluck]

Tenuous at best.....? I guess there's no lessons to be learned here......

Imagine there's no heaven
It's easy if you try
No hell below us
Above us only sky
Imagine all the people
Living for today...

Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion too
Imagine all the people
Living life in peace...

You may say I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will be as one

Imagine no possessions
I wonder if you can
No need for greed or hunger
A brotherhood of man
Imagine all the people
Sharing all the world...

 

[Slothrop]

Having imagination is not the same as not distinguishing between what is real and what is imaginary.

I do find you use of 'Imagine' to be somewhat ironic, though.

This is a song espousing no religion, no wealth, no borders, and the equality of races. All of these *dreams* seem to be contrary to your wishes, at least as you've expressed them on this board in any political/Katrina thread; which is not to say I can't imagine that you're a wonderful person in real life

 

[moreluck]

Well, nuff said......because I do have a REAL life that need my attention right now. Want to come to the painting party? The color is a warm sage green and it's looking wonderful!

 

[tieguy]

Sigggghhhhhh Susie slothrop can be such a distraction........

Back to the show. Docu Drama does not necessarily represent a factual representation of the facts. I would certainly believe it did a much better job then Michael Moores piece.

I saw episode one. The Clinton years -

Lets see. Impotent leadership was exhibited in response to the looming Al Quaida threat. Certainly believable.

CIA operatives represented that were dedicated patriots. Well thanks to the liberal left we all know that there are no CIA agents that are such. How outrageous to show these evil CIA agents as dedicated soldiers fighting for our common good.

Cruise missels fired at the baby factory and empty terrorist training camp. Yep it happened. Did clinton rush into that decision to distract the Monica Lewinsky hunt. Probably.

Did clinton have a better opportunity to catch Bin Laden then Bush had prior to 9/11. Very likely.

Were they ineffective in adequately recognizing the bin Laden threat. No doubt. World trade center bombing number 1 reinforced by the kenyen embassy bombing should have been enough. It was not.

Does it reinforce the point that our efforts to appease world opinion often result in our impotently standing there with our genitals in our hands when some third rate slug B-slaps us. It should and does in that sense it was extremely factual.

The war on terror was started after 9/11. It should have started immediately after world trade center bombing number one. It didn't.
Whether Madeline Albright said hand me the caviar and champagne or actually said hand me the champagne and caviar as some 9/11 experts claim is totally irrelevant. In my humble opinion the docu drama adequately reflects our impotence in identifying and neutralizing this threat. It actually includes the Clinton administration into the blame game which will of course upset the former Clinton aides who have done a terrific job of pushing all the blame on Bushs six months prior to 9/11. Clarke included.

 

[Slothrop]

tie, beegdadday, upssup...

Nice to have you back. No hits on the singles site you were looking for casual sex on? Yep, I saw your profile....anyway, back to the topic at hand.

There is no use trying to go through your badly spelled and poorly laid out points, instead, let me ask you one question...Why did G W Bush not kill bin Laden when he had the chance? At least Clinton tried to, but W refused to.

In fact, Bush passed on killing over 100 Al Qaeda earlier this year, as reported in the news yesterday, complete with photos. If only Bush would go after our real enemies as vigorously as he goes after the press...imagine.

 

[DS]

slothrop...why are you spying on tie?
its none of your, (or our) business what he does in his spare time, and sharing it was unethical at least.
and true or not, what possible reason would you have to post that?

 

[tieguy]

lol, Is Susie spreading rumors about me? Susie is very frustrated. Perhaps I should take her off ignore and read her comments. I may have a pending slander case to help me take her millions.

But no that would give her the attention she craves , better to leave her in ignoresville.

 

[tonyexpress]

The Path to Hysteria

OpinionJournal - Extra

 

[Slothrop]

Think Progress Path to 9/11 Writer Slams Critics, Defends Movie As Totally Accurate

Or you could just Google the lies.

 

[tieguy]

I thought the "Path to 9/11" was a well-crafted dramatic interpretation of what rendered the United States vulnerable to terrorist attack under both the Clinton and Bush administrations. The bureaucracy is what has failed us and continues to do so and until something dramatically changes we will have trouble reacting swiftly.

Why all the hysteria by the left in not showing this film?? Condi was just as inept as some in the Clinton administration yet you didn't see the Republicans crying. I just don't get it!!

The flim makes it's point and we should, even more importantly Washington should, learn something from it.

The hysteria comes because the left has been very good at putting all the blame on the bush administrations doorstep when bush was barely in power more then half a year.
This is the first piece I have seen played on a major network that actually tries to give the clinton administration their fair share of the blame.

 

[Slothrop]

Free Democracy: FRANK RICH: The Longer the War, the Larger the Lies

 

[moreluck]

Who has the time to read all of these sites, columns, etc. ?? Can't people just post an opinion or a statement and wait for the bombardment?

If I want to read a magazine, I'll pick up the Nt'l Enquirer and get the REAL TRUTH !!

 

[Slothrop]

Who has the time to read all of these sites, columns, etc. ?? Can't people just post an opinion or a statement and wait for the bombardment?

If I want to read a magazine, I'll pick up the Nt'l Enquirer and get the REAL TRUTH !!

As said by someone who spent 5 hours watching the slop in question, and spends countless hours here cutting & pasting jokes & recipes.