OJS certification & discipline for performance

[purplesky]

You mentioned that it takes you 30 minutes to deliver to the prison. Is this one stop or are you making several stops within the prison complex? Only reason I am asking is that we have many prisons up here and each has their own delivery criteria. We have a max security where they meet us in the parking lot and we transfer to their vehicle. We have a medium where we have to cart everything in and then separate facility and inmate. We have a minimum where we back up to a dock and are in and gone in 5 minutes. We have a substance abuse facility where everything is brought to the office. Our prison deliveries can range from as little as 5 to as much as 30 minutes.

Driving 5 fewer miles will not lower your SPORH by 3.

Production terminations will become a reality sooner than most of would like to believe.

Sorry but have to disagree with you on production terminations. Its not legal first of all because we have a contract that does not recognize production. If UPS could truly fire employees for production issues they would be all over it. Yes they will intimidate and bully but what else is new? If UPS goes down this road you will see a class action for violation of the labor agreement. Arbitration would not be on this road. You see you cant change the rules in the middle of the game. The law is very clear on this. Another issue would be age and sex discrimination. Its a slippery slope.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

Age and sex discrimination are clearly outlined in the current contract. Production standards will be addressed in 2013 IMO.

We have a driver in my center who is consistently an hour over. One day our dispatch sup met me on road and we chatted and the driver's name came up. I asked the sup if the route had a bad allowance or any other reason for this and he told me that both cover drivers, who are not among the better cover drivers in the bldg, easily beat his numbers. I then asked if they run their lunches and he said no so this driver is being targeted for production issues.

 

[purplesky]

Age and sex discrimination are clearly outlined in the current contract. Production standards will be addressed in 2013 IMO.

We have a driver in my center who is consistently an hour over. One day our dispatch sup met me on road and we chatted and the driver's name came up. I asked the sup if the route had a bad allowance or any other reason for this and he told me that both cover drivers, who are not among the better cover drivers in the bldg, easily beat his numbers. I then asked if they run their lunches and he said no so this driver is being targeted for production issues.

Ok if they change the contract in 2013 than thats a different story. UPS has been trying to implement production in the contract for decades and there is noway the membership will ever approve a contract that has it. It wont ever be on the table. Because UPS at that point would have to present the math to the union. The math changes all the time. Its a floating number and its a fantasy number. Any production standard would have to be spelled out and UPS will never do it. Think about it. We have drivers that have been targeted as slow and old and they were given warning letters and BLAH BLAH BLAH. But not 1 driver has ever been fired for production or anything related to it. This is not a new issue at UPS as you know. The production threat game has always been a part of the UPS CULTURE.

 

[DukeofBoxes]

You mentioned that it takes you 30 minutes to deliver to the prison. Is this one stop or are you making several stops within the prison complex? Only reason I am asking is that we have many prisons up here and each has their own delivery criteria. We have a max security where they meet us in the parking lot and we transfer to their vehicle. We have a medium where we have to cart everything in and then separate facility and inmate. We have a minimum where we back up to a dock and are in and gone in 5 minutes. We have a substance abuse facility where everything is brought to the office. Our prison deliveries can range from as little as 5 to as much as 30 minutes.

Driving 5 fewer miles will not lower your SPORH by 3.

Production terminations will become a reality sooner than most of would like to believe.

I deliver to a Max Security, with multiple stops inside and out, and the days I was OJS'd they made me wait more than 20 minutes at the gate each day. It couldn't have worked out better for me in that sense. I think where I made up time was later in my resi sections, where I had lots of DRs but I also got more signatures than I usually do also.

 

[PobreCarlos]

purplesky;

"Bonus", based on standard industrial production measurement, was acknowledged and approved by the union decades ago. To say that the membership "wouldn't approve it" is like locking the barn door after the livestock left at this point in time; i.e. - it's a case of attempting to ignore history and reality. And to say that production terminations don't exist is to ignore reality as well; to my direct knowledge, there have been terminations based on "production" here and there at least since the implementation of elemental time studies in the mid-to-late 1970's. Granted, the Teamsters don't advertise the fact...but since when have the Teamsters been forthright about anything that might put their bureaucracy in a harsh light?

Perhaps people need to be disabused of this idea that, simply because it's "not in the contract'", the company can't do it. Fact is, unless it's specifically prohibited in the "contract", the company can manage it's operations in any fashion it wants.

Lot of Teamsters don't like to come to terms with that concept. Not sure why, since even the briefest view of the union's history would demonstrate that union involvement in the business operations of it's members employers is detrimental to their job security; in the unions core industry alone, there are well more than a million Teamsters who lost their jobs on that basis who could attest to its validity.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

disabused?

 

[purplesky]

purplesky;

"Bonus", based on standard industrial production measurement, was acknowledged and approved by the union decades ago. To say that the membership "wouldn't approve it" is like locking the barn door after the livestock left at this point in time; i.e. - it's a case of attempting to ignore history and reality. And to say that production terminations don't exist is to ignore reality as well; to my direct knowledge, there have been terminations based on "production" here and there at least since the implementation of elemental time studies in the mid-to-late 1970's. Granted, the Teamsters don't advertise the fact...but since when have the Teamsters been forthright about anything that might put their bureaucracy in a harsh light?

Perhaps people need to be disabused of this idea that, simply because it's "not in the contract'", the company can't do it. Fact is, unless it's specifically prohibited in the "contract", the company can manage it's operations in any fashion it wants.

Lot of Teamsters don't like to come to terms with that concept. Not sure why, since even the briefest view of the union's history would demonstrate that union involvement in the business operations of it's members employers is detrimental to their job security; in the unions core industry alone, there are well more than a million Teamsters who lost their jobs on that basis who could attest to its validity.

Thats a fancy post PobreCarlos but we are talking about UPS so stay on topic. Yes you are correct that production standards are not in the contract and that is why it is not an issue. There are thousands of UPS union members and you cannot name any that were terminated due too shall we say a lack of "SENSE OF URGENCY". Yes many UPSERS have been fired over the years but not from lack of production. Its not in the contract! UPS has one of the most efficient and productive workforces in the world and they are UNION!! GO FIGURE!

 

[grgrcr88]

The O/A is why he was OJSing me. He said that one stop that was taking me the 30 minutes was what was killing my O/A, and that he would have that changed to give me a greater allowance. He also said the total miles traveled will affect my sporh, which is why the 3rd day I hit an 18 (I traveled about 5 miles less than average). I can't argue too much, I know what times I punched out when he was with me, but I still can't believe that last day jumped my sporh up by 3 stops per hour!

If you think you cannot or will not be disciplined for not maintaining your SPORH you are being led down the wrong path!! We have multiple drivers that are in the progresive disciplne process as we speak for less than 1 stop/hour, one is less than .5!!

It is happening and will only get worse.

 

[grgrcr88]

See link below!!

http://www.browncafe.com/community/threads/production-termination.212155/

 

[PobreCarlos]

purplesky;

Guess you didn't read what I wrote, did you? In short, I think I was very MUCH "on topic", and - if you cared to notice - I stated flat-out that....

"to my DIRECT KNOWLEDGE, there have been terminations based on "production" here and there at least since the implementation of elemental time studies in the mid-to-late 1970's". Got that? In short, damn right I could name some.

As for your comment of...

"UPS has one of the most efficient and productive workforces in the world and they are UNION!! GO FIGURE! "

...let me ask you; do you think that UPS's workforce is that "productive" because they are UNION? I.e. - did the union hire it, train it, keep it motivated, etc? And how does all that jive with the fact that UPS's workforce is ***primarily NON-Teamster*** today?

Look, "purplesky", if you want to keep your head buried in the sand (and, in the process, keep the posterior part of your body exposed to that "purplesky" name-sake of yours), then you go right ahead; after all, that no different from what Teamsters generally have been doing for decades. But what has that attitude got them? I'd submit that losing the jobs of well more than a million members might be reason enough for guys like you to raise your heads up out of the sand to face reality.

 

[air1ups]

[/COLOR]

.55...what a joke. Depending on your load quality and number of "cuts" that someone is given a sporh can be 2 or 3 off an average. Sorry to bring back this 3 month old thread but just wondering if anyone who posted here, of folks getting warning letters at their centers, have any new info on any of this?

I am a 21 yr Delivery Driver and have been on the same delivery area for 14 yrs. We have not had time studies in our bldg. since 1992. I am a very active Steward for 14 of those years and represent apporx. 54 full and part time employees. Since April 2009 I have had approx. 9 OJS rides and have subsequently been written up at least 4 times for "failing to maintain acceptable levels of performance". UPS is now looking at and every little thing I do and trying to discipline me on failing to follow policies, procedures and instructions. This is after filing approximately 50 plus grievances on behalf of hourlys.( from supervisors working to over 9.5 etc.) I have at least 2 discharges against me since August 2009 and they are working on a third!!!!! My B.A. and I have filed grievances on my behalf under Art. 7 and I have yet to have a day off but I see it coming. On the days they ride along I have a "perfect" load. I document everything in voice notes even when they are riding with me ( voice notes on my Iphone ). They look at me very strange but it has to be done to cover my butt. My story is very lengthy and I am trying to give you a summary of what brown is doing to their employee and ultimately the level of service I am going to give their customer. An unhappy driver means their customer will suffer when the employee finally gets to the attitude of, if that is what you want that is what you get!!! My OJS ride states I need to improve on my customer contact and efficient use of EDD. After my first write up they attempted to work on my DOL which I have done for them 3 times and they claim they have lost it all 3 times. I even did the number breaks on each and every street corner and have labeled my shelf lips to help my preload person. Then, I get a new truck and so goes the computer generated labels I print from my laptop and printer and I refuse to go to that extent any more. They keep telling me they are going to get with me to fix my DOL which has yet to happen!!! I remind them often. I only file for the over 9.5on the days they ride with me and do an OJS. On those days they usually leave my entire area intact and the days they use to compare to the ojs days they take off my in town residential stops thusly decreasing my SPORH. I have always run 11.5 to 12.2 depending on the work load and they claim I should be at 13.4. Sorry this is so lenghty , this is on going as of the date of posting. Stay tuned.

 

[Phantom Lord]

First off, why does nobody want to worry about their performance on road? Why, for $30 an hour, is it too much to be able to keep one's self on task through the entire day? We do have a company to support here, getting/having a job is not all about the individual; the individual does what the company tells him/her to do (which ostensibly makes the company profitable), and the individual is compensated for those efforts. If anyone insists on compensation without worrying about the profitability aspect of their employment, that person needs to re-evaluate the situation and realize that without a profitable company, there won't be a job for them to have. And if/when that happens, go and cry to the Union: I'm sure they'll provide you with gainful employment as a consolation prize.

Work measurement is the best tool that management has to convey to employees what goals they need to hit to maintain adequate profitability. A good portion of that profit, in turn, goes toward new vehicles, new technology, and marketing, in order to maintain and develop market share while increasing productivity through innovation.

So you guys that don't worry about production, then complain about your ancient package cars? I've got no sympathy whatsoever. You and your fellows constantly screw yourselves on that one.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

Work measurement is the best tool that management has to convey to employees what goals they need to hit to maintain adequate profitability. A good portion of that profit, in turn, goes toward new vehicles, new technology, and marketing, in order to maintain and develop market share while increasing productivity through innovation.

Valid argument with solid foundation; however, if you had bothered to read any of the preceding posts, you would have found that it is the work measurement itself that is the issue, not the employee failing to achieve their stated goal. We all know that we are very well compensated and, for the most part, work very hard in return for that compensation. We all are aware that it is our efforts that enable UPS to continue to grow as a company. What frustrates us is the use of a number as the end all, be all of our employment.

Set a reasonable goal with positive reinforcement and you will get the results you desire. Set an unreasonable goal with negative reinforcement and the results will most certainly disappoint.

 

[Phantom Lord]

What frustrates us is the use of a number as the end all, be all of our employment.

Fair enough.

My problem doesn't lie with the people that have a bad time study and take flak for it; they have all my sympathy. That's no way to supervise.

My problem is with those people that have it stuck in their head that they are owed a paycheck, and the union should protect them from having to work too hard to get it. Case in point: our entire center was time-studied again earlier in the year; the first day of the new time studies, we came in at about 8 hours overallowed for 60 drivers. Those are the best numbers that the center has ever seen, and the entire center was congratulated and thanked for their efforts. Several drivers who ran scratch that first day went right back to their regular overallowed the following day with a drop in SPORH. It's very frustrating that the union makes it so difficult to bring any kind of discipline to bear against such individuals for their production, since it's not that hard to figure out that some of them slowed down just because.

And it seems like there are far too many individuals with that same mindset on these boards, if this thread is any indication.

 

[grgrcr88]

I am quit certain that is the exception rather than the rule there, phantom. No argument that there are a few out there that will get away with everything they can, but for the most part we are all a very hard working group of people at UPS. The problem lies in the fact that it is NEVER hard enough. The way of UPS has alwys been The harder you work, The more they give you. It does not take too awful long to figure that out, which in turn leads to the attitude of to hell with it, I'm just not going to try hard at all anymore!!

 

[tarbar66]

So you guys that don't worry about production, then complain about your ancient package cars? I've got no sympathy whatsoever.

I know that my production goal for SPORH with my "Old Car" was 11.5 . When I got a "New Car" I know I would get done an hour sooner on average. Within the month my SPORH was increased.

Yes I was on a rural route that would average 200 miles a day.

The cost savings for my OT and the 100% better MPG over the old car was reason enough to justify my need for the new car.

 

[UnconTROLLed]

What I do not understand is, when someone says a bunch of mumbo jumbo about time studies and how drivers then drop their pace after the time study.

Infact, there are drivers that do just the opposite. They take their lunches between the correct hours, they take their breaks when it is time, they drive the speed limit, they do not run, they stop INSIDE every pickup on the route and make sure they have nothing isntead of beeping and a wave...goes on and on

It goes both ways IMO

 

[tieguy]

Thats a fancy post PobreCarlos but we are talking about UPS so stay on topic. Yes you are correct that production standards are not in the contract and that is why it is not an issue. There are thousands of UPS union members and you cannot name any that were terminated due too shall we say a lack of "SENSE OF URGENCY". Yes many UPSERS have been fired over the years but not from lack of production. Its not in the contract! UPS has one of the most efficient and productive workforces in the world and they are UNION!! GO FIGURE!

I think I can help you here purple. the contract was never meant to list all methods and all criteria for discharge. Here is a case where someone was fired for production:

http://www.browncafe.com/community/threads/production-termination.212155/

 

[grgrcr88]

Lets all be very clear here. There is a huge difference between over allowed/under allowed and SPORH. The Union absolutely does not recognize any time study done by UPS for any purpose whether it be for bonus, production, discipline, etc...

However SPORH is something you can be disciplined for, if you have ben given the 3 day lock in ride!!

The difference is that over under is calculated by a set of allowances, times given by the company to every little thing you do. They are very random and are easily changed and will never be recognized by the Union. SPORH is just what it says, Stops Per On Road Hour. simply put it the amount of time spent on road(not paid day, on road) divided by the total number of stops(delivery and pick-up). There is no way to change these numbers and are not some randomly generated allowances by UPS. This is why the Union accepts this as a "performance" standard.

If you go out for three days with a supervisor and run 18.5 SPORH and after he gets off car with you, you start running 18.0. you can expect to see discipline letters!!

The good news is that if you can prove that there is a change since the sup left you that has slowed you down you might be able to get it reduced!!

 

[soberups]

However SPORH is something you can be disciplined for, if you have ben given the 3 day lock in ride!!

There is no such thing as a "3 day lock in ride" mentioned in the contract.

The one successful production termination that I am aware of involved an employee who ran something like 15 SPORH while supervised and 10 or 11 by himself. He was screwing the company and he deserved to get fired.

There is a normal statistical variation in SPORH that will inevitably occur on a daily basis. My local has taken the position...successfully...that if the company wants to discipline based upon statistically insignificant decreases in unsuervised SPORH they will have to provide documentation that shows (a) the weight of each package picked up and delivered on the supervised vs unsupervised days (b) the exact duration of each and every traffic delay, stop sign and red light (c) the exact distance walked off for each stop(d) the number of irregs, signature stops, send-agains and COD's handled on each day and (e) the number of times the handtruck was used on each day in question.

This is all data that is, theoretically at least, available thru the Telematics system that the company has invested so much money in.

So far, the company has declined to make all of this data available and no one has faced anything more severe than a warning letter over production.