production ride
- Thread starter productionproblem
- Start date
dannyboy
From the promised LAND
Tie
Had a customer put it in writing that they wanted all their packages left on top of the trash can behind the house.
You ever hear of a trash man that would go behind the house to get the trash for you if you forgot to set it out? Me either. And in this case it had a 22 grand diamond ring that the driver left sitting on the can. This actually happened here.
Anyway, if a customer requests that you do something illegal or wrong, does that make it right? No. While the customer needs to be king in our business, the customer is not always right.
That being said, there are many customers that have put in a "mail box" just for UPS deliveries, I'm sure you know that already. They are only for our use or for FDX to use and are never used for mail. IF they want us to leave them in the mail box, then they have to install one for us to use.
Using the postal service mail box is against the law and against UPS policy. Period.
d
Had a customer put it in writing that they wanted all their packages left on top of the trash can behind the house.
You ever hear of a trash man that would go behind the house to get the trash for you if you forgot to set it out? Me either. And in this case it had a 22 grand diamond ring that the driver left sitting on the can. This actually happened here.
Anyway, if a customer requests that you do something illegal or wrong, does that make it right? No. While the customer needs to be king in our business, the customer is not always right.
That being said, there are many customers that have put in a "mail box" just for UPS deliveries, I'm sure you know that already. They are only for our use or for FDX to use and are never used for mail. IF they want us to leave them in the mail box, then they have to install one for us to use.
Using the postal service mail box is against the law and against UPS policy. Period.
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browniehound
Well-Known Member
dannyboy said:
How does putting a letter in a mailbox comparable to stealing? You're comparing apples and oranges here. How can you say the level of wrong is not an issue. One is stealing the other is cutting a corner that does not adveresly affect anybody.
I've never heard this happen before as long as you use the mailbox after the postman has been there
I'm making an issue because you act like you've never broken a law in your life
dannyboy
From the promised LAND
Remove me from your perspective of right and wrong. Whether or not I have done anything wrong in my life is not an issue, unless of course you want to. What is at issue is your reluctance to accept the fact that what you are doing is illegal and against company policy.
First off, if you rob a bank and dont get caught, is it still wrong? If you rape a woman, and she never presses charges, you did nothing wrong?
You base your respect and observations of right and wrong on if you get caught or not. Right an wrong are still right and wrong, regardless of if we get caught or not.
We have had issues here on drivers leaving packages in the mail boxes. If done long enough, you will also. Hopefully it will not be such that you no longer work here. For sure, if you leave it, make sure you put in the remarks column that you left it in the mail box, and then leave the delivery notice on the front door.
If not they could fire you for dishonesty when it comes to your delivery records. We have had that problem too at our center in the past.
Brownie, you know what is right and what is wrong. You have been shown the reasons and the rules. Govern yourself accordingly, but when the crap hits the fan, remember, we tried to tell you.
d
First off, if you rob a bank and dont get caught, is it still wrong? If you rape a woman, and she never presses charges, you did nothing wrong?
You base your respect and observations of right and wrong on if you get caught or not. Right an wrong are still right and wrong, regardless of if we get caught or not.
We have had issues here on drivers leaving packages in the mail boxes. If done long enough, you will also. Hopefully it will not be such that you no longer work here. For sure, if you leave it, make sure you put in the remarks column that you left it in the mail box, and then leave the delivery notice on the front door.
If not they could fire you for dishonesty when it comes to your delivery records. We have had that problem too at our center in the past.Brownie, you know what is right and what is wrong. You have been shown the reasons and the rules. Govern yourself accordingly, but when the crap hits the fan, remember, we tried to tell you.
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productionproblem
New Member
I know several individuals who have left parcels in mailboxes and they've ended up being disciplined by the company. There might be a mailman who doesn't care if a UPS driver uses a mailbox, but when said postman misses a day of work, who fills in for him. You're better off playing it safe on this one.
This conversation reminds me of the saying, "yours is not to question why, yours is just to do or die." Look, brownie, you are an hourly employee. One of the key phrases in our collective bargaining agreement is "work as instructed." You have been instructed by the Company (in the 340 methods), the Post Office (in the law), and the Union (in the Contract.) One of the hardest and most important lessons you need to learn to continue to be gainfully employed by UPS is to do what you are told. Maybe you know better than your management team how to do your job. Doesn't matter. You haven't been empowered to make this call. As Danny said, you have been forewarned. I will tell you the same thing. I went to the Panel as an observer (Union Steward training.) I will tell you this. Nobody there was being fired because their SPORH wasn't good enough or they were way over allowed. They were fired because they were cutting corners, and they got caught. Dishonesty is a broad brush UPS loves to paint with. Don't give them a canvas.
dannyboy
From the promised LAND
Brown
I guess when it comes to being a shop steward, the one thing I remember the most over the years is when nothing was going on. No one in trouble, no one getting canned. Peace.
And the way to peace is for the hourly to understand the game. Dont give them a hook to hang the termination on. Do things as instructed, and if instructed to do something other than what is written, then to get it clarified in front of a shop steward.
Remember, when it comes time to go before a panel, I dont care what your sup told you, if it is against what is written, he will have memory loss. Guaranteed. If not, it is he that will be fired.
Being a shop steward is like owning a gun. Its there if you ever need it, but its better to not ever need it.
But there are always those that want to push the edge, usually new drivers with less than 5-8 years in. Just long enough to be cocky and think they know it all, but yet too short to really understand the game and how it is played.
d
I guess when it comes to being a shop steward, the one thing I remember the most over the years is when nothing was going on. No one in trouble, no one getting canned. Peace.
And the way to peace is for the hourly to understand the game. Dont give them a hook to hang the termination on. Do things as instructed, and if instructed to do something other than what is written, then to get it clarified in front of a shop steward.
Remember, when it comes time to go before a panel, I dont care what your sup told you, if it is against what is written, he will have memory loss. Guaranteed. If not, it is he that will be fired.
Being a shop steward is like owning a gun. Its there if you ever need it, but its better to not ever need it.
But there are always those that want to push the edge, usually new drivers with less than 5-8 years in. Just long enough to be cocky and think they know it all, but yet too short to really understand the game and how it is played.
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browniehound
Well-Known Member
Are you out of your mind? You're comparing leaving a letter in a mailbox with bank robbery and rape of a women. wow
dannyboy
From the promised LAND
Brownie
Ive worked with the severely mentally retarded and they grasp concepts faster than you.
You just dont get it, do you. Wrong is wrong, right is right. In this case it is black and white, and you are trying to color with shades of gray. Instead of understanding what is attempting to be conveyed to you, you act like a
and take issues with examples. No, they are not the same, but the principle is. And that is where you fail the grade, you have no principles, according to what you have been posting here.
So, you have been told. You know the score. As far as anything else, you are a waste of time.
You can teach anybody anything, but you can not teach anything to those that think they know it all. Or dont want to know. And seem to have a real issue with the truth.
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Ive worked with the severely mentally retarded and they grasp concepts faster than you.
You just dont get it, do you. Wrong is wrong, right is right. In this case it is black and white, and you are trying to color with shades of gray. Instead of understanding what is attempting to be conveyed to you, you act like a
and take issues with examples. No, they are not the same, but the principle is. And that is where you fail the grade, you have no principles, according to what you have been posting here.So, you have been told. You know the score. As far as anything else, you are a waste of time.
You can teach anybody anything, but you can not teach anything to those that think they know it all. Or dont want to know. And seem to have a real issue with the truth.
d
Bottom line here is it is a Federal offense to leave packages not sent through the USPS in USPS Mailboxes - Period. If anyone is putting UPS packages in mailboxes stop now. It's not really up for debate as it is prohibited by Federal law.
Tooner - DCS allows the editing of Driver Release locations for download into the DIAD, but no way Mailboxes should have been added in. It needs to be removed. I would be happy forward this info to the DIAD guys here. Then the center manager can be notified they need remove the mailbox reference NOW. DR to a mailbox is NOT an option. The center never should have put it in for the drivers to use.
Tyrone - FYI - ALL information that pertains to UPS and how we do and/or conduct our business is Proprietary - the methods should be removed off of whatever website you have it on. Permission has to be acquired in order to post any UPS information. If permission is acquired, then you can post it, but not before. Not trying to bust on you, but if legal gets wind of this it could cause you some problems.
Tooner - DCS allows the editing of Driver Release locations for download into the DIAD, but no way Mailboxes should have been added in. It needs to be removed. I would be happy forward this info to the DIAD guys here. Then the center manager can be notified they need remove the mailbox reference NOW. DR to a mailbox is NOT an option. The center never should have put it in for the drivers to use.
Tyrone - FYI - ALL information that pertains to UPS and how we do and/or conduct our business is Proprietary - the methods should be removed off of whatever website you have it on. Permission has to be acquired in order to post any UPS information. If permission is acquired, then you can post it, but not before. Not trying to bust on you, but if legal gets wind of this it could cause you some problems.
Go Jules23, if you do not believe me I will take a pic and send it to you. I said I did it once, and then I thought better of doing it, but since it is an option, I think it should be removed. Ill put it behind it, hang it on it but not in it. And last week I got an OCA that specifically said pick it up in the mailbox, not the FD.. What would you do then??????? WWJD, (what would jules do) Was it put in the board specifically for Basic, and if so why bother, when you can leave it at the stoop and we are not responsible?
"I got an OCA that specifically said pick it up in the mailbox"
Ha! Me too! The mailman got there literally 1 minute before me. I had to chase him up the street to get the package. You think when he called in the OCA, someone would have said, "Don't leave it in the mailbox"!!!!
Ha! Me too! The mailman got there literally 1 minute before me. I had to chase him up the street to get the package. You think when he called in the OCA, someone would have said, "Don't leave it in the mailbox"!!!!
toonertoo said:
Thank you *bow*. I believe you that it's in there. Trust me I have seen some crazy stuff in the ops. I used to field test all this stuff, but moved to a different part of the group a while ago. It's not the driver's fault it's in there -if I was a driver and saw it, and didn't have the years of experience, I might think it was ok, too. Then I do know differently. The center should NEVER put a driver in position of doing something unethical or illegal. Yeah, yeah, I know it happens all the time.
Your scenario is interesting because the 800 number people (which really, can we blow them up - useless) should know the rules and not allow a customer to put something in the mailbox. In this case, depending on the center - I would contact the center, note the situation in the DIAD and have the center team call the customer and tell them it's illegal to do that. Then I'd pick up the package and make the service
That's what jules would do. I'm probably wrong and someone will point that out to me, I'm sure.Jules, I took the file off the website as soon as your compadre (0007) threatened me. It's a shame that the methods aren't posted at every center, and given to each employee, and that when they are made available on a small corner of the internets, folks are threatened. I suppose it's easier to intimidate employees when they are unsure of the 'proper' way to do their job.jules23 said:
If it wasn't for the non-disclosure agreement I signed, I could really tell you a few things. Good day, sir.
Maybe someone from IE can get the mailbox dr option changed to parcelbox. I had a customer on one of my routes custom build a wooden box for that purpose and attached it to a tree. They even put a sign on the box "FOR UPS DELIVERIES" Problem solved.
Good luck if you do get that production ride. Do everything the same way you do every day. If you are following the methods, great. If you're not following the methods the sup can tell you what you've been doing wrong and you will be a better driver for it, at least in thier minds. Don't run, walk. Keep your doors locked. Allways carry your keys. Allways honk your horn and call out UPS. Never leave your ignition running when you leave the vehicle.
No employee should be afraid of a production ride. It is a tool by which the company wants to find out if you are doing the job correctly. If you are it will show. If not, make the corrections they tell you to and use those methods each and every day in the future.
Don't let the fear of the unknown stop you from filing that grievance for the 9.5 violation. You will be doing yourself and any future drivers on that route a favor by sticking up for yourself. Just think, after they fix the route to keep it under 9.5 and then decide to bid a new route, the next driver wont have to go through the same crap.
Good luck if you do get that production ride. Do everything the same way you do every day. If you are following the methods, great. If you're not following the methods the sup can tell you what you've been doing wrong and you will be a better driver for it, at least in thier minds. Don't run, walk. Keep your doors locked. Allways carry your keys. Allways honk your horn and call out UPS. Never leave your ignition running when you leave the vehicle.
No employee should be afraid of a production ride. It is a tool by which the company wants to find out if you are doing the job correctly. If you are it will show. If not, make the corrections they tell you to and use those methods each and every day in the future.
Don't let the fear of the unknown stop you from filing that grievance for the 9.5 violation. You will be doing yourself and any future drivers on that route a favor by sticking up for yourself. Just think, after they fix the route to keep it under 9.5 and then decide to bid a new route, the next driver wont have to go through the same crap.
browniehound
Well-Known Member
jules23 said:Then I'd pick up the package and make the service
Don't worry, Danny will point that out to you as he does with everybody else
dannyboy
From the promised LAND
Actually the proper thing to do would be to pick the package up, but then follow up with management. That is if you were lucky enough to get the package and not the mail man.
Brownie, One of the things that makes me what I am is that I try and learn from those that know more than I. That is how I know what I do, Ive learned it from many people and lots of them knew lots more than me.
Its when you refuse to learn and change the way you deliver, or in life in general, you refuse to listen. In those cases you then must learn the hard way, usually by it costing you money, time away from work, etc etc.
So like I said, either listen or not. All I can do is put the truth out there for you. Just because you dont like the truth does not change the fact it is the truth.
Just because I post when I disagree with things does not mean I disagree with all you post. But since there are many more lurkers than posters, the correct information should be posted, and if something is blatantly wrong, someone should post the correction.
I have posted that correction, along with others. What you and others do with that is up to you.
Best
d
Brownie, One of the things that makes me what I am is that I try and learn from those that know more than I. That is how I know what I do, Ive learned it from many people and lots of them knew lots more than me.
Its when you refuse to learn and change the way you deliver, or in life in general, you refuse to listen. In those cases you then must learn the hard way, usually by it costing you money, time away from work, etc etc.
So like I said, either listen or not. All I can do is put the truth out there for you. Just because you dont like the truth does not change the fact it is the truth.
Just because I post when I disagree with things does not mean I disagree with all you post. But since there are many more lurkers than posters, the correct information should be posted, and if something is blatantly wrong, someone should post the correction.
I have posted that correction, along with others. What you and others do with that is up to you.
Best
d
