Terminator'ed

[MR_Vengeance]

you can fire me now.........

 

[Will Work For PAS]

there's definitely more to this story. no manager wants to lose a driver at the start of the busiest two weeks of the year. many of you give the managers too much credit. they certainly aren't smart enough to spend all day putting out fires, taking conference calls, getting their division manager's feet stuck up their a**es, and still having time to play "play psycho games" with drivers. especially at peak.

 

[hoser]

I find it strange that you could be fired for anything right now. In the middle of peak....
Especially on such a flimsy charge...

As I've said before....... There must be more to the story!

I think the harrassment thing has just gone too far.
I guess if I was surrounded by 6 quarterbacks from, ............hell I dont know football, but you get the meaning, I might be feeling harrassed.
Boobs, not a big deal, if you work with men you hear it. I would rather hear men talk about my boobs than women...........
If a guy works in a female field, such as nursing, how much does he have to hear about "cycles" and stuff before he is offended?
Unless someone is fearful of losing a job, or being assaulted, the sexual thing should be a thing of the past, especially if working in a male dominated job.
If you cant handle it, go back to the kitchen. Let men be men, let girls be girls and stop the crap of "i was in an area and I heard" Its so very infantile.

It's all about knowing your audience, Mademoiselle. You wouldn't say 'boobs' around the quiet soft spoken woman or even guy at work you know nothing of. But you would to the guy that you've worked with for 5 years, where you both met in the training class and went out for lunch together.

There's more to the OP than he's letting on. Don't make me do another psuedo-dialogue like I did towards the guy who got fired for time-wasting.

 

[Storm723]

At my previous job we were all told that it was not intention (of the person speaking) but perception of the person offended. You do not have to be talking to them; they can over hear you and take offense and turn you in for harassment.

Aspenleaf you are correct....sexual harrassment is a very sticky situation...there should have been a union rep - and that is really the only ground you have, unfortunately.

Sexual harassment is a form of sex discrimination that violates Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964.
Unwelcome sexual advances, requests for sexual favors, and other verbal or physical conduct of a sexual nature constitutes sexual harassment when submission to or rejection of this conduct explicitly or implicitly affects an individual's employment, unreasonably interferes with an individual's work performance or creates an intimidating, hostile or offensive work environment.
Sexual harassment can occur in a variety of circumstances, including but not limited to the following:

• The victim as well as the harasser may be a woman or a man. The victim does not have to be of the opposite sex.
• The harasser can be the victim's supervisor, an agent of the employer, a supervisor in another area, a co-worker, or a non-employee.
• The victim does not have to be the person harassed but could be anyone affected by the offensive conduct.
• Unlawful sexual harassment may occur without economic injury to or discharge of the victim.
• The harasser's conduct must be unwelcome.

It is helpful for the victim to directly inform the harasser that the conduct is unwelcome and must stop. The victim should use any employer complaint mechanism or grievance system available.

 

[Storm723]

Tell them you didn`t use the word "boobs in reference to breasts but rather in reference to the ctrs mgmt team as in "they are a bunch of boobs". You`ll be back in no time.

Seriously it is only sexual harasment if you used it toward someone. If you merely said it in conversation than it may be considered offensive but that is a completly different disiplinary action. Get a steward,if it`s the offensive side all you`ll have to do is point out the wide use of colorful language in the ctr and your clear.

I think you should really check out the laws of sexual harrasment these days -if this is what you really believe...unfortunately & sadly enough it is all about the victim and not the offender...

 

[Whaler31]

OKAY, After doing much homework..here is where I stand now:

#1) I talked to the Teamsters local and discovered that, even though I am paying "dues" as a seasonal full-time driver, I have no union representation whatsoever.

#2) I was terminated on-the-spot, for "sexual harrassment" although I was not even given the name of the employee who accused me, only that I "used the word 'boobs' with a female employee" Nor was I given a chance to respond to the charges, face my accuser, nor provided with any kind of proper "investigation" into the incident.

#3) This was quite sickening at the time, after pulling in a bulk-load at the end of the day, to have the center manager wave you over on the floor and tell you "you're fired-sexual harrasment-leave now, call in later in the week to get your last check AFTER you turn in your browns"

#4) I had been on-time and ready-to-work since the start, and had nothing but respect for management and staff from day ONE.....and this firing was the last 2 1/2 weeks of peak work, where I would have made the most pay of the whole gig.

#5) As far as center management, I had been getting 100% positive feedback up until that point, I was just air-ramp certified and given an airport gate card two days before. I was going to be the air-shuttle driver in the early AM and work 12 hour shifts doing bulk stops (drop-off and pick-ups) then meet a bunch of drivers at the air-drop to pick up their ground and bring back a FULL 1000 or 24' U- Haul to the center everyday.
(I had been doing just about everything a driver would have to do at UPS, driven every type of package car, and a bunch of big rental trucks, too).

#6) The morning on the day I was terminated, I was advised by the 2nd man in-charge, that I was being assigned a helper for the remainder of the season.

Go figure. Now I just feel dirty and wronged and soiled by doing nothing wrong. Just some 5 yr young union UPS female that wanted to flex her muscle with management at my expense. (I guess this was my "Merry Christmas" from her and UPS!)

NOW....now that I am basically screwed and need a job again, what am I supposed to say to new prospective employers as to the "reason for termination" at my last job??

My wife is totally disgusted by all of this, too, I don't need anyone but her...fake sexual harrassment b.s. ARGH!!

P.S.: Bless all of you folks for your ongoing advice!

 

[Whaler31]

The defense of yourself sounds Bogus. I think there is more to this than you let on.
If you respect all you co-workers? Why would you call some of them trucker-mouth female UPSers?
You've worked your butt off for the man? My question to you is how long have you driven for "The Man".
Major Bummer Dude.
If you didn't do it, then it means you ticked someone off doing something else.
I have none of the facts of your case, but your use of verbage is telling.

Sounds Bogus? Eh. You must be internal counsel for UPS!

I'm sure glad that the Federal Gov't EEOC,
The State Labor Board,
and even old UPS itself requires more to axe an employee with that type of charge!

Let's see...."Wrongful Termination", "Defamation of character", "Pain and Suffering" and let's not forget "Punitive Damages" either.

The only thing I was guilty of hard work-by the book.

The story I have told on here is 100% true. I didn't ask for this, nor would I ever wish it upon anyone. You don't play games like that, attacking peoples character. That is just asking for trouble, in my humble opinion.

On top of it all, I've never experienced ANYTHING like this before in my life.

 

[Griff]

That's a scam that you're paying dues and not getting representation.

 

[satellitedriver]

OKAY, After doing much homework..here is where I stand now:

#1) I talked to the Teamsters local and discovered that, even though I am paying "dues" as a seasonal full-time driver, I have no union representation whatsoever.

#2) I was terminated on-the-spot, for "sexual harrassment" although I was not even given the name of the employee who accused me, only that I "used the word 'boobs' with a female employee" Nor was I given a chance to respond to the charges, face my accuser, nor provided with any kind of proper "investigation" into the incident.

#3) This was quite sickening at the time, after pulling in a bulk-load at the end of the day, to have the center manager wave you over on the floor and tell you "you're fired-sexual harrasment-leave now, call in later in the week to get your last check AFTER you turn in your browns"

#4) I had been on-time and ready-to-work since the start, and had nothing but respect for management and staff from day ONE.....and this firing was the last 2 1/2 weeks of peak work, where I would have made the most pay of the whole gig.

#5) As far as center management, I had been getting 100% positive feedback up until that point, I was just air-ramp certified and given an airport gate card two days before. I was going to be the air-shuttle driver in the early AM and work 12 hour shifts doing bulk stops (drop-off and pick-ups) then meet a bunch of drivers at the air-drop to pick up their ground and bring back a FULL 1000 or 24' U- Haul to the center everyday.
(I had been doing just about everything a driver would have to do at UPS, driven every type of package car, and a bunch of big rental trucks, too).

#6) The morning on the day I was terminated, I was advised by the 2nd man in-charge, that I was being assigned a helper for the remainder of the season.

Go figure. Now I just feel dirty and wronged and soiled by doing nothing wrong. Just some 5 yr young union UPS female that wanted to flex her muscle with management at my expense. (I guess this was my "Merry Christmas" from her and UPS!)

NOW....now that I am basically screwed and need a job again, what am I supposed to say to new prospective employers as to the "reason for termination" at my last job??

My wife is totally disgusted by all of this, too, I don't need anyone but her...fake sexual harrassment b.s. ARGH!!

P.S.: Bless all of you folks for your ongoing advice!

Thank the "REAMSTERS" for their support.

 

[satellitedriver]

"....but your use of verbage is telling."

I wonder if his "verbage" includes terms such as "prejudiced" and "circumstantial" like yours.

He obviously hasn't been a criminal profiler as long as you.

1 trick pony
Once again, you only read what you want to see.
Where in my post did I use the terms "prejudiced" and "circumstantial"?
Your use of verbage is also telling.
There is a thing in the english written language called "voice". Your "voice" comes through your posts, clearly.
By the way, did I call him a criminal?
Have another shot and reread my post.

 

[Keepingthemhonest]

ah I didn't realize you were seasonal, you must have done something wrong (perhaps not explicitly by the contract in black and white but rather a production issue or looking at someone wrong...really it doesn't matter since you were seasonal and working in what seems to be a right-to-work state)....if you really wanted to stay on, which really isn't very typical for seasonals anyway, you might have wanted to make it prudent to show that you go above and beyond no matter the circumstances...and you know what I mean...ups owes you nothing. They clearly no longer wish to employ you for whatever reason and you should move on, you have no recourse...I am sorry but that's the way it is for seasonal guys and you knew that when you signed on thus should have been on your best behavior, have happy holidays!

 

[toonertoo]

Hoser, I agree to know your audience, but if a group of guys are having a conversation, Id say if you are offended, by something being said, you Mademmoisell(sp) were eavesdropping. Since you were not invited into the conversation. I am just a normal person, and yes I may laugh at an innapropriate joke or two, but if Im uncomfortable I would steer clear. That is common sense in the workplace or on the street. If you are intimidated in a work environment, then thats one thing. If you go around looking for reasons to be scared, or to find fault with others, then you are in the wrong profession. Maybe you should be a politician, or something. Because if a bunch of guys standing around and maybe saying boob, and you are offended, you are screwed out in public by yourself, as you cant just run to a boss to say "iam offended" in the real world.

 

[helenofcalifornia]

As a woman who has worked at UPS many, many years, I have developed a thick skin when hearing things of a "sexual" nature at UPS. For the most part, it's a male dominated job where men will be men. And alot of the guys are testosterone-driven youngsters. I mean, come on, how many times have we all seen that tube-shaped rug held in front of one guy and laughter all around. I mean, it may not be right, but if it is not aimed at you directly, then cut someone some slack. If it was intentionally aimed, that is a different story. "Boobs" to me is not offensive. I too believe there is more to this story. How do you get fired without a warning letter or suspension or something.

 

[DS]

Being fired is not fun.I was once,I know several drivers that have been fired a few times.Call them back ,talk to someone else at ups or call that 1-800 number if you feel you`ve been wronged..You come across as being the perfect ups driver,but in all honesty,we`ve all ****ed up at some point.Thats why some posters are having a problem with
there being more to the story.
If you are sincere,I urge you to call the center and ask to talk to the center manager,and plead your case.

 

[Cezanne]

Here is the real moral of the story, never go to management to solve any issue with a fellow union employee. Go first to the person who is offending you for whatever reason, face to face. If that does not resolve the issue GO TO YOUR UNION, make them responsibile for the actions of their members. This termination does sound bogus if the facts presented are true, but it sures sounds like he made the mistake of admitting the remark without knowing the consciences. Most of these incidents come down to "he said, she said" without witnesses. Seen several supervisors and managers get busted under the sexual harrassment charges, but they were blantant using their positions of power to suggest sexual favors. This incident was employees on equal grounds, union represented employees (study the by-laws that the union has to represent even non-union employees the same as it's unit employees). Sounds like shotgun mentality to prevent liability from both the company and union, easier to eliminate than counsel.

Scary part of this is that this could happen to any of us. Putting your foot in your mouth is a common workplace event, what happens if somebody overhearing the remark runs to HR and files charges. It becomes termination by "stupid or misunderstood remarks". Smart way to prevent this from happening is to not communicate to any employee and keep your mouth shut while at the workplace. Sure sounds like "Big Brother"

 

[hoser]

Here is the real moral of the story, never go to management to solve any issue with a fellow union employee. Go first to the person who is offending you for whatever reason, face to face. If that does not resolve the issue GO TO YOUR UNION, make them responsibile for the actions of their members. This termination does sound bogus if the facts presented are true, but it sures sounds like he made the mistake of admitting the remark without knowing the consciences. Most of these incidents come down to "he said, she said" without witnesses. Seen several supervisors and managers get busted under the sexual harrassment charges, but they were blantant using their positions of power to suggest sexual favors. This incident was employees on equal grounds, union represented employees (study the by-laws that the union has to represent even non-union employees the same as it's unit employees). Sounds like shotgun mentality to prevent liability from both the company and union, easier to eliminate than counsel.

Scary part of this is that this could happen to any of us. Putting your foot in your mouth is a common workplace event, what happens if somebody overhearing the remark runs to HR and files charges. It becomes termination by "stupid or misunderstood remarks". Smart way to prevent this from happening is to not communicate to any employee and keep your mouth shut while at the workplace. Sure sounds like "Big Brother"

very good point. unless it's severe or an offence directed to the company, go to the employee first, then the union, then the man.

Hoser, I agree to know your audience, but if a group of guys are having a conversation, Id say if you are offended, by something being said, you Mademmoisell(sp) were eavesdropping. Since you were not invited into the conversation. I am just a normal person, and yes I may laugh at an innapropriate joke or two, but if Im uncomfortable I would steer clear. That is common sense in the workplace or on the street. If you are intimidated in a work environment, then thats one thing. If you go around looking for reasons to be scared, or to find fault with others, then you are in the wrong profession. Maybe you should be a politician, or something. Because if a bunch of guys standing around and maybe saying boob, and you are offended, you are screwed out in public by yourself, as you cant just run to a boss to say "iam offended" in the real world.

Definately. There has to be genuine feeling of harassment, not just the appearance of harassment on the surface.

 

[brownmonster]

It's amazing how the women on my route can talk dirty, women in factories talk like drunkin sailors, women my wife works with flirt and talk dirty to co-workers, but say something to the wrong one when she's in a bad mood and POW! you're history.

 

[trickpony1]

It's called constructive termination.
If it wasn't the trumped up "sexual harassment" charges it probably would have been something else.
Perhaps take another poster's suggestion of talking one on one with the center manager to attempt to clear up any misunderstandings.

 

[wildgoose]

I think you should really check out the laws of sexual harrasment these days -if this is what you really believe...unfortunately & sadly enough it is all about the victim and not the offender...

When this happens and the company fires you ? They need to find the person who facilitated this and get answers now ! We had a guy say good morning cupcake and she was in a bad relationship where her boyfriend was beating her so the next poor guy came by was the next victim. 6 weeks off of work. How do you think he felt. When they found out the reason it was Hey Joe you can go back to work. We resolved it ? Oh and the girl probably stayed in that relationship for a good while. Needless to say Joe nevery said hi to her anymore ! Got to watch out for the loosers of the world and stay clear ! Even if he got back pay and not sure you have to carry that stigma of being treated as a criminal !

 

[Storm723]

Got to watch out for the loosers of the world and stay clear ! Even if he got back pay and not sure you have to carry that stigma of being treated as a criminal !

WG...I completely agree with you....trust me I am not one of those thin skinned women. I can joke with the best of them and do. My thoughts came because I was a governement contractor and unfortunately I have seen guys fired for saying "good morning...wow you look great today" and if the female was having an off day...it was hell for the male. I guess my point is one (male/female) needs to be aware of their surroundings...you just never know..