To those who attended their contract meeting

[Jackburton]

​Maybe you should change your Avatar title to "Preacher of the Painful Truth".

Wasn't that Bortz's title?

 

[didyousheetit]

both sides make a good argument. Yes we should stick together, we should not go into any inferior plans. I am in local 710 so ours is still being negotiated. I really worry about the heath plans in particular you see, I will be retiring in about two years. But years ago I had twins born three months premature the hospital bill alone was over 400,000.00 my portion was only 62 dollars. With the type of punishment our bodies take, ups still should be providing our healthcare.I mean, according to the pcms all you should do is drink water and stretch for 15 minutes a day, with that kind of thinking why in the world would ups give up healthcare. On the flip side why would ups not just let us go on strike. Say, no more pension payments, probably 700 a month in premiums. ups doesn't care about their own management personnel so they could get rid of all the dead weight there. Then put two drivers to a truck at 11 dollars an hour.I know a no vote doesn't mean strike. They should go back to the table. I don't think it was a easy job at the negotiating table. So, when you vote vote whats right for every one.

 

[CaptainObvious]

I'm guessing he is in the WCT and received the same letter I did. 90.4% funded.

Edit: As of Jan. 1 2013.... 90%

Ill believe that a lot more than Upsgrunt. The WCT is a good fund still but it pays out the highest pensions and this will drag it down just like the rest.

I'm afraid you may be right 407.
And under this new contract it is possible that part or all of my pension contributions for the next 5 years may go to funding CS Teamcare if it becomes underfunded.

 

[realbrown1]

Hey realbrown1 what's your fund now so I can discredit your ass also. Ill be waiting.

Western conference. Try and discredit away dopey.

 

[The Other Side]

Beyond a strike, UPS's biggest shippers like amazon and zappos are threatening to jump ship. A strike would be the worst catastrophic event in the history of labor. So for all you NO voters, you need to bypass your selfish ideology and understand the full dynamic of economics. We are making $20 more than FedEx. Highest compensated in the industry!!! UPS freight lost money last year and UPS paid the difference to not take a hit on the stock price. There is a cause and effect to everything. People, get your MOU's from your BA. EVERY local was given the opportunity to attend the two man meetings. EVERY local was given the chance to question the TA at the two man meeting. EVERY local was given the chance to deny the TA at the two man meeting. I was a 85% yes voter. I'm now at 100%. Local 251 will pass this TA hands down.

Really STINK? Does your local have you on a intravenous drip bag of BULLCHITT?

If it came down to a stike ( that nobody wants) then that aspect falls onto the COMPANY, not our members. We work hard, we work long hours, we get injured. For those sacrifices, you want to accept concessions while the company spends millions of dollars on a ferrari race team?

You attempt to compare apples to oranges with the suggestion of our pay vs FEDEX. FEDEX drivers dont work HALF as hard as the typical UPS driver. FEDEX drivers have to take mandatory 2 or 3 hour lunches on some days. FEDEX drivers are heading in to the hub before 6pm while guys like me still have 70 stops left at 6pm. I MAKE MORE THAN A FEDEX DRIVER because I EARN IT.

You are either out of your freaking mind or simply out of touch with reality or you have your head so far up your B.A.'s rear end you cant get a breath of fresh air.

Are you really this dense?

I could care less about UPS losing money on UPS freight. Thats their problem. They decided to jump into the LTL business, not the members.

We are the highest paid workers in the nation because we are the most worked workers in the nation. Show me another delivery company working its members 12 hours a day 5 days a week. Show me another delivery company that gives its drivers over 200 stops a day with pickups. Show me another delivery company that requires its drivers to achieve such high production standards. Show me another delivery company whos trucks are so blown out they cant even walk down the middle of the isle and have to climb over boxes just to find ONE BOX. Show me another small package delivery company going to a mall and staying there making deliveries from 930am to 900pm everyday.

The problem with guys like you STINK, is that you are incapable of calculating reality. You rely on what you are told by whoever is fingering your sphinter and moving your lips.

Every local went to the two man meeting and voted BEFORE they addressed the membership. Its called union politics. None of them are smarter than you are.

They all play big shots , but look at what we got.

hall and HOFFA both stated clearly and forcefully, that "WE WILL NOT ALLOW OUR MEMBERS TO PAY 90 dollars, 9 dollars or 9 cents"... this was the battlecry for months. THEN , as they turned on a dime and left 9 cents change for us, they SCREWED us by offering the company an opportunity to take away OUR health care benefits.

Brother HALL was right, we werent going to spend 90/9/.09, instead, we are going to pay in the THOUSANDS!

You have been asked several times by ME, and many others to JUSTIFY your position for a yes vote, and you cannot put two words together to do so.

You throw in amazon and zappos as some kind of threat to us, but listen carefully, PHUQUE both those companies. IF THEY WALK, then thats on UPS for even starting this mess. Will it hurt? You bet your puppet a$h it will, but maybe then, the company will not attempt these kinds of negotiations with its employees.

Both Zappos and Amazon know that UPS is a profitable company and in a position to settle its labor issues without sacrificing its customers and the threat isnt against the members, but rather against the corporation for attempting to disrupt a peaceful working relationship.

I WILL GLADLY walk to maintain my benefits and those benefits of my brothers and sisters who would be greatly affected. I WILL GLADLY walk for my part time brothers and sisters who are being screwed for another year longer with this contract. I WILL WALK to take back the $15K that EVERY part time worker will lose when promoted to full time because of the extension of progression.

I could care less if amazon ever came back. I could care less if Scott D. had to go to Amazon and personally kneel in front of Jeff Bezos and handle business just to get packages back into the system, thats just a position he put himself in when he took on the membership.

I voted for HOFFA, and I believe that HE and HALL are both WEAK in these negotiations. Its that simple. IF HOFFA /HALL ever wanted to give TDU an opportunity to take over at the top, then this contract will do just that. I dont support TDU, but I believe that this contract alone ( if passed ) will ultimately be the tipping point for the direction of the teamsters.

All TDU will have to do is put up a candidate who isnt marred up, legitimately involved in union politics and rest will be history.

You cheer loudly today about this contract, but you'll hear me later when what I say comes true.

The membership would respect HOFFA/HALL if they listened to us, and took this offer off the table and came to the membership and said they "HEARD US" loud and clear.

Peace

TOS

 

[Bluefox]

Call it what you want The fact is it was a win for you that the the Northwest conference supported When it came for a vote And now it's time for the central states to do what's in the best interest and support its members On the West Coast Do not have the attitude it's all about me If we want to keep a national contract That's the kind of attitude that creates division And a pull away from a national contract And that would be a large loss for the central states being There pick up volume is minimal as compared to the Western Conference pick up volume and the East Coast pick up volume which pick up volume generates revenue Alll we asking is please show your support and vote no on this contract

The east coast too... I will have to get s second job . I hsve kids

 

[Bluefox]

You are VERY wrong!!

So your saying it would cost 10k??

Less than 2k

Its still 2 k ... r u kidding me..

 

[ups clerk]

A NO vote would not mean a strike. For one thing, a strike wouldn't be legal until August 1 at the earliest, because regardless of any votes beforehand, there is still a contract in effect until midnight on July 31.

There would have to be a strike authorization vote first. And you can bet that Hoffa will never call for such a vote. Only real labor leaders with a real, in advance, long term plan, do that. It's too late now for a long term plan, including a possible strike, now, for this contract.

Not only would we NOT go on strike, but if it goes past Aug 1, we will just work without a contract until it does pass. However UPS won't even go that far because they have shippers to answer to. UPS promised their shippers the contract will be settled or at least a hand shake agreement by April 1st. It is now near at the end of May. If the contract is turned down UPS is friend*cked. Rumor has it that Amazon.com told them if this contract isn't settled soon, they are walking...going to FedEx.

 

[quamba 638]

Spread the word around the hubs. Connect with fellow employees. Let them know the changes that are being proposed. Tell them to keep an eye in their mailbox. Spread the word! Vote no!

 

[anonymous6]

Ill believe that a lot more than Upsgrunt. The WCT is a good fund still but it pays out the highest pensions and this will drag it down just like the rest.

uneffingbelievable!

 

[rpoz11]

OK, so after spending the last hour going over all of this, its seems that its mostly a CS vs WCT affect.
At least for what I am reading.
I have a question :
Is the CS HC Plan, under this 2013-2018 proposal, being offered an improvement in any way in the care or costs compared to what you have had in the last contract?

What I would like to share is this :
In the Western Conference, they carry this company steeply regarding P/L (Profit/Loss) for the Nation.
Some Buildings in the west drive huge profit numbers.
Demographics and economic factors regionally in the west should support this.
The Western Conference has been negotiating strong contracts for decades.
Break down the record profits reported the past 6 months.
Tell me where the economic strength in their record profits lye.

The company knows where the numbers are.
They know where larger profits can be squeezed at.

WCT Locals fight hard and deep to get the return back to the members who do the work; who carry this company.
Their efforts are why the WCT have the contracts they have.

Now...
Tell me why, anonymous, why should the members in the West give up on what they have fought for; for what they have earned?

 

[Skooney]

Our BA at the local 959 meeting, I kept hearing the phrase "Yes, it's this way, and if it isn't, you could be making $10 an hour part time, as opposed to $31 full time. We have more 22.3 positions than almost anywhere in the country".. Specifically directed at 22.3 employees, obviously. I am a driver, not a 22.3 employees, but it seems like the company strong armed them into things on our local.

It drove me nuts hearing that. Also, a part time issue was brought up, and I can't remember exactly what it was.. But Rick Traini used the line "Will, this affects them, not you"... Are you kidding me?

 

[rpoz11]

Our BA at the local 959 meeting, I kept hearing the phrase "Yes, it's this way, and if it isn't, you could be making $10 an hour part time, as opposed to $31 full time. We have more 22.3 positions than almost anywhere in the country".. Specifically directed at 22.3 employees, obviously. I am a driver, not a 22.3 employees, but it seems like the company strong armed them into things on our local.

It drove me nuts hearing that. Also, a part time issue was brought up, and I can't remember exactly what it was.. But Rick Traini used the line "Will, this affects them, not you"... Are you kidding me?

22.3 = Grocery Industry

 

[Skooney]

22.3 = Grocery Industry

Elaborate?

 

[rpoz11]

Elaborate?

Gladly

Look at what happened to the Grocery Industry.

They exercised a program to eliminate FT positions.

Greatly increasing PT jobs over FT positions that came with FT benefits.

Think about it for a moment

 

[804brown]

And overall your leaders were silent at the two man, as were the new "saviors" from L89. The TA was unanimously endorsed by the leaders present with plenty of opportunity to ask any questions or voice dissent and all that was heard was silence. To now go back to the comfort of a local and claim Hall "blindsided them" is politics, not leadership.
Stink and 407 along with thousands of stewards haven't given up any fight, in fact they do it every day. It's just a real shame to have good union guys like you challenging other good union guys that don't drink the TDU kool-aid. If Paff was our GST we'd all be unemployed, and UPS would be a memory like REA.
Our members are supporting this TA 75+%.

LOL, they were shown the details and were expected to give an endorsement an hour later?? There certainly was not a lot of time to go over such important changes to the contract. TDU has nothing to do with this matter. This was about getting the details, bringing them back to the entire E/B, discussing the changes THEN making the decision to endorse or not to endorse. As for the socalled endorsement by all the local heads, there is such a thing as abstention.

 

[Ms.PacMan]

The numbers don't matter because his statements are only half the story. UPS bought their/our pensions out of CS - this is true BUT UPS will only guarantee the pension payments set forth in the contract until we reach age 65, then any pension credits accrued before 2008 revert back to CS for payment.

For example, someone who had 25 years in as of 2008 and an additional 5 years under the new UPS/IBT pension will get $3000/mo guaranteed by UPS until they turn age 65. Then at age 65, they will get $500 from UPS/IBT and CS will be responsible for the $2500 (25 years of pension credits under CS).

Central States is 64% funded and telling congress they will be bankrupt in 9 - 12 years if they don't change the laws and let them cut pension payouts now. (IMO- They don't want the PGBC taking over the pension plan - they would like to bleed it dry until the very end).

I see anonymous ended that post with LOL - unless that is a giant Tom Hanks in the Money Pit laugh, there is nothing funny about Central States.

How long will it be before they are funneling money from other pensions into CSHW and then into their bankrupt pension fund?

 

[pretender]

The numbers don't matter because his statements are only half the story. UPS bought their/our pensions out of CS - this is true BUT UPS will only guarantee the pension payments set forth in the contract until we reach age 65, then any pension credits accrued before 2008 revert back to CS for payment.

For example, someone who had 25 years in as of 2008 and an additional 5 years under the new UPS/IBT pension will get $3000/mo guaranteed by UPS until they turn age 65. Then at age 65, they will get $500 from UPS/IBT and CS will be responsible for the $2500 (25 years of pension credits under CS).

Central States is 64% funded and telling congress they will be bankrupt in 9 - 12 years if they don't change the laws and let them cut pension payouts now. (IMO- They don't want the PGBC taking over the pension plan - they would like to bleed it dry until the very end).

I see anonymous ended that post with LOL - unless that is a giant Tom Hanks in the Money Pit laugh, there is nothing funny about Central States.

How long will it be before they are funneling money from other pensions into CSHW and then into their bankrupt pension fund?

You stated this previously, so since I was told otherwise before I retired, I have been trying to verify it.

The conract states:

The UPS/IBT Plan will recognize full-time service in the CS Plan for determining eligibility for the benefits in this section and will offset at Normal Retirement Age the benefits accrued from the CS Plan commencing at Normal Retirement Age. If the benefit paid from the CS Plan is reduced as permitted or required by law, the amount of such reduction shall not be included in this offset.

I take this to mean that UPS will make up the difference. Am I not reading this correctly?

 

[Anonymous 10]

You stated this previously, so since I was told otherwise before I retired, I have been trying to verify it.

The conract states:

The UPS/IBT Plan will recognize full-time service in the CS Plan for determining eligibility for the benefits in this section and will offset at Normal Retirement Age the benefits accrued from the CS Plan commencing at Normal Retirement Age. If the benefit paid from the CS Plan is reduced as permitted or required by law, the amount of such reduction shall not be included in this offset.

I take this to mean that UPS will make up the difference. Am I not reading this correctly?

yes

 

[Ms.PacMan]

You stated this previously, so since I was told otherwise before I retired, I have been trying to verify it.

The conract states:

The UPS/IBT Plan will recognize full-time service in the CS Plan for determining eligibility for the benefits in this section and will offset at Normal Retirement Age the benefits accrued from the CS Plan commencing at Normal Retirement Age. If the benefit paid from the CS Plan is reduced as permitted or required by law, the amount of such reduction shall not be included in this offset.

I take this to mean that UPS will make up the difference. Am I not reading this correctly?

Central States is responsible for payments for credits earned starting at Normal Retirement Age (65). UPS will only offset this amount until age 65 - after that if Central States is unable to continue payments from their pension fund UPS will NOT offset any reduction.

UPS bought their way OUT of CS - do you all really think they will continue to subsidize it? 6 Billion - paid and done and a promise to carry members CS credits until age 65.