UPS offer on the Table for takeover of Central States fund !

[705red]

All the more reason for UPS wanting to withdraw.

Are you aware that it will cost ups minimum $4 billion to walk away from the fund! Then what about the retirees? Even more what about the contract, they will be nothing left for raises, medical, and the poor part timers. I cannot support this with what ive seen so far, will need to see numbers, stats on all participants in the cs plan in order to change my mind.

 

[wyobill]

Are you aware that it will cost ups minimum $4 billion to walk away from the fund! Then what about the retirees? Even more what about the contract, they will be nothing left for raises, medical, and the poor part timers. I cannot support this with what ive seen so far, will need to see numbers, stats on all participants in the cs plan in order to change my mind.

UPS sure wanted to walk away from it in 97.

 

[brett636]

There is an interesting article on this over on makeupsdeliver.org. It kinda condemns this offer by the company using sketchy numbers, but I don't see anything bad about it. UPS is willing to pay its withdrawal fee, one that can be negotiated between UPS and CS. They will create a jointly run UPS/teamster pension plan for those covered by central states. This plan will raise promised payouts by a little, but bring back the 30 and out retirement option.

If I am correct the part-timer pension is already run like this and is 100% funded. This could be the start of a solid retirement for UPS people. Maybe eventually this plan can be extended to cover all UPS fulltimers.

 

[RockyRogue]

There is an interesting article on this over on makeupsdeliver.org. It kinda condemns this offer by the company using sketchy numbers, but I don't see anything bad about it. UPS is willing to pay its withdrawal fee, one that can be negotiated between UPS and CS. They will create a jointly run UPS/teamster pension plan for those covered by central states. This plan will raise promised payouts by a little, but bring back the 30 and out retirement option.

If I am correct the part-timer pension is already run like this and is 100% funded. This could be the start of a solid retirement for UPS people. Maybe eventually this plan can be extended to cover all UPS fulltimers.

I read a couple of these pension articles there, Brett. Interesting reads. I wasn't a finance or accounting major and I despised economics, so I'll take the numbers they offered as reasonable and accurate, though admittedly vague. I'd want to see more in-depth information before actually voting on anything. I, too, can see nothing bad about it. In fact, it sounds like the company is offering the same solution APWA has been .

I've heard the same thing about the p/t'ers pension but it takes weeks, indeed months to get anything from Atlanta about it (or so I've read on here). I'm pro-union but this sounds like the best solution to a very nasty problem: separate UPS pensions from the Teamster's slush fund. I'll debate anyone that cares to about this issue of "union solidarity," and the pensions. -Rocky

 

[wildgoose]

I read a couple of these pension articles there, Brett. Interesting reads. I wasn't a finance or accounting major and I despised economics, so I'll take the numbers they offered as reasonable and accurate, though admittedly vague. I'd want to see more in-depth information before actually voting on anything. I, too, can see nothing bad about it. In fact, it sounds like the company is offering the same solution APWA has been .

I've heard the same thing about the p/t'ers pension but it takes weeks, indeed months to get anything from Atlanta about it (or so I've read on here). I'm pro-union but this sounds like the best solution to a very nasty problem: separate UPS pensions from the Teamster's slush fund. I'll debate anyone that cares to about this issue of "union solidarity," and the pensions. -Rocky

If the company has an offer to fix the pension and the 30 and out without payraises what do you think the drivers would do especially Package car drivers that have 20 + years in ? Duh ! The teamsters would naturally hate it because they wouldn`t get a pay raise out of this ? Who wants to carry the 250 lb teamsters on there back for the rest of their lives ?

 

[mittam]

Fist fighting, throwing bricks at trucks, dieing in the streets, shootings and all the other garbage that goes on makes me want to be a part of an organization like that. This is a job a career not a war zone. Anyone acting as described above ought tho be in jail, out of a job and certainly banned from all union activities. You want us to support people like that?
Secondly all those currently retired UPS will be responsible for their pensions, this has been mentioned several times.
Third, why would UPS pay 4 billion to buy out the pension fund when in a year the government will probably be giving it to UPS. Yes the strike in'97 did us a lot of good!

 

[cars27]

according to tdu.org they want to reinstate 25 out 2500 month 30 out 3000 35 at 3500 also can the under 62 penalty it would be jointly administered by ups and teamsters

 

[trickpony1]

according to tdu.org they want to reinstate 25 out 2500 month 30 out 3000 35 at 3500 also can the under 62 penalty it would be jointly administered by ups and teamsters

what about medical benefits upon retirement?
what about no restrictions on working other jobs after retirement?

 

[1eyejack]

I'm very happy with the rate of pay as long as we get the cost of living in there... But as the pension is only going to be for UPS employees only is a Great Idea..That is what we are fighting for . Why should we support the mulitipension plan . I did not have a chance to vote on it it was the ibt and local that did . Its just like the pay raises are locals receive..a 30 percent increase since 2005 to 2006 ..I would like to know how many hours they work for 120,000 a year i would love to have that job ..others states show how many hours they put in for that pay..Why don't the local 769 show us there hours they put in for that pay ...the teamsters will not let us vote on that plan because it does not benefit them they don't care what we want. We like whats on the table they are offering ,but its not in the best interest of the teamsters so they will tell us more stuff like they have done in the past ...the only thing that they do is put more stuff out about the apwa and why they are not this or why they are not that ..But I say we are going to be the New APWA Union that will give the employees what they want , because we hear what they want. Not like the teamsters whos only interest is keeping float the mulitipensions....People if ur not a actived member of the APWA Join and be one, Because with out You guys we can not make it happen. We want what you all talk about a early retirement plus better healthcare coverage and a secured retirement plan for UPS Employees only ... Thank u all who support us out in the field to get those cards signed .we are happy and proud that you take a stand with us... So lets support the guys in different states to get the message out .. thats why i'm asking You all who know what we are doing if u believe in what we are doing support the APWA Thank U ur fellow brother in the the fight for a better future for US and our own retirees at Ups......

 

[Raw]

Maybe recieving a lump sum pay-out of pension earned to invest as we see fit could be something to think about.

 

[Overpaid Union Thug]

So far it sounds good. I don't think we need hourly raises right now. Just COLA. We are already the best paid in the industry and it makes it difficult for UPS to stay competitive with their rates. The pension and filling up the holes in the contract should be the main goals.

 

[705red]

Fist fighting, throwing bricks at trucks, dieing in the streets, shootings and all the other garbage that goes on makes me want to be a part of an organization like that. This is a job a career not a war zone. Anyone acting as described above ought tho be in jail, out of a job and certainly banned from all union activities. You want us to support people like that?
Secondly all those currently retired UPS will be responsible for their pensions, this has been mentioned several times.
Third, why would UPS pay 4 billion to buy out the pension fund when in a year the government will probably be giving it to UPS. Yes the strike in'97 did us a lot of good!

Mittam there you go again with your apwa puk spin! Where in my post did it say the fighting and dieing in the streets is ongoing in todays times?

It is a job and a career because of the sacrifices of others that had to be made in a whole different era. How could you jail someone in those times? The police fought against striking workers and assisted in the transportation of bringing scabs to fight against and perform the work that those americans who were making a stand for us.

Do you even know how a company goes about optioning out of a multi-employer pension fund, or are you waiting to hear from the almighty van and danny to explain it to you their way?

So you only care about yourself and your future. Thank god we had better people than yourself at the start of the labor movement, otherwise we wouldnt be here living the lives we are today. I for one will not forget the sacrifices others made to benefit myself and other working union americans.

All gave some, some gave all! With you its me, me, me, me, me!

I suggest you go and get some education on things obviously you have no business even discussing!

 

[705red]

I'm very happy with the rate of pay as long as we get the cost of living in there... But as the pension is only going to be for UPS employees only is a Great Idea..That is what we are fighting for . Why should we support the mulitipension plan . I did not have a chance to vote on it it was the ibt and local that did . Its just like the pay raises are locals receive..a 30 percent increase since 2005 to 2006 ..I would like to know how many hours they work for 120,000 a year i would love to have that job ..others states show how many hours they put in for that pay..Why don't the local 769 show us there hours they put in for that pay ...the teamsters will not let us vote on that plan because it does not benefit them they don't care what we want. We like whats on the table they are offering ,but its not in the best interest of the teamsters so they will tell us more stuff like they have done in the past ...the only thing that they do is put more stuff out about the apwa and why they are not this or why they are not that ..But I say we are going to be the New APWA Union that will give the employees what they want , because we hear what they want. Not like the teamsters whos only interest is keeping float the mulitipensions....People if ur not a actived member of the APWA Join and be one, Because with out You guys we can not make it happen. We want what you all talk about a early retirement plus better healthcare coverage and a secured retirement plan for UPS Employees only ... Thank u all who support us out in the field to get those cards signed .we are happy and proud that you take a stand with us... So lets support the guys in different states to get the message out .. thats why i'm asking You all who know what we are doing if u believe in what we are doing support the APWA Thank U ur fellow brother in the the fight for a better future for US and our own retirees at Ups......

You have some interesting points of view, i to am happy with the pay. But what worries me is the change of the pension from a multi-employer to a ups-teamster pension. If ups continues to grow and stay the top dog then theres no worries, but if businees slips and we lose a fair market share over the next 30 plus years we will be revisiting a whole nother pension crisis! Example look at the uaw, once the big dog now not even a puppy anymore. Who will float our (retirees) pensions if that shoud happen. If ups cuts there workforce in half over the next 50 years and you have 200,000 pensioners drawing from it, thers no one else to float it. Now with the multi-employer fund we would be a burden on the then top dog pension fund contributer, and also have other companies assisting. We all hope that ups will continue to be the big dog, but as history has shown its not that likely!

 

[Coldworld]

how many part timers retire from ups.....hmmmm probably not very many. So...its probably not a big deal that their pension is 100% funded. Does anyone have numbers for that?

 

[area43]

When is it enough! Already we only get 40 cents to every dollar ups contributes to the pension fund. Why dont we just the cs pensions plans our 401k s too. Yes Im thankful for all that the teamsters have done, but when will all this madness end. NEVER !!!! The cs fund is a sinking ship thats going to take UPS down with it.

 

[area43]

Correction - Why dont we just give the cs pension plan our 401ks too. sorry

 

[RockyRogue]

If the company has an offer to fix the pension and the 30 and out without payraises what do you think the drivers would do especially Package car drivers that have 20 + years in ? Duh ! The teamsters would naturally hate it because they wouldn`t get a pay raise out of this ? Who wants to carry the 250 lb teamsters on there back for the rest of their lives ?

Easy, Goose...don't want you to collapse of a heart attack . I'm a pt'er and the starting wage has to go up in '08. I'm already working with people I wouldn't let roam a retail store without a security guard keeping an eye on them. The applicant pool SUCKS!! I understand the retirement worries but if you don't have a younger worker paying into that retirement plan after your retirement ...then what? -Rocky

 

[Cole]

There are excellent points and both sides. Rocky and 705 made great points as well. No doubt it was very tough for those standing up to form unions in the early days, and the company's would bring in hired goons and haul them in by the truck loads to crack some skulls of those trying to unionize, with bats and whatever else they could carry etc...and the union side was painted as the bad guys. Great sacrifices were made that we cannot forget.

Certainly there is no guarantee 30 to 40 yrs down the road UPS will still be top dog, and some of the mismanagement and backstabbing within management makes me wonder how long the ship can sail as is, and with hourlies too. I mean at times we lose sight of the "S" in the UP, and we have lost many major accounts that way.

No I haven't changed my mind that I think the APWA *may* be the best bet we have, but we have to look at the broad picture, and consider the "what if's".

 

[krash]

Mittam that kinda thinking really sux...I mean let's not worry about our retired brothers and sisters that paved the way for us...My Dad was retired freight would you wanna see people like that starve? May when your parents get old they will be destined to be set adrift on a iceberg......love that (sic) compassion....BC

Righy you are BC.
My Dad worked for several LTLers to get his time in. Didn't retire till he was 63. The last one he worked for is ABF(who is also trying to get out of CS).
Also, most of those who are collecting from defunct companies, don't draw more in a month than we bring home in a week.

 

[krash]

how many part timers retire from ups.....hmmmm probably not very many. So...its probably not a big deal that their pension is 100% funded. Does anyone have numbers for that?

Correct CW. Most PTers are ran off before they are vested or go FT. In the souther supplement anyway. I've heard some areas the PTers are under the same plan as FTers.