1 min late = NCNS (No Call, No Show)

[MAKAVELI]

I am betting that if most had an excellent attendance record, this would not be an issue. Show up on time and it won't be an issue.

Sounds like his management is exploiting a hole in your contract. I'm not union and still get report in pay even if I'm late.

 

[Wally]

@Gumby is never tardy. That's a true role model for generation snowflake.

 

[IVE GOTTA PACKAGE 4U]

@Gumby is never tardy.

Once a decade or so.

 

[Wally]

Once a decade or so.

You sir are an inspiration to all.

 

[HEFFERNAN]

Hello folks. This post is to bring an urgent issue to discussion. At the DFW Airport Hub #0764, anyone who is late, even by a minute or seconds are having their in-punch changed to NCNS then sent home for the day. A NCNS on the work record does subject an employee to immediate termination or letter with intent to terminate on short or no notice. This policy has the potential to unfairly punish even the best workers. To add insult to injury, one of the hub supervisors along with shop steward said this practice was approved by the labor manager.

Yes, there are those who are habitually late at my hub, often more than 10 minutes. There are those who have got away with not showing up for days on end or taking time off at will; read: not mentioning names because those who work Sunrise #0764 already know who they are. These habitual offenders should be dealt with without having 1000 employees walking on eggshells.

There are only a few reasons for this move on part of management. One is to make most new employees quit showing up thus saving on unemployment costs. Second is use the NCNS on employee records as a means to build a case to later terminate; long-term employees should be rightfully concerned about this, even the best ones.

I've spoken to an HR person and full-time supervisor from another hub in another part of the country and got some good input. To help protect yourself, you must do the following:

1. ALWAYS clock-in, even if late. Reason being is there is a record of your arrival. The supervisor will have to edit your punch to an NCNS. Your punch will show as deleted then resubmitted as NCNS on the punch log.
2. If your WOR shows an inaccurate punch or NCNS, DO obtain a copy of your punch log from management or HR office.
3. Always keep your own record of all times worked. Check your paystub weekly against your own record of monies owed.
4. NEVER work off the clock, no exceptions! Don't do any signing, PCMs, safety quizes, etc... Clock in first always!! Yes, an employee got a NCNS for doing a safety PCM at the front door.
5. If late, even by a minute, do note the reason. Everyone will at one point have their alarm clock fail, get a flat tire, or hit unusual traffic at some point.

Those five steps will allow you to build your own defense. Having your own defense ready is critical in the event you may need to save your job.

UPS is running a business !!!!!
When they start the belts, everybody has to be in place.
Employees not showing up on time leads to backed up belts, missed SPAs, etc.
Just because we're union members doesn't give us a right to sabotage their building plan.

Obviously, management is going to an extreme in dealing with this but they have a right to nip it in the bud.
It looks like they've proved their point that we are expected to be on time and to be in our work areas.

 

[Wally]

UPS is running a business !!!!!
When they start the belts, everybody has to be in place.
Employees not showing up on time leads to backed up belts, missed SPAs, etc.
Just because we're union members doesn't give us a right to sabotage their building plan.

Obviously, management is going to an extreme in dealing with this but they have a right to nip it in the bud.
It looks like they've proved their point that we are expected to be on time and to be in our work areas.

Now now Heff! You will hurt little Snowflake's self-esteem. He is special! UPS must bend to accommodate them!...You know this..

 

[542thruNthru]

If your late you give up your guarantee

I've heard this on here many times. Is this a supplemental thing? I ask because I don't see this any where in my contract.

Here late or not you get your 3 1/2 guarantee.

 

[trickpony1]

If the company would be some housing projects adjacent to the hub the problem would be solved.

 

[brownIEman]

UPS is running a business !!!!!
When they start the belts, everybody has to be in place.
Employees not showing up on time leads to backed up belts, missed SPAs, etc.
Just because we're union members doesn't give us a right to sabotage their building plan.

Obviously, management is going to an extreme in dealing with this but they have a right to nip it in the bud.
It looks like they've proved their point that we are expected to be on time and to be in our work areas.

Right?

/begin rant

How hard is this to understand? Yes, they are going overboard and trying discipline threats that won't hold up. However, I love how the OP's list of reasons for why he thinks they are doing it is all nefarious nastiness by mgmnt and completely misses the actual, ONLY reason they could possibly have - To motivate employees to actually show up on time so they have a shot at running an effective operation.

Also, it is disheartening to me the number of posters who think you can show up late and still be entitled to your guarantee. If the company ever agrees to that, that's the time to jump ship because they would have to be completely brain dead to agree to it. As an ORS what the hell am I supposed to do with a driver that shows up 4 hours after start time and says "I overslept, I demand my 8 hour guarantee!" and all I can do is charge him with 1 tardy and find 8 hours of work? How the frak am I supposed to run an operation that way? Yes, 4 hours is a stretch to make a point, but then what should the cut off be? 1 Hour? 20 minutes? Not to worry, the company and the Union worked out where the cut off is long before any of us were born - it's called start time.

/end rant

 

[Frankie's Friend]

Right?

/begin rant

How hard is this to understand? Yes, they are going overboard and trying discipline threats that won't hold up. However, I love how the OP's list of reasons for why he thinks they are doing it is all nefarious nastiness by mgmnt and completely misses the actual, ONLY reason they could possibly have - To motivate employees to actually show up on time so they have a shot at running an effective operation.

Also, it is disheartening to me the number of posters who think you can show up late and still be entitled to your guarantee. If the company ever agrees to that, that's the time to jump ship because they would have to be completely brain dead to agree to it. As an ORS what the hell am I supposed to do with a driver that shows up 4 hours after start time and says "I overslept, I demand my 8 hour guarantee!" and all I can do is charge him with 1 tardy and find 8 hours of work? How the frak am I supposed to run an operation that way? Yes, 4 hours is a stretch to make a point, but then what should the cut off be? 1 Hour? 20 minutes? Not to worry, the company and the Union worked out where the cut off is long before any of us were born - it's called start time.

/end rant

And the ORSs are chronically late getting to work here as well. They come in so late that the "on call" employees have to wait for the word of whether they are working or not less than an hour prior to the start time for the day. Dont act like the management employees are eternally punctual and/or leading by example. Thats a joke.

 

[olroadbeech]

show up on Lombardi time. 15 minutes early. end of problem.

 

[brownIEman]

And the ORSs are chronically late getting to work here as well. They come in so late that the "on call" employees have to wait for the word of whether they are working or not less than an hour prior to the start time for the day. Dont act like the management employees are eternally punctual and/or leading by example. Thats a joke.

It is unacceptable for management to be late, nothing in my post should be taken to say it is ok. In my experience management were by and large very punctual. My start time as an ORS was usually about 1.5 hours prior to driver start. I can only think of a couple times in 3 years I was late, and can't think of a single time I was less than 1 hour prior to driver start. I never worked for a manager that would tolerate "chronically late" ORS' as you claim yours are. That would be an aberration in my experience and is completely unacceptable.

So you are claiming it is fine for union employees to show up late and they should fight for their guarantee and any discipline, but reprehensible for management to do it? That seems like a somewhat hypocritical stance to take.

Edit: your operation has other problems. The PDS and early AM OMS' should be notifying on call drivers prior to the ORS' getting there. Although, this is one of those tough areas - The on call drivers (we called them cover drivers) should be notified an hour before start, and yet, scheduled drivers have until an hour prior to call out. So, how can you really know your staffing before an hour prior?

 

[Yolo]

I didn't read the entire post. But they have pulled the whole being late is the same as a ncns building before. Just try to be on time. If they pull you in for a hearing there's no way they are counting that tardy the same as a no show.

 

[eats packages]

Right?

/begin rant

How hard is this to understand? Yes, they are going overboard and trying discipline threats that won't hold up. However, I love how the OP's list of reasons for why he thinks they are doing it is all nefarious nastiness by mgmnt and completely misses the actual, ONLY reason they could possibly have - To motivate employees to actually show up on time so they have a shot at running an effective operation.

Also, it is disheartening to me the number of posters who think you can show up late and still be entitled to your guarantee. If the company ever agrees to that, that's the time to jump ship because they would have to be completely brain dead to agree to it. As an ORS what the hell am I supposed to do with a driver that shows up 4 hours after start time and says "I overslept, I demand my 8 hour guarantee!" and all I can do is charge him with 1 tardy and find 8 hours of work? How the frak am I supposed to run an operation that way? Yes, 4 hours is a stretch to make a point, but then what should the cut off be? 1 Hour? 20 minutes? Not to worry, the company and the Union worked out where the cut off is long before any of us were born - it's called start time.

/end rant

The flaw in your thinking here is that you assume we care about this company...

 

[brownIEman]

The flaw in your thinking here is that you assume we care about this company...

I fail to see how showing up on time for ones job in any way requires caring about the company one works for?

 

[542thruNthru]

Right?

/begin rant

How hard is this to understand? Yes, they are going overboard and trying discipline threats that won't hold up. However, I love how the OP's list of reasons for why he thinks they are doing it is all nefarious nastiness by mgmnt and completely misses the actual, ONLY reason they could possibly have - To motivate employees to actually show up on time so they have a shot at running an effective operation.

Also, it is disheartening to me the number of posters who think you can show up late and still be entitled to your guarantee. If the company ever agrees to that, that's the time to jump ship because they would have to be completely brain dead to agree to it. As an ORS what the hell am I supposed to do with a driver that shows up 4 hours after start time and says "I overslept, I demand my 8 hour guarantee!" and all I can do is charge him with 1 tardy and find 8 hours of work? How the frak am I supposed to run an operation that way? Yes, 4 hours is a stretch to make a point, but then what should the cut off be? 1 Hour? 20 minutes? Not to worry, the company and the Union worked out where the cut off is long before any of us were born - it's called start time.

/end rant

I see what you are saying and can't actually disagree with you. The issue we had some years back was. People would show up 5 - 10 min late. They would work them for a hour or so then say "oh we don't need this many people you're going home now."

I don't feel that's right. Yes they were late and should be marked tardy. Then discipline should follow if it's a trend. I don't think they should put these guys on just to get a running start and then cut them later using the tardiness as the excuse.

That's where the "you lose the guarantee" is BS and why we have fought it in the past.

 

[brownIEman]

I see what you are saying and can't actually disagree with you. The issue we had some years back was. People would show up 5 - 10 min late. They would work them for a hour or so then say "oh we don't need this many people you're going home now."

I don't feel that's right. Yes they were late and should be marked tardy. Then discipline should follow if it's a trend. I don't think they should put these guys on just to get a running start and then cut them later using the tardiness as the excuse.

That's where the "you lose the guarantee" is BS and why we have fought it in the past.

OK, I can kind of see how that would suck. Operations I worked in we would never do that simply because we usually did not have the luxury of sending someone home after an hour, and if we did, we had plenty of "I'm only working for the benefits" people who were happy to do so voluntarily.
However, from a stand point of not wanting to give the company the power to screw with people like this, I have a hard time siding with you on that issue because it is so simple and completely within the employees ability to take the company's power to screw with them away: just show up on time.

Totally hypothetical, but how about this as a compromise local practice - You show up late, even a few seconds, you lose your right to your guarantee hours and the company can send you home as early as they want. However, if they send you home before your guarantee, they cannot discipline you for the occurrence. They have to choose one or the other.

 

[542thruNthru]

OK, I can kind of see how that would suck. Operations I worked in we would never do that simply because we usually did not have the luxury of sending someone home after an hour, and if we did, we had plenty of "I'm only working for the benefits" people who were happy to do so voluntarily.
However, from a stand point of not wanting to give the company the power to screw with people like this, I have a hard time siding with you on that issue because it is so simple and completely within the employees ability to take the company's power to screw with them away: just show up on time.

Totally hypothetical, but how about this as a compromise local practice - You show up late, even a few seconds, you lose your right to your guarantee hours and the company can send you home as early as they want. However, if they send you home before your guarantee, they cannot discipline you for the occurrence. They have to choose one or the other.

Fair to me would be you either send them home in the beginning or give them their guarantee if you decide to work them. If they are late you should know your staffing issues by then anyways.

It doesn't matter anyways. Those decisions are not left to me.

 

[cosmo1]

You sir are an inspiration to all.

Matter of opinion.

 

[UPS Preloader]

I see what you are saying and can't actually disagree with you. The issue we had some years back was. People would show up 5 - 10 min late. They would work them for a hour or so then say "oh we don't need this many people you're going home now."

I don't feel that's right. Yes they were late and should be marked tardy. Then discipline should follow if it's a trend. I don't think they should put these guys on just to get a running start and then cut them later using the tardiness as the excuse.

That's where the "you lose the guarantee" is BS and why we have fought it in the past.

You lose you guarantee, but you are still entitled to the work if you have higher seniority.