Can you actually be forced to wear a mask in the building indefinitely?

[Faceplanted]

I wish more in our state would. I would support them with as much of my business as I could. My wife went to Target the other day and descriced it as a scene from some technocratic dystopian horror story. The only reason I have even followed the mask mandates is because the businesses caved and became willing, uncompensated enforcers of illegal dictatorial mandates. I have completely ignored all other, unenforceable mandates. My life has gone on much the same as it has since the before time.

Listen, I’ve already seen all your outdated articles that show how they don’t work. What’s crazy is how many times people wearing masks have cause super spreader events. But you are the smartest Teamster ever. Why would I doubt you? I mean you told me in April that wearing a mask would cause me to get multiple viral infections. I am still waiting. Can you tell us more about collecting rocks instead? It’s much more interesting.

Listen to what your saying. You claim “outdated articles”

everry single proper scientific study over the history of this type of research has proven them ineffective. Hands down. Now new study says otherwise. Now magically when covid19 comes, these bs studies based on public data change the narrative. Open your eyes. Use common sense. How is that possible?

 

[Faceplanted]

Actually, can you tell me more about how horrible our government is? I enjoy your paranoia. Maybe cite something other than mask usage that makes “them” coming for us? Cool.

The golf of Tonkin

operation mocking bird

mk ultra

cointel pro





these are just 4 examples of what the government does and how they lie and manipulate the public to get a result they want.

you may say, it’s impossible for conspiracy’s to exist with so many people involved.... well when these people believe they are doing these things for the better of the USA, they don’t see a problem. Lots of these operations of have been compartmentalized so it’s harder for this involved to really understand

 

[Faceplanted]

Can you actually be forced to wear a mask in the building indefinitely?​

....the answer is yes, just like you can be told what type of shoes to wear.

How did this thread manage to persist for five months?

because in some situations it comes down to a medical issue. After threats from my center manager about my lack of face mask use and him offering me a shield, we came to the agreement that I would wear a gator when walking in and going to my PC. In the am. I told him per my doctor I have a legitimate medical condition and either using a face covering of face shield for more than a few mins, I start to experience a health issue. I told him if he wants to make this a real issue, we can go that route and I can file a formal complaint with health officials, or they can find something for me to do to satisfy my health condition. He isn’t an idiot so he’s cool with me only wearing it for the 2/3 min that I walk in and go to my PC. He basically just wants to satisfy the district manager when he is there in the am.

lots of people get anxiety from using these useless face coverings and are too scared to say so. I’m not going to feel claustrophobic all day because ups wants to enforce a useless protocol. As I told my center manager if there the route they want to go, we will go that route and it will not end well for anybody.

 

[542thruNthru]

because in some situations it comes down to a medical issue. After threats from my center manager about my lack of face mask use and him offering me a shield, we came to the agreement that I would wear a gator when walking in and going to my PC. In the am. I told him per my doctor I have a legitimate medical condition and either using a face covering of face shield for more than a few mins, I start to experience a health issue. I told him if he wants to make this a real issue, we can go that route and I can file a formal complaint with health officials, or they can find something for me to do to satisfy my health condition. He isn’t an idiot so he’s cool with me only wearing it for the 2/3 min that I walk in and go to my PC. He basically just wants to satisfy the district manager when he is there in the am.

lots of people get anxiety from using these useless face coverings and are too scared to say so. I’m not going to feel claustrophobic all day because ups wants to enforce a useless protocol. As I told my center manager if there the route they want to go, we will go that route and it will not end well for anybody.

Man, I'm so sorry wearing a mask turns you into a sniveling girl after just a few minutes. That's a horrible medical condition you have there. Good luck to you. You're in my prayers.

 

[Bubblehead]

because in some situations it comes down to a medical issue. After threats from my center manager about my lack of face mask use and him offering me a shield, we came to the agreement that I would wear a gator when walking in and going to my PC. In the am. I told him per my doctor I have a legitimate medical condition and either using a face covering of face shield for more than a few mins, I start to experience a health issue. I told him if he wants to make this a real issue, we can go that route and I can file a formal complaint with health officials, or they can find something for me to do to satisfy my health condition. He isn’t an idiot so he’s cool with me only wearing it for the 2/3 min that I walk in and go to my PC. He basically just wants to satisfy the district manager when he is there in the am.

lots of people get anxiety from using these useless face coverings and are too scared to say so. I’m not going to feel claustrophobic all day because ups wants to enforce a useless protocol. As I told my center manager if there the route they want to go, we will go that route and it will not end well for anybody.

I understand, but I also understand the Company can take a position that they will put you on STD and require you to apply for an ADA accommodation as result of your medical condition that prohibits you from doing your job with the prescribed PPE, as they do in other instances.

....because that facemask isn't for you, it is for the benefit of everyone you come in contact with throughout the day and the Company's perceived liability if you don't.

But in the end, this thread and my quoted post wasn't in reference to the extremely rare exception you represented here.

 

[zubenelgenubi]

I understand, but I also understand the Company can take a position that they will put you on STD and require you to apply for an ADA accommodation as result of your medical condition that prohibits you from doing your job with the prescribed PPE, as they do in other instances.

....because that facemask isn't for you, it is for the benefit of everyone you come in contact with throughout the day and the Company's perceived liability if you don't.

But in the end, this thread and my quoted post wasn't in reference to the extremely rare exception you represented here.

While OSHA does affirm companies' rights to require face coverings, they do not consider them PPE. If they did, then companies could be getting fined left and right for not providing enough masks and allowing time or providing facilities to enable employees to follow actual infection control protocols. If you were to read what icp's say about proper mask use you would understand what a joke these mask mandates are, and how pointless it is to require or even recommend mask use for the general public.

 

[zubenelgenubi]

Listen to what your saying. You claim “outdated articles”

everry single proper scientific study over the history of this type of research has proven them ineffective. Hands down. Now new study says otherwise. Now magically when covid19 comes, these bs studies based on public data change the narrative. Open your eyes. Use common sense. How is that possible?

I honestly don't think masks are a part of a sinister plot, though I don't completely rule out the possibility. I think it was meant to give people something they can do to help them feel safe, combined with an increase in the popular belief that masks are effective. If they didn't tell people that face masks worked, and that they don't need to be fancy, people would be freaking out, saying they are being lied to, and demand n95 masks to keep them safe. That was actually happening, and why people were hoarding n95 masks.

Even though I, correctly, say masks don't slow the spread of viruses, that does not mean medical grade and n95 masks don't have their appropriate uses, and are best used in clinical settings to help ensure continued access to healthcare resources for the community.

So, faced with a public demanding masks, and a real need for saving masks for healthcare workers (even if that doesn't include protecting them from respiratory illness), what do you do as a policy maker? I would have stuck with the data, and educating the public about the reality of viral spread, but the public is pretty dumb, so giving them what they want is certainly an understandable strategy.

 

[Faceplanted]

Man, I'm so sorry wearing a mask turns you into a sniveling girl after just a few minutes. That's a horrible medical condition you have there. Good luck to you. You're in my prayers.

Being a doctor, what are you doing at ups?

There is no difference between a no shave waver or a face mask medical exemption. It’s literally none of your business.

everybody on this forums says mind your business with almost every union issue, but god forbid this mask issue comes up now people change their opinion.

Just wear the mask

Just go to the quarantine camp (already happening in new zeland)

just get the vaccine

just get the chip

It’s amazing how people can’t see how slippery this slope is.

 

[Faceplanted]

I understand, but I also understand the Company can take a position that they will put you on STD and require you to apply for an ADA accommodation as result of your medical condition that prohibits you from doing your job with the prescribed PPE, as they do in other instances.

....because that facemask isn't for you, it is for the benefit of everyone you come in contact with throughout the day and the Company's perceived liability if you don't.

But in the end, this thread and my quoted post wasn't in reference to the extremely rare exception you represented here.

I totally understand and I offered to go through the proper Chanel’s while filing a formal ada complaint. My management team and I came to an agreement that the avenue would be more haste for all of us. I wear my covering, clock in and don’t wear it all day.

calling me soft or whatever is comical. Everybody wants to force ups to follow contractual or legal rules unless they don’t agree. Pitiful

 

[Bubblehead]

While OSHA does affirm companies' rights to require face coverings, they do not consider them PPE. If they did, then companies could be getting fined left and right for not providing enough masks and allowing time or providing facilities to enable employees to follow actual infection control protocols. If you were to read what icp's say about proper mask use you would understand what a joke these mask mandates are, and how pointless it is to require or even recommend mask use for the general public.

One of the UPS buildings in my local just got their third fine for enforcing the mask mandate ($200,000 this time)....and they are now enforcing the mandate vigilantly.

I wasn't voicing my opinion to the effectiveness of the mandates, rather their standing in the workplace and the provided reasoning behind them.

So in my opinion you have two choices, wear the mask and comply, or don't and try your luck with STD, the ADA, and/or federal court.

 

[zubenelgenubi]

One of the UPS buildings in my local just got their third fine for enforcing the mask mandate ($200,000 this time)....and they are now enforcing the mandate vigilantly.

I wasn't voicing my opinion to the effectiveness of the mandates, rather their standing in the workplace and the provided reasoning behind them.

So in my opinion you have two choices, wear the mask and comply, or don't and try your luck with STD, the ADA, and/or federal court.

I was just pointing out that OSHA doesn't consider face covers PPE. If they did, then employees could be filing complaints about the company not enforcing proper protocols or not supplying the resources necessary for following protocol.

The part about effectiveness was tangential. It's kinda insane that OSHA will fine a company for an issue that is, in reality, only about appearances. If they truly believed masks worked, and if the issue were truly about keeping people safe, then OSHA would require companies to follow icp guidelines in mask wearing, and fine them for not. But it's not about safety, as you pointed out, merely liability, so they don't care that employees aren't actually using masks properly.

 

[Bubblehead]

I was just pointing out that OSHA doesn't consider face covers PPE. If they did, then employees could be filing complaints about the company not enforcing proper protocols or not supplying the resources necessary for following protocol.

The part about effectiveness was tangential. It's kinda insane that OSHA will fine a company for an issue that is, in reality, only about appearances. If they truly believed masks worked, and if the issue were truly about keeping people safe, then OSHA would require companies to follow icp guidelines in mask wearing, and fine them for not. But it's not about safety, as you pointed out, merely liability, so they don't care that employees aren't actually using masks properly.

I'll say it again, a building in my Local's jurisdiction just received their 3rd citation and was fined in excess of $200,000.

Not sure if it was OSHA, the Board of Health or some other agency, but one of them seems to consider face coverings to be PPE at the moment.

 

[zubenelgenubi]

I'll say it again, a building in my Local's jurisdiction just received their 3rd citation and was fined in excess of $200,000.

Not sure if it was OSHA, the Board of Health or some other agency, but one of them seems to consider face coverings to be PPE at the moment.

COVID-19 - Frequently Asked Questions | Occupational Safety and Health Administration

www.osha.gov

"Cloth face coverings are not considered personal protective equipment (PPE) and are not intended to be used when workers need PPE for protection against exposure to occupational hazards. As such, OSHA's PPE standards do not require employers to provide them.

• The General Duty Clause, Section 5(a)(1) of the Occupational Safety and Health Act, requires each employer to furnish to each of his employees employment and a place of employment which are free from recognized hazards that are causing or are likely to cause death or serious physical harm. Control measures may include a combination of engineering and administrative controls, safe work practices like social distancing, and PPE.
• However, employers may choose to ensure that cloth face coverings are worn as a feasible means of abatement in a control plan designed to address hazards from SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19. Employers may choose to use cloth face coverings as a means of source control, such as because of transmission risk that cannot be controlled through engineering or administrative controls, including social distancing."

Whoever levied the fines for not enforcing the mask mandate probably doesn't care about proper mask protocol either.

 

[slingshot90]

It's not a conspiracy, just the biggest conspiracy ever!

ᴾᵒˢᵗᵉᵈ ᶠʳᵒᵐ ᵖᵉʳˢᵒⁿᵃˡ ᵗʳᵃᶜᵏᶦⁿᵍ ᵃⁿᵈ ˡᶦˢᵗᵉⁿᶦⁿᵍ ᵈᵉᵛᶦᶜᵉ

Read between the lines a bit more. If you can't figure out what I meant, I will try my best to break it down a bit more for you.

To naively say too many people would have to be involved to keep this thing at "conspiracy" level, and it wouldn't work, is foolish. We underestimate what people in power are capable of. All it takes is a little blackmail, insert *Jeffrey Epstein*, and voila! You got people being quiet for life.

Stop consenting, take off the mask. Take back your rights and freedom, because you can be sure they won't give it back when all is said and done. As far as UPS....so far, my center only cares when the big wigs are in town, and honestly, even some of them didn't always have it on. A few drivers wear them constantly but that's about it. I also have asthma, and I remember when the masks first were suggested and I wore one at the grocery store, I could hardly stand it. I was constantly pulling it down for air because it was suffocating me. What a sick form of torture. Psychological, and nearly physical. Anyone who can't see that, I don't know what to tell you. If you want to wear a mask, go right ahead, but don't tell me I'M the selfish one for not wearing one to protect you, as you eat your mega large McDonalds triple quarter pounder with cheese and a bucket of soda while smoking a pack of cigarettes a day.

 

[Wally]

I keep telling people that they could sue for the building "practicing medicine without a license". Thats a legit crime, and since this is altering the immune system of an individual against their will (in many cases), Id say the ground is set for enormous lawsuits.

I dont give a fk who tells me to put a mask on. Every * with a laser thermometer thinks theyre an RN now, but what they are REALLY doing is looking for liability so when a business takes your temperature and then writes your name down, if you are showing one degree higher than normal, 99 degrees even, and they have an outbreak, guess who they are gonna pin it on? The UPS guy, because thats whats gonna get them paid. Thats why our center manager told us to not let anyone take our temps. Though in all honesty when Im in a business, I wear a mask over my mouth only and breath through my nose because the mask isnt mitigating anything anyways. Viruses are microscopic... but breathing your own CO2 all day will damage your immune system and make it ripe for bacteria and viruses.

My governor isnt my doctor. So therefore, I only take medical advice from my doctor.

No, what they really fear is being shut down.

 

[Observer]

Be grateful your hub cares enough about the mask mandate. We hear through the grapevine when someone has passed due to covid. Soem of us have relatives that have to be careful and the company doesn't care. IT's all about the bottom line. Put up plexiglass shields like a lot of companies - have cleaner restrooms, cover the drinking fountains. A lot of us come in and work hard for the company and then we are treated poorly. The virus is a real threat and shame on people who don't care - they will get their Karma. This will pass, however, people will remember how their safety was ignored. Dude file all you want because if you lived in a Communist country you wouldn't be allowed to voice your concerns.

 

[Jumpin Jack Flash]

It seems the Teamsters has lost the mask debate. Workers, both union and non-union being forced to wear them.

 

[wilberforce15]

Be grateful your hub cares enough about the mask mandate. We hear through the grapevine when someone has passed due to covid. Soem of us have relatives that have to be careful and the company doesn't care. IT's all about the bottom line. Put up plexiglass shields like a lot of companies - have cleaner restrooms, cover the drinking fountains. A lot of us come in and work hard for the company and then we are treated poorly. The virus is a real threat and shame on people who don't care - they will get their Karma. This will pass, however, people will remember how their safety was ignored. Dude file all you want because if you lived in a Communist country you wouldn't be allowed to voice your concerns.

I agree with the sentiment.

But none of those measures do anything.

 

[zubenelgenubi]

I have worn a dirty sweaty unwashed neck gaiter since June. I take it on and off when delivering to business and have not washed it since July 17. It has six months worth of “virus” and smells like a dead hyena. I still haven’t gotten sick or been contaminated. Must be a miracle.

Be Strong and Take Heart California’s Frightened Mask Wearers – California Globe

californiaglobe.com

"The Globe reported months ago on 'mask mouth,' a new syndrome Dentists report seeing caused by the moisture trapped in face masks, which creates a petri dish of breeding ground for bacteria, as it is in place directly over your mouth. Constant mask-wearing is leading to all kinds of dental disasters like decaying teeth, receding gum lines and seriously sour breath. Long-term mask wearing also is causing persistent coughing, as well as dermatitis on the skin around the mouth."

I am dealing with a chronic cough unrelated to anything else, and also still having sinus issues. Never had problems like those before masking on a regular basis. If I start having gum and teeth issues, the mask will be no more.

 

[MyTripisCut]

Be Strong and Take Heart California’s Frightened Mask Wearers – California Globe

californiaglobe.com

"The Globe reported months ago on 'mask mouth,' a new syndrome Dentists report seeing caused by the moisture trapped in face masks, which creates a petri dish of breeding ground for bacteria, as it is in place directly over your mouth. Constant mask-wearing is leading to all kinds of dental disasters like decaying teeth, receding gum lines and seriously sour breath. Long-term mask wearing also is causing persistent coughing, as well as dermatitis on the skin around the mouth."

I am dealing with a chronic cough unrelated to anything else, and also still having sinus issues. Never had problems like those before masking on a regular basis. If I start having gum and teeth issues, the mask will be no more.

Brother please tell me you haven’t let me rent space since Halloween. Anyway, the dental problems is quite interesting, as is all of this. Carry on friend, you do you and I’ll do me, respectfully.