Ground to absorb Express

[It will be fine]

People vote on a union and lose their job on the process. What did they win?

Fedex doesn’t close the doors. One building votes in the union, they raise wages at nearby buildings while the union building is negotiating. They move work to the other buildings too, cutting hours for the union workers. All of the sudden the union workers are making less with fewer hours and they vote to decertify. Rinse and repeat.

 

[Oldfart]

Fedex doesn’t close the doors. One building votes in the union, they raise wages at nearby buildings while the union building is negotiating. They move work to the other buildings too, cutting hours for the union workers. All of the sudden the union workers are making less with fewer hours and they vote to decertify. Rinse and repeat.

Just responding to myth about a union means closing the doors.

 

[bacha29]

Just say no to drugs.

Just say "yes" to reality.

 

[bacha29]

Fedex doesn’t close the doors. One building votes in the union, they raise wages at nearby buildings while the union building is negotiating. They move work to the other buildings too, cutting hours for the union workers. All of the sudden the union workers are making less with fewer hours and they vote to decertify. Rinse and repeat.

If I were you I wouldn't worry about what anti union counter measures X has at it's disposal I would worry about what I had if my grunts were tired of working for at best half what the guys at UPS were getting for the same work. Sure you could try firing your mules should they attempt to gain union representation but if your unmanned trucks were to sit there for even a day it's "hasta lavista baby". And even by your own admission they would send you on your way if you were to sign a union labor contract.

Nope. Don't worry about X's efforts at thwarting a move to unionize. You're the one who appears to be in a far more tenuous position because contrary to what you may believe no employee is loyal to his employer especially if he thinks his getting screwed over pay wise.

 

[Oldfart]

Just say "yes" to reality.

"Reality" gets distorted when doing drugs. Bummer

 

[It will be fine]

If I were you I wouldn't worry about what anti union counter measures X has at it's disposal I would worry about what I had if my grunts were tired of working for at best half what the guys at UPS were getting for the same work. Sure you could try firing your mules should they attempt to gain union representation but if your unmanned trucks were to sit there for even a day it's "hasta lavista baby". And even by your own admission they would send you on your way if you were to sign a union labor contract.

Nope. Don't worry about X's efforts at thwarting a move to unionize. You're the one who appears to be in a far more tenuous position because contrary to what you may believe no employee is loyal to his employer especially if he thinks his getting screwed over pay wise.

Contracting is an anti union counter measure. Thanks for the advice about my employees, but I have much more experience in handling them than you do.

 

[Oldfart]

Contracting is an anti union counter measure. Thanks for the advice about my employees, but I have much more experience in handling them than you do.

bacha just got shot down. ouch

 

[bacha29]

Contracting is an anti union counter measure. Thanks for the advice about my employees, but I have much more experience in handling them than you do.

Controlling? Does that include controlling their thought processes? Sooner or later they'll come to the realization that the person who stands between them and compensation parity with the other industry leaders is......you.

 

[Oldfart]

Controlling? Does that include controlling their thought processes? Sooner or later they'll come to the realization that the person who stands between them and compensation parity with the other industry leaders is......you.

Put the pipe down before approaching the keyboard.

 

[vantexan]

Yearly and hourly are 2 different things. We have people making those yearly $ where I am.
5 hours of OT per week puts me at 75k

The two guys I mentioned were in an area that had the lowest payscale. Don't know if they have different payscales like Express does but knowing FedEx they probably do. All I said was if Express paid like Freight does there wouldn't be a push to unionize most likely. At the time I knew them Freight topped out pretty quickly. Express took forever. And why was that? Experienced truck drivers have a lot of options if not getting paid decently. Which illustrates the harsh reality of the business world. If couriers could easily find another job doing the same thing their employer would have to pay better to keep them.

 

[Cactus]

Fred has been quoted on record that if FedEx ever unionized, he would "close the doors".

Very hallow threat regardless of when he said it.

What would Fred and his good ol' boys be doing for a living then? Sweeping floors at Wall Street?

 

[Oldfart]

Very hallow threat regardless of when he said it.

What would Fred and his good ol' boys be doing for a living then? Sweeping floors at Wall Street?

Don't think they will be using an EBT card anytime soon.

 

[59 Dano]

Think about it real hard and you just might get it.

The obvious point would be that UPS is integrated and making good money, but that does nothing to explain why a merger between Ground and Express would/wouldn't be better.

 

[59 Dano]

Couldn't possibly be the fear that they might have to deal with a union if they merged into one unit.

UPS being an anomaly notwithstanding.

It's money. Money, money, money.

Go look at the margin that Express is earning with a traditional employee model. Then look at the margin Ground earns with a contractor model. The margin on those Ground packages can't and won't be maintained after a shift to an employee model. The Ground business model is what makes the margin so high, and if Ground wasn't so horribly managed and inefficient it would be higher.

 

[59 Dano]

Fred has been quoted on record that if FedEx ever unionized, he would "close the doors". While that may no longer be a viable plan, it goes to the root of the totally anti-union stance that corporate FedEx embraces.

I've read a million interviews with Fred S and have never seen any remark of that nature. Would love a link to such.

 

[dmac1]

It's money. Money, money, money.

Go look at the margin that Express is earning with a traditional employee model. Then look at the margin Ground earns with a contractor model. The margin on those Ground packages can't and won't be maintained after a shift to an employee model. The Ground business model is what makes the margin so high, and if Ground wasn't so horribly managed and inefficient it would be higher.

You need to look at average. Combining divisions could save enough to make up for the 'extra' expense of ground drivers being employees.

First off, you ignore the fact that ground drivers are ALREADY employees, just paid through so-called 'independent' businesses. You seem to think that Fedex would need to pay more then the ISPs do. One thing the ISP model has done is show FEDEX how cheaply some people will work. And with the fantastic profits you ISPs claim, there is NO reason other than the unions that fedex hasn't already dropped the ISP model. Fedex could take those great profits and even pay drivers a little more. Fedex doesn't need multiple managers at each location.

Secondly, eliminating the ISP would free-up that 'profit' they take and add it to fedex's bottom line instead. The ISP is useless EXCEPT for making it harder to unionize. You seem to think that having a multitude of ISPs is somehow more efficient than one employer having the economy of numbers. That's just limited thinking.

Fedex can do maintenance, bookkeeping, vehicle purchase and maintenance ALL cheaper than thousands of separate individuals can get those services/products for. Fedex inherited the contractor model, and has tried to see if it will work for them. I don't think that the ISP model gives them the ability to make changes quickly and the model has the inherent problems of small employers getting quality workers with incentive to remain employed.

 

[vantexan]

I've read a million interviews with Fred S and have never seen any remark of that nature. Would love a link to such.

Heard that in several stations 20+ years ago. Something some mgrs like to say.

 

[bbsam]

It's money. Money, money, money.

Go look at the margin that Express is earning with a traditional employee model. Then look at the margin Ground earns with a contractor model. The margin on those Ground packages can't and won't be maintained after a shift to an employee model. The Ground business model is what makes the margin so high, and if Ground wasn't so horribly managed and inefficient it would be higher.

I’m not sure you’re reading those quarterlies correctly.

I’ve often wondered what that margin really is. It used to be in the high teens. Then it dropped to around 10 to 12%.

About that time Ground started really ramping up with new facilities and hubs.

So my question is, did the margin really drop or is it just reinvested and therefore not showing on the balance sheet?

 

[It will be fine]

I’m not sure you’re reading those quarterlies correctly.

I’ve often wondered what that margin really is. It used to be in the high teens. Then it dropped to around 10 to 12%.

About that time Ground started really ramping up with new facilities and hubs.

So my question is, did the margin really drop or is it just reinvested and therefore not showing on the balance sheet?

They’ve really pulled back on the infrastructure recently. They’ve cancelled a new building around here and pushed back another a few years.

Dmac raises an interesting angle, but I think he’s wrong. Costs would increase with corporate owned trucks and employees. Legitimate truck maintenance would cost a lot more than the bubble gum and duct tape that keeps Ground trucks on the road. Work Comp alone would be a massive hit to the profits. Now if a contractor does poorly on the injury front he’s replaced by a new company with lower costs. Fedex employees would be filing claims left and right and the extra manpower to cover for them would eat all that profit up.

ISP employed drivers work for them for a reason. If they wanted to work for Fedex they could, but often they prefer the relaxed atmosphere that comes with working for a small company.

 

[Cactus]

I've read a million interviews with Fred S and have never seen any remark of that nature. Would love a link to such.

You don't need any link. Fred being the spoiled child he's been for 70+ years always has had to have absolute full control of everyone at FedEx. Why do you think he's spent over $30 million dollars on lobbyists to keep X under the RLA? The whole purpose has always been to keep the union out. And the whole sham of "independent" contractors at Ground, again, to keep the union out. His actions have always spoken louder than words when it comes down to potential unionization.