I guess I just lost all my seniority?

[ComfortablyNumb]

I've been doing a PT NDA route for several years and am second on the PT seniority list. Last year I was laid off for a couple of months. After using all my leave time I talked to a BA. He said I should have never been laid off and filed a grievance that they either put me back to work at my position or allow me to bump any PT position in the building that had less seniority than me, which would have been any position. I was put back on the schedule the next week. However, I was only given one pickup so I didn't even come close to my guaranteed hours. So, they had me work the Customer Counter for 1.25 hours a day and started the person working the CC later. A couple of months ago they eliminated all the drop off letter boxes, so they gave my pickups (I had gained one over the year) to the senior NDA driver and told the BA I had to go to the bottom of the seniority list. He got the center manager to agree to let me choose a preferred job, so I chose to work the CC for 3.5 hours. A FT driver position had been posted a couple of weeks prior, and the person who was working the CC after me won the bid. It looked like all was good, until the person who won the bid disqualified himself. This happened while I was on vacation. When I checked the schedule the week before I was to come back, which was this week, I saw I was scheduled to do Local Sort/Car Wash, not CC. Supervisor said that since he had DQed himself he got his job back and I have to do "what's left". I called BA, who called center manager, who then put me back on CC. The steward, who is the senior air driver and hates me with a passion, went over the BA's head and found someone who says that when a position is eliminated, the affected person can't exercise seniority, but bumps the lowest seniority employee and has to wait for a preferred position comes available to bid on. The BA consulted a BA from another local who agreed with that. Next week the highest seniority PT in the building will be doing the bottom of the totem pole job, washing cars. I guess they can take away my seniority away, but they can't change the fact I am the senior employee at age 67.

 

[I have NOT been lurking]

K

 

[Johney]

 

[Coldworld]

View attachment 500863

Never understood why pt'ers think air pkgs are their work. All pkgs outside of the early am's and Saturday's should be put on full time pkg car drivers and if for some reason there is a situation that other full timers can't help then have an air driver do it. I know the contract has language regarding the air but in all but the most dire circumstances those airs should be ours.

 

[Bubblehead]

Never understood why pt'ers think air pkgs are their work. All pkgs outside of the early am's and Saturday's should be put on full time pkg car drivers and if for some reason there is a situation that other full timers can't help then have an air driver do it. I know the contract has language regarding the air but in all but the most dire circumstances those airs should be ours.

Yep, the packages these PT Air Drivers deliver and pickup are supposed to be "exception packages", meaning ones the regular drivers cannot service due to time commitments.

Exceptions = money; therefore will always be eliminated when possible....and rightfully so.

Article 40 says the Company "may", not shall, use these employees in these circumstances (including EAM's).

No one is entitled.

 

[Wally]

OP,

When you first were notified of a layoff, what did you do?

Most of us here, would be personally digging into the contract, making calls, seeking out union advice?

You just said, "ok management, I'll take time off". Looks like you gambled and lost.

 

[ComfortablyNumb]

OP,

When you first were notified of a layoff, what did you do?

Most of us here, would be personally digging into the contract, making calls, seeking out union advice?

You just said, "ok management, I'll take time off". Looks like you gambled and lost.

Hello Wally,

I was contacted by the BA on September 19 that the company was eliminating my position, and they were saying that because I had not worked in the building (I had) that I had to go to the bottom of the seniority list. He wanted to arrange a phone meeting with him, the center manager, and myself to discuss it. I told him I had never heard of someone being sent to the bottom of the seniority list, and our previous BA, who is retiring, had told me that I could bump any PTer with less seniority than me. I also asked about when they gave notice as Change of Operations language says the Company has to notify the Union several days in advance. He said that didn't really apply as they weren't laying me off, they were eliminating my position and keeping me working in the building. Apparently, the center manager would not agree to the phone meeting, instead agreed I should be able to pick a position and asked the BA to find out which position I wanted. Since I was already opening the Customer Counter, I said I would like to keep doing that, and that the person I would be displacing had won a FT bid and would be vacating it anyway. The next week. September 23rd, I was awarded the position scheduled to work the CC. The other person was assigned Local Sort/Car Wash until he began training for package.

I started a four week, planned vacation on October 7th. As the Supervisor was also on vacation that week and couldn't start his training, they had the other guy work the CC. He started training on October 14 and another person from Local Sort was assign ed to cover the CC. On October 14, or thereabouts, the other guy disqualified himself from driving. He was scheduled to cover the CC as I was on vacation. Apparently, the Steward that hates me went into action, saying that the other guy gets his job at CC back and I go to the bottom of the seniority list. From what I've heard there was a lot of back and forth going on, but on the schedule posted November 1, I was scheduled for Local Sort, the other guy for CC. When I questioned the Supervisor he said it was decided he got his job back. I immediately called the BA, who disagreed. He called the center manager and in less than 20 minutes I got a call back saying it was fixed. I also got a text from the Supervisor saying it was decided I was going to work the CC and he had changed the schedule. I worked the CC all this week. Yesterday I got a phone call from the BA. He said the Steward had gone over his head and found someone who said I should go to the bottom of the seniority list. The BA consulted with a BA from a larger local on the other side of the state, who also agreed. So, the BA was reversing everything, even though he felt seniority should prevail and apologized to me. He later texted me asking me to text the center manager what my preference was, Local Sort or Preload. I texted her my preference, and she replied, "OK. Thank you.", which is the only communication I have had from her in this whole ordeal.

Not sure where I could go from here. If you know if there is someone I could contact, let me know.

 

[Just A UPS Guy]

Hello Wally,

I was contacted by the BA on September 19 that the company was eliminating my position, and they were saying that because I had not worked in the building (I had) that I had to go to the bottom of the seniority list. He wanted to arrange a phone meeting with him, the center manager, and myself to discuss it. I told him I had never heard of someone being sent to the bottom of the seniority list, and our previous BA, who is retiring, had told me that I could bump any PTer with less seniority than me. I also asked about when they gave notice as Change of Operations language says the Company has to notify the Union several days in advance. He said that didn't really apply as they weren't laying me off, they were eliminating my position and keeping me working in the building. Apparently, the center manager would not agree to the phone meeting, instead agreed I should be able to pick a position and asked the BA to find out which position I wanted. Since I was already opening the Customer Counter, I said I would like to keep doing that, and that the person I would be displacing had won a FT bid and would be vacating it anyway. The next week. September 23rd, I was awarded the position scheduled to work the CC. The other person was assigned Local Sort/Car Wash until he began training for package.

I started a four week, planned vacation on October 7th. As the Supervisor was also on vacation that week and couldn't start his training, they had the other guy work the CC. He started training on October 14 and another person from Local Sort was assign ed to cover the CC. On October 14, or thereabouts, the other guy disqualified himself from driving. He was scheduled to cover the CC as I was on vacation. Apparently, the Steward that hates me went into action, saying that the other guy gets his job at CC back and I go to the bottom of the seniority list. From what I've heard there was a lot of back and forth going on, but on the schedule posted November 1, I was scheduled for Local Sort, the other guy for CC. When I questioned the Supervisor he said it was decided he got his job back. I immediately called the BA, who disagreed. He called the center manager and in less than 20 minutes I got a call back saying it was fixed. I also got a text from the Supervisor saying it was decided I was going to work the CC and he had changed the schedule. I worked the CC all this week. Yesterday I got a phone call from the BA. He said the Steward had gone over his head and found someone who said I should go to the bottom of the seniority list. The BA consulted with a BA from a larger local on the other side of the state, who also agreed. So, the BA was reversing everything, even though he felt seniority should prevail and apologized to me. He later texted me asking me to text the center manager what my preference was, Local Sort or Preload. I texted her my preference, and she replied, "OK. Thank you.", which is the only communication I have had from her in this whole ordeal.

Not sure where I could go from here. If you know if there is someone I could contact, let me know.

What local are you in?

 

[ComfortablyNumb]

Yep, the packages these PT Air Drivers deliver and pickup are supposed to be "exception packages", meaning ones the regular drivers cannot service due to time commitments.

Exceptions = money; therefore will always be eliminated when possible....and rightfully so.

Article 40 says the Company "may", not shall, use these employees in these circumstances (including EAM's).

No one is entitled.

When I worked in large hub, three centers sending out 50 package cars a day each, FT drivers delivered all the air, even EAM. They also did all the PUs, met at a location and handed all the NDA to one driver, who shuttled it to the airport. Geographically, our footprint was small and the airport about 30 minutes away. The center I work at now is rural and small. Air drivers start in the late morning, drive 80 miles round trip to PU and return to the center, then one of them takes the PUs to a center near the airport, which is two hours away.

FWEW, I agree with you. I've even said so to a former center manager, the Supervisor, a BA and a Steward. They could use two FT drivers to go to the pickup areas and deliver ground until it is time to pick up the NDA. They could then return to the Center, and one go to the airport while the other does deliveries and pickups near the center. Granted the Company would have to pay a few more dollars per hour in wages, but they wouldn't have to put an extra vehicle on the road, nor would they have service failures (which they don't seem to care about anymore) when there are PUs too far apart to be covered by one driver, which has already happened.

 

[ComfortablyNumb]

What local are you in?

760

 

[542thruNthru]

Without knowing what supplemental agreement you are we can't really answer your question.

I will say where I am if your position is eliminated you have the ability to bump the lowest senior person. It seems like your BA tried to make a side deal because of your age. Once others found out it sounds like your steward had to step in and let your BA know that what was done was not part of the contract.

You're 67 and PT. I suggest retirement.

 

[ComfortablyNumb]

Without knowing what supplemental agreement you are we can't really answer your question.

I will say where I am if your position is eliminated you have the ability to bump the lowest senior person. It seems like your BA tried to make a side deal because of your age. Once others found out it sounds like your steward had to step in and let your BA know that what was done was not part of the contract.

You're 67 and PT. I suggest retirement.

LOL, you are in a long line, headed by my wife!

I self-retired when I was 55. When the government decided to make healthcare affordable, our premiums went through the roof, I had been doing seasonal Feeder for several years, I came back as a PTer for the benefits. I was going to retire again at 65, but found out I can keep working and draw my Teamster pension. If I get 750 hours in a year (which I have) I get a raise in my pension. If I quit, I have to pay for Medicare Part B and the Teamster supplement, which would be about $500 a month. Being the cheap bastard I am, I am willing to work a few hours a day to not have to pay that and earn some extra disposable income. Like a donkey chasing the carrot on the stick, I keep going to the nest milestone. First one is the 750 hours, the second is my anniversary date. I've made the 750 hours mark this year. My anniversary date is in March. I might take your advice then.

As for the SA, it's Western States and JC28. The only thing it says about Change of Operations is to refer to the NMA.

 

[Wally]

Hello Wally,

I was contacted by the BA on September 19 that the company was eliminating my position, and they were saying that because I had not worked in the building (I had) that I had to go to the bottom of the seniority list. He wanted to arrange a phone meeting with him, the center manager, and myself to discuss it. I told him I had never heard of someone being sent to the bottom of the seniority list, and our previous BA, who is retiring, had told me that I could bump any PTer with less seniority than me. I also asked about when they gave notice as Change of Operations language says the Company has to notify the Union several days in advance. He said that didn't really apply as they weren't laying me off, they were eliminating my position and keeping me working in the building. Apparently, the center manager would not agree to the phone meeting, instead agreed I should be able to pick a position and asked the BA to find out which position I wanted. Since I was already opening the Customer Counter, I said I would like to keep doing that, and that the person I would be displacing had won a FT bid and would be vacating it anyway. The next week. September 23rd, I was awarded the position scheduled to work the CC. The other person was assigned Local Sort/Car Wash until he began training for package.

I started a four week, planned vacation on October 7th. As the Supervisor was also on vacation that week and couldn't start his training, they had the other guy work the CC. He started training on October 14 and another person from Local Sort was assign ed to cover the CC. On October 14, or thereabouts, the other guy disqualified himself from driving. He was scheduled to cover the CC as I was on vacation. Apparently, the Steward that hates me went into action, saying that the other guy gets his job at CC back and I go to the bottom of the seniority list. From what I've heard there was a lot of back and forth going on, but on the schedule posted November 1, I was scheduled for Local Sort, the other guy for CC. When I questioned the Supervisor he said it was decided he got his job back. I immediately called the BA, who disagreed. He called the center manager and in less than 20 minutes I got a call back saying it was fixed. I also got a text from the Supervisor saying it was decided I was going to work the CC and he had changed the schedule. I worked the CC all this week. Yesterday I got a phone call from the BA. He said the Steward had gone over his head and found someone who said I should go to the bottom of the seniority list. The BA consulted with a BA from a larger local on the other side of the state, who also agreed. So, the BA was reversing everything, even though he felt seniority should prevail and apologized to me. He later texted me asking me to text the center manager what my preference was, Local Sort or Preload. I texted her my preference, and she replied, "OK. Thank you.", which is the only communication I have had from her in this whole ordeal.

Not sure where I could go from here. If you know if there is someone I could contact, let me know.

@burrheadd, @MyTripisCut
You getting all this?

 

[DriveInDriveOut]

Next week the highest seniority PT in the building will be doing the bottom of the totem pole job, washing cars.

Hey man, don't knock that position.

One of the most highly respected members of this forum is a high seniority long time PT carwasher.

From what I understand, he is also the most highly respected employee in his local, and possibly in the entire country to be honest.

It is a position of great honor.
Consider yourself lucky.

 

[542thruNthru]

LOL, you are in a long line, headed by my wife!

I self-retired when I was 55. When the government decided to make healthcare affordable, our premiums went through the roof, I had been doing seasonal Feeder for several years, I came back as a PTer for the benefits. I was going to retire again at 65, but found out I can keep working and draw my Teamster pension. If I get 750 hours in a year (which I have) I get a raise in my pension. If I quit, I have to pay for Medicare Part B and the Teamster supplement, which would be about $500 a month. Being the cheap bastard I am, I am willing to work a few hours a day to not have to pay that and earn some extra disposable income. Like a donkey chasing the carrot on the stick, I keep going to the nest milestone. First one is the 750 hours, the second is my anniversary date. I've made the 750 hours mark this year. My anniversary date is in March. I might take your advice then.

As for the SA, it's Western States and JC28. The only thing it says about Change of Operations is to refer to the NMA.

This does not sound like a change of operations.

You were not forced to change your building because the work was moved or laid off. The air position is no longer needed and you bumped back into the building.

 

[Guppy23]

Mr Numb, If they ended your classification you would have your choice to bump the lowest seniority in whatever classification that you were qualified for. Seems like exception driver or carwash (unless you have harsh winters) are both retirement (laid back and easy ) jobs so I guess it could be worse. Best of luck to ya. With holidaze kicking into high gear nda exception driver classification might magically reappear.

 

[P£INinY0uR***UnionGuy8564]

Well if you're up for the abuse and are a cheap bastard that doesn't want to pay for health insurance before you get Medicare, you can work as few hours a week as possible like some people do. There's also a part time carwash dude in my building that's preventing a 22.3 gig from being made but they're desperate right now since they restructured carwash and decided to have automated bulk carts that don't work for . Should have worked in the building instead of thinking doing seasonal work would somehow get you the job faster than people that have been here.