Path of the Dark Side

[pretzel_man]

I guess I'll have the dissenting opinion on this thread.

I started at UPS 33 years ago as an idealist, and I'm still one today. Looking back on my career, I'm proud of the things the organization (and I) have done and especially of the people I've worked with.

That being said, as a management person you need a much different skillset than as an hourly. Contrary to others' thoughts, I think this lack of skillset is the biggest missing piece, not the day to day experience.

As a management person, you will be measured by how well you can get other people to do their job. You will need to be a good planner, communicator, hold people accountable, follow up, etc. These things are more important than knowing every route in the center.

For instance... There are a pile of packages left in the building. You will need to figure out how to get those delivered. Many supervisors figure that their job is now complete once those packages are dispatched.

That is the smallest part of the problem. Why were they there? How do you keep them from being there tomorrow? Do you have a bad plan or is someone not executing a good plan?

UPS is a big ship. You will not turn it quickly. But like a big ship, small incremental adjustments will get things turned.

Can you make a difference? Sure, but don't underestimate how long it will take.

Go into management with the right expectations and skills. Have a pure heart and high integrity and you will do well.

P-Man

 

[stevetheupsguy]

I guess I'll have the dissenting opinion on this thread.

I started at UPS 33 years ago as an idealist, and I'm still one today. Looking back on my career, I'm proud of the things the organization (and I) have done and especially of the people I've worked with.

That being said, as a management person you need a much different skillset than as an hourly. Contrary to others' thoughts, I think this lack of skillset is the biggest missing piece, not the day to day experience.

As a management person, you will be measured by how well you can get other people to do their job. You will need to be a good planner, communicator, hold people accountable, follow up, etc. These things are more important than knowing every route in the center.

For instance... There are a pile of packages left in the building. You will need to figure out how to get those delivered. Many supervisors figure that their job is now complete once those packages are dispatched.

That is the smallest part of the problem. Why were they there? How do you keep them from being there tomorrow? Do you have a bad plan or is someone not executing a good plan?

UPS is a big ship. You will not turn it quickly. But like a big ship, small incremental adjustments will get things turned.

Can you make a difference? Sure, but don't underestimate how long it will take.

Go into management with the right expectations and skills. Have a pure heart and high integrity and you will do well.

P-Man

Very well said. I'm glad your ideals are still intact.

S-Man.

 

[Channahon]

So i am taking the path of darkness at UPS. I turned in my letter for full time supervision and got a go ahead on my evaluation so all that is left is the in-box, the 100 question test, and the interview. My main goal is to sit at Scott's desk one day. My question is, and maybe this should be a poll, but how high of a probability is it that i can fix problems? I mean could i really make employees like the dispatch? Enjoy their management team? Actually want to do their job correctly? I'm young (22) and have done pre-load, local sort, and driving, so I've got a taste of everything and i know it's not much but i figured i needed to start moving up as soon as possible. I need to bring back the idealisms that Jim Casey brought. I need to serve my workers. I need to use the simplest tools possible to do the job. And need to pay attention to my job and not work to satisfy the people above me, just do my job efficiently and expertly. Above all, use common sense. So what do you think?

It is refreshing to see someone as young as yourself pursuing a full time management position at UPS. And P-Man gave your some great advice and insight with all his years in management.

Management is not easy at any company, however, using your leadership, communications and people skills will support all your goals. Every management position you aspire to, will have challenges, from the perspective of change and more responsibility. I will tell you the further you progress in managment, the more satisfying the position. As you know in your heart you are managing to the best of your abilities, and your employees will see your efforts and do the job for you, themselves and their families and the company.

That in istelf is a result of common sense. Good luck

 

[UnconTROLLed]

I guess I'll have the dissenting opinion on this thread.

I started at UPS 33 years ago as an idealist, and I'm still one today. Looking back on my career, I'm proud of the things the organization (and I) have done and especially of the people I've worked with.

That being said, as a management person you need a much different skillset than as an hourly. Contrary to others' thoughts, I think this lack of skillset is the biggest missing piece, not the day to day experience.

As a management person, you will be measured by how well you can get other people to do their job. You will need to be a good planner, communicator, hold people accountable, follow up, etc. These things are more important than knowing every route in the center.

For instance... There are a pile of packages left in the building. You will need to figure out how to get those delivered. Many supervisors figure that their job is now complete once those packages are dispatched.

That is the smallest part of the problem. Why were they there? How do you keep them from being there tomorrow? Do you have a bad plan or is someone not executing a good plan?

UPS is a big ship. You will not turn it quickly. But like a big ship, small incremental adjustments will get things turned.

Can you make a difference? Sure, but don't underestimate how long it will take.

Go into management with the right expectations and skills. Have a pure heart and high integrity and you will do well.

P-Man

I am going to disagree. Having taken the MAPP testing and seeing the content in recent years, plus having been accepted for promotion, I can honestly say the type of people that are approved for "advancement" into the P/T supervisor ranks are not at all judged by their heart, work ethic, long-term goals nor "incremental adjustments. They ARE judged by their ability to get people to work together without problems, ability to account for staffing and numbers, be held accountable for a plan made elsewhere whether it was destined to work or not from the start, and how you would react/decision making in situations that are beyond your control.

None of the concepts, at least in my experience, remotely took into consideration empathy, the desire to succeed with good intentions, or even accountability for ones actions in which they have been given authority to control.

 

[tieguy]

They ARE judged by their ability to get people to work together without problems, ability to account for staffing and numbers, be held accountable for a plan made elsewhere whether it was destined to work or not from the start, and how you would react/decision making in situations that are beyond your control.

None of the concepts, at least in my experience, remotely took into consideration empathy, the desire to succeed with good intentions, or even accountability for ones actions in which they have been given authority to control.

I think you can both be right. you get the job done through your people. You people will respond more favorably to helping you achieve your business plan if you lead with a pure heart and integrity as P-man said.

 

[Theichii]

Thank you for the input, I have been forced into management positions before. I loved the challenge. In the military during basic training I was dorm leader. I had to answer for 60 people if they weren't dressed correctly, if they didn't do their chores correctly, if they didn't know their training material, and all of that on maybe 6 hours of sleep at night. Then when i got to the actual job phase i was a Red Rope, and then had to answer for 500 people. Why they didn't wear the same type of uniform as everyone else. Why they didn't make it out of the building on time as everyone else, why their dormitory floors weren't as clean as everyone else's floor. Why couldn't they perform well on their tests. This was a challenge as well. I'm not saying this will pale in comparison, but i performed my job well and was generally liked and the problem people came to me for advice on how to fix things. It will be awhile before i can change things i know this. But if i have gained anything from past experiences, it is this: a little at a time adds up. If i can help a driver get off early without majorly inconviencing other drivers around them, he/she might be more willing to take more work when it is asked of them. If i put more drivers on road than is asked from time to time, it makes the others happier than if i persistently piled stops on everyone. My management team has done hourly work for at least 15 years before, my center manager was a driver and a feeder driver. My on road was a pkg driver, until his knee went bad. They both have compassion for their drivers and although i haven't been doing this for long i believe i would be able to emulate their compassion until i get higher and then it would be to understand the decisions my lower management team has made, and also why they did this. Happier workers equals higher productivity. And i will reference my military experience again. If i made the other airmen below me happy, as in help them when they needed, they generally managed themselves better and made my job a lot easier and made me look better in front of my superiors.

 

[stevetheupsguy]

Then I guess you're on your way, good luck, chum.

 

[Dagoof]

There was an old man walking down the beach. He watched as a young child was running up and down the shore picking up starfish that had washed in with the tide and throwing them back into the sea. The old man stopped and said there are hundreds wash up on this beach youll never get them all. Why are you wasting your time when it will make no difference? The boy not hesitating picked up another and threw it back to the sea and said " It makes a difference to that one."

Doesnt hurt to try even if you are at the bottom. If you can make an improvement at one center It might be hard work but It can be done. Start small like fixing plans learn all the routes. That way when those pkgs that are left in the building you will know who is closest at that time not just who the lable belongs too. There are lots of little things that will make a difference if you just listen to your people and their problems. Then act do something about it. Sure your not going to be able to make every one happy all at once. But one at a time will make a difference.

 

[Catatonic]

Then I guess you're on your way, good luck, chum.

I'm sure you meant "chum" in the best Jimmy Buffett way.
Ran into a chum with a bottle of rum ...

P-Man and Chan gave you good advise along with food for thought from Upstate.

Only thing I can can add as advise ... don't go into management unless you have a college degree. Get that first.

 

[rocket man]

TELL someone who cares call up scott and tell him you want a sit down with him.

 

[trickpony1]

Maybe "chum" was meant in context as bait used for fishing.

 

[stevetheupsguy]

Did I say chum? Oh man, I left off the P.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

Did I say chum? Oh man, I left off the P.

Pchum?

 

[stevetheupsguy]

Pchum?

LOL, close.

 

[pickup]

hoaxster actually made an instructional musical video in which he gives advice to the stereotypical idealistic management wanna be. Take a look.

Company Way, How to Succeed in Business, Robert Morse

 

[DS]

If i put more drivers on road than is asked from time to time, .

I admire your confidence and don't doubt your sincerity in your endeavors, but this one line made me wonder if your center is run differently from most others.
You will be talked to the first time,and if it happens again you will get the old line,if you can't do it we will find someone that can.
Don't get me wrong,the experience you gain at ups can only enhance your resume . Use ups to further your education and think of it as a stepping stone to achieving what you want in life.If you do end up in that big leather chair in the big brown tower then kudos to you.
Good luck

 

[evilleace]

Hey all the luck to you I hope you can make some of those changes I sure would like to see them happen.

 

[anonymous6]

So i am taking the path of darkness at UPS. I turned in my letter for full time supervision and got a go ahead on my evaluation so all that is left is the in-box, the 100 question test, and the interview. My main goal is to sit at Scott's desk one day. My question is, and maybe this should be a poll, but how high of a probability is it that i can fix problems? I mean could i really make employees like the dispatch? Enjoy their management team? Actually want to do their job correctly? I'm young (22) and have done pre-load, local sort, and driving, so I've got a taste of everything and i know it's not much but i figured i needed to start moving up as soon as possible. I need to bring back the idealisms that Jim Casey brought. I need to serve my workers. I need to use the simplest tools possible to do the job. And need to pay attention to my job and not work to satisfy the people above me, just do my job efficiently and expertly. Above all, use common sense. So what do you think?

Well, I applaud your intentions and wish you the best of luck. Observe the "Golden Rule" Treat people the way you would like to be treated. Do not do anything unethical or something that gives you a bad feeling in the pit of your stomach. Always keep learning. Read Og Mandinos books, John Templeton books, positive stuff. Read positive business books.

I have seen so many young idealistic people like you come along with high hopes and just a couple months later become so jaded.

But if enough of you came along and perserveered, maybe this company could get back on the right track.

personally. I don't see it happening but good luck any way.

 

[Catatonic]

Pchum?

Or was it phucm?

 

[anonymous6]

I believe that you can do this, but, I don't think you'll achieve your goal by doing it that way. I think you'll need to go undercover. Sort of like a mole. You'll have to blend in, do as they do, while working your way to the top. Then after all of those years, you just may find yourself way up there, in that very seat you long for.

At this point, you can shake of all of the dirt, and reveal the true you, if that true you still exists. Good Luck!

I bet this method is used a lot but it never works. You've heard the story of "tarbaby", haven't you?

The dirt always ends up sticking.