Strike in Chicago?

[bad company]

bitch bitch bitch complain complain complain, i can see youre working under the table for the union.

I try to ignore the majority of your posts, because frankly...you come off as someone who is exceptionally arrogant and/or extraordinarily ignorant. I’ve tried to bite my tongue and not respond to your self-indulgent antics and blatant misinformation. You brag about being a part-time supervisor as though you are God’s gift to UPS. As a former part-time sup myself, you embarrass me. So I ask you…please grow up and stop being a little infant.

Thanks in advance…

 

[Mike Hawk]

It is very different on your side of the fence Tie, your negotiator does not need the majority of the company’s opinion to pass a contract, you have no say in it. The union side however is very much democratic, and the members need to be informed to make the right decision.

Would you want to wait till the last second to know what the presidential candidates are and have very little time to make an educated choice? Or would you rather put them under the spotlight for a while to debate and learn more about them.

 

[filthpig]

During the '97 strike, locals 705 and 710 were not technically on strike but were unable to work due to the fact that the work was "struck goods" and other locals put up picket lines at our facilities. I would expect the reverse to be true. We had one guy cross the line.....he is no longer working for UPS.

Again, I hope this doesn't happen. Why won't the company sit down at the negotiating table? My sense is that they smell weakness. They got, in my opinion, alot of concessions in the Master and they feel they can do the same to us. Remember, if we can get stronger language in our contract it will benefit all of us in future negotiations.

Just my two cents...

if they go on strike, you're not gonna have 2 cents.

 

[tieguy]

It is very different on your side of the fence Tie, your negotiator does not need the majority of the company’s opinion to pass a contract, you have no say in it. The union side however is very much democratic, and the members need to be informed to make the right decision.

Thats what the contract review of an offer is for. Thats why you have a month to attend meetings to review and decide on the final contract offer. Revealing the offers early gets the members worked up unnecessarily. It also creates confusion where members think there are things in the final offer that are not there. Items that are not in the final contract offer but were discussed earlier then become reasons why contracts are voted down. You have four or five versions of the contract on the web page can you remember what was offered in which ones?

 

[But Benefits Are Great!]

So, How about them Mets, huh?

This thread has long ago just turned into static.

"I am neither ANTI-UNION, nor ANTI-COMPANY - Whatever it takes to PRO-VIDE for my family"

 

[local804]

I try to ignore the majority of your posts, because frankly...you come off as someone who is exceptionally arrogant and/or extraordinarily ignorant. I’ve tried to bite my tongue and not respond to your self-indulgent antics and blatant misinformation. You brag about being a part-time supervisor as though you are God’s gift to UPS. As a former part-time sup myself, you embarrass me. So I ask you…please grow up and stop being a little infant.

Thanks in advance…

good post

 

[upsdude]

I just hope the situation reaches a settlement that the majority on both sides can live with.

This thread is a good reminder of just how emotional labor/management relations are at UPS.

At risk of having my head handed to me: The biggest challenge facing UPS isn’t FedEx or the USPS, it’s the horrible management/employee relations and a total lack of trust between either party. There will always be issues causing tension between both, but it continues to get worse as time goes by.

The frustrating thing is that it doesn’t have to be that way. Some of the most vocal Teamsters on here could come work in my building and think they died and went to heaven. Sure, it’s the same stupid stuff at times but it never gets personal. On the other hand I could go to Red’s center (just using Red as an example, not bashing) and wonder what the heck happened.

Management-Employee Relations at UPS need some serious couch time with an expert.

I’d also suggest that unless you’re directly involved in the Chicago negotiations, stay out of it. I know for me I have no clue what those folks face on a day to day basis, neither does any management outside the area.

 

[705red]

Red,

honestly. Marty is done. Its great that he is grasping on straws and still trying to revive himself but if he is all you got then you got nothing. Soap opera ends in five days and you go back to preaching how your union beat the company into submission to get what you want.

Realistically your union should not reveal negotiation details until all is settled. It takes a lot of pressure of of your negotiators so you guys dont have to grandstand like you have been.

Tie the members voted our union in because they promised members first and no more business as usual. As you can see its not business as ususal, the union has informed the members every step of the way. This is the way it should be as we the members will have to vote on the contract. You might/will disagree but our management is glad for it so they can see hows it going.

Its funny that they dont bring in everyday operation managers to get their input. The union brings in union members because we work under the contract daily to voice our thoughts. Maybe talks would be going better if the preload manager was there just to say, hey i cant get people at $8.50 and the union does have our best interest in hand with this proposal.

 

[I GOT ONE MORE]

my comment was related to the poster who could not figure out that 705 teamsters does not equal all of UPS Teamsters employees.

to answer your question about "how is this possible if everyones under the same national?" well they have local supplements for a reason, but the national guarantees that everyone is under roughly the same terms.

I realize that the members of 705 have stated many times that the proposals put forth to them by UPS are less than what is offered in the NMA. My question to 705 is this: How many times have you proposed that 705 be brought under the NMA?

Now I realize that you are seperate from the NMA, and always have been and blah blah blah. But if you haven't made that proposal to them at this point, give me a reason (a good one please...) as to why.

BRAVO.....I've read through this thread and still can't come up with any real reason why these locals aren't part of the NMA.

WHY?

What a waste of time.

And as far as 705 supporting the 97 strike.......well, when 98% of a workforce goes out, there's not much left for the 2%.

Collective bargaining should be the WHOLE collective.

UPS may be the golden goose and making billions, but they do pay us well.
UPS is a solid company and I, for one, am thrilled to be employed by a company that is unlikely to financially struggle. Look around, there are lots of folks that would love to be standing in your shoes.

I still come back to why. WHY is 705 separate? A real answer, please.

 

[filthpig]

705 is likely separate because back in the day, this local was so large that it could use it's weight to negotiate it's own contract apart form the rest of the locals. I would imagine that in the early 70's 705 probably had about 30,000 members. From UPS' standpoint it probably made sense to negotiate with them separately because of how much freight they could control.
I would imagine that the largest local is in California now, but who cares.
It doesn't really matter to me if they go on strike.
I'm not losing my house and moving in with my momma because a bunch of grown men got into a pissing contest.

 

[705red]

BRAVO.....I've read through this thread and still can't come up with any real reason why these locals aren't part of the NMA.

WHY?

What a waste of time.

And as far as 705 supporting the 97 strike.......well, when 98% of a workforce goes out, there's not much left for the 2%.
What about the people that scabbed and the right to work states? They continued to work as we could have! It wouldnt have been alot of work but do you think ups would have laid anyone of us off because we didnt strike?
Collective bargaining should be the WHOLE collective.

UPS may be the golden goose and making billions, but they do pay us well.
UPS is a solid company and I, for one, am thrilled to be employed by a company that is unlikely to financially struggle. Look around, there are lots of folks that would love to be standing in your shoes.

I still come back to why. WHY is 705 separate? A real answer, please.

705 has never been part of the nma and when i have asked we were never invited, it goes back to when ups first unionized, we have always been seperate.

Whats happens if you were willing to go on strike again for the national, do you think for a second myself and others would not support you. Just because we have seperate contracts does not mean we are not united. Keep buying into tieguys divide and conquer posts. We are only divided if you let management divide us.

 

[I GOT ONE MORE]

705 has never been part of the nma and when i have asked we were never invited, it goes back to when ups first unionized, we have always been seperate.

Whats happens if you were willing to go on strike again for the national, do you think for a second myself and others would not support you. Just because we have seperate contracts does not mean we are not united. Keep buying into tieguys divide and conquer posts. We are only divided if you let management divide us.

OK, at least, this answer is respectful and somewhat insightful. Thank you.

As far as never being invited, that begs a why. Why would UPS want this separation. It seems like more work for them too. UPS and the Teamsters have had a 100 years to consolidate. There is more to this story. Common sense says one contract.

Support is essential for a union, but your local seems to have drawn a line with the rest of the union. Your a part of it, yet your not. Still trying to figure this out. Why not have your own supplemental to address your local concerns, like ALL the other regions. Your isolation seems self-inflicted.

As far as tieguy, I appreciate his input. From my limited time here at Browncafe, I gather he is in management. It helps to understand management better when you try and see things through their eyes. Put yourself in their shoes. How would you manage things if you were the manager. I'm not saying for you to be in mgmt, rather try to realize why they make decisions the way they do. Sometimes this approach can open eyes a little. It works for me, even when I'm in complete disagreement.

Before you start banging on me, I been driving pkg since 1992 and have never had an inspiration to join mgmt. I bust my ass every day, like you, and I am very thankful to work for such a great company. And this is a great company.

Remember, I try to respect a good debate and understand contrarian views. This is how we learn. Hopefully, we can continue this thread with civility. I hope your leadership will come to agreement soon and all this will be moot, maybe the nma inclusion should be part of the handshake.

 

[cachsux]

I'm not losing my house and moving in with my momma because a bunch of grown men got into a pissing contest.

If you feel you`ve have a strong reason to cross a picket line then do so. But when the time for a raise comes don`t stick out your hand. When a family member gets sick don't reach for that insurance card. when you retire don't look for that pension check. You can`t enjoy the benefits of a unions work if you don't stand up for it`s principals.

Whats the difference? You live off your momma or you live off of what the union got for you,your still living off of someones hard work.

 

[BigBrownSanta]

I personally don't think the people who say they will cross the picket line will actually do it. At least not on their own. They'll stick their finger up and check the wind and if one person crosses, they'll wait until it appears a majority will cross, then they'll cross. They don't want to lose their paychecks, but at the same time, they are also too afraid to make waves. The only thing sheep do on their own is stray.

 

[tieguy]

705 has never been part of the nma and when i have asked we were never invited, it goes back to when ups first unionized, we have always been seperate.

Not totally true. Jimmy hoffa the first tried to get your union to join the national back in the late sixties and early seventies and recieved heavy resistance.

Whats happens if you were willing to go on strike again for the national, do you think for a second myself and others would not support you. Just because we have seperate contracts does not mean we are not united. Keep buying into tieguys divide and conquer posts. We are only divided if you let management divide us.

Red I did not divide you guys from the international agreement. You guys did that cause you're special. and you want to see what the national guys get every time so you can then try to top them.

 

[filthpig]

If you feel you`ve have a strong reason to cross a picket line then do so. But when the time for a raise comes don`t stick out your hand. When a family member gets sick don't reach for that insurance card. when you retire don't look for that pension check. You can`t enjoy the benefits of a unions work if you don't stand up for it`s principals.

Whats the difference? You live off your momma or you live off of what the union got for you,your still living off of someones hard work.

That's the stupidest thing I've ever heard. The "Beloved Always Right Union" doesn't pay one ing red cent of my wage, don't pay one ing red cent for my benefits or do a damn thing except pursue their own interests.
This wonderful contract they just shoved up our ass without giving us all of the details (did ANYONE here have any idea we weren't getting a COLA raise?) And I could give a rat's ass what any of them think of me. I'm taking the raise in a couple of weeks and I'm going to the doctor next week and using my insurance because UPS pays for it. Deal with it in therapy, nimrod.

 

[soberups]

That's the stupidest thing I've ever heard. The "Beloved Always Right Union" doesn't pay one ing red cent of my wage, don't pay one ing red cent for my benefits or do a damn thing except pursue their own interests.

I used to live in a neighborhood with a Homeowners Association. When you bought a home in that neighborhood, you had to agree---in writing---to join the association, pay the dues, and follow the rules. Keep the lawn mowed, no junk cars, no allowing Uncle Joe to live in the driveway in a $200 camper, etc. etc. I didnt always like paying the dues and I didnt necessarily agree with all the rules, but it did keep the neighborhood nice and the property values up.
There was a problem involving a guy who was adamant that the rules shouldn't apply to him. According to him, the Homeowners Association wasnt paying one cent of his mortgage, wasnt paying one cent to maintain his home, and wasnt doing a damn thing except pursuing its own interests. He felt that he should have the right to live in and benefit from the nice neighborhood like everyone else, but that he shouldn't have to pay the same dues or follow the same rules. The fact that he chose to buy a house in a neighborhood with rules and dues didnt matter to him... in his mind the rules and dues should only be borne by other people, not him. The Association wound up having to take him to court because he wouldnt tow away the cars and boat in his yard and he wouldnt pay the dues. We won, and he finally sold the house and moved to a neighborhood with rules that were more agreeable to him.

 

[local804]

That's the stupidest thing I've ever heard. The "Beloved Always Right Union" doesn't pay one ing red cent of my wage, don't pay one ing red cent for my benefits or do a damn thing except pursue their own interests.
This wonderful contract they just shoved up our ass without giving us all of the details (did ANYONE here have any idea we weren't getting a COLA raise?) And I could give a rat's ass what any of them think of me. I'm taking the raise in a couple of weeks and I'm going to the doctor next week and using my insurance because UPS pays for it. Deal with it in therapy, nimrod.

Sorry Filthpig, but you really dont have a clue.

 

[dillweed]

Gosh, this deal of why 705/710 aren't under the NMA is getting old. We are hourly pissants in the whole scheme of things and don't KNOW why. There has not been a vote, that I know of, as to whether or not we want it that way.

Therefore I have made up a story to explain the whole thing; one that is fabricated and induced by exhaustion from the constant badgering.

OK, years ago when old man Hoffa was the big kahoona he favored Chicago. All of his mobster buds were there and he liked the special treatment he got. Also enjoyed eating eggrolls in Chinatown and going to the museums. He spent hours upon hours at the Aquarium watching big fish devour the smaller ones.

As time went on he decided that Chicago was such a powerful cog in the UPS wheel that he should just make them separate, try to get them a better contract and wallow in the glory.

He did this and all those under the NMA were angry. Eventually he turned up missing and not one bone of his body has ever been found.

Although there are folks who DO know the answers we seek they will never utter a word.

 

[over9five]

OK, that was....... odd.....



(Although I did like the bigfish/little fish part!)