Torture

[trickpony1]

FAIL.
Dr. Brown, like everyone else commenting on the torture thread, you dont have the first clue what you are talking about.
http://www.theatlantic.com/daily-dish/archive/2009/04/what-reagan-signed/202639/
History may seem inconvenient to many people, including our resident racist, but the law is very clear.
The BUSH administration, its officials and agents of the CIA broke the law, they should all be put on trial or sent to the international court for prosecution.
The penalty in the international court would be very severe.
I hope BUSH and CHENEY get picked up by interpol the next time they leave the country.
TOS.

All this babble coming from a person who will go to local hearing, panel and arbitration and fight "tooth and nail" for a union brother or sister who, however inadvertently, made a mistake and may lose their job.

But yet TOS seems to want to hang our government officials and military from the highest tree.

Amazing.

Bad wars, good warriors.

 

[The Other Side]

All this babble coming from a person who will go to local hearing, panel and arbitration and fight "tooth and nail" for a union brother or sister who, however inadvertently, made a mistake and may lose their job.

But yet TOS seems to want to hang our government officials and military from the highest tree.

Amazing.

Bad wars, good warriors.

And this coming from a guy who supports convicted murderers and rapists.

Ya, you got the high ground covered.

TOS.

 

[brett636]

It seems to me the meaning of torture has been redefined as any action which causes another human being to be uncomfortable. I'll have to remember that next time a member of management wants to discuss my previous days performance. One can just say "As redefined by Diane Fienstien and the democrats this is now officially torture and I cannot participate in this unlawful practice."

You know, when I think of torture I think of some sadistic person breaking bones with a hammer, tearing out fingernails with pliers, and poking sharp objects into places they don't belong.

These pictures depict what I have always believed to be torture.

Are we really defining torture as belly slaps, sleep deprivation, and water boarding? Give me a break. Those techniques defined as enhanced interrogation techniques hardly rise to the level of torture. In fact I find these techniques quite restrained given the kind of goat raping 14th century throwbacks they were being practiced on. Just remember that if these same type of individuals were able to get their hands on anyone of you your experiences will be much worse. When it comes to retrieving information that can save the lives of innocent Americans and or soldiers on the battlefield I don't particularly care how the information is procured. Its more important that we have it instead.

 

[The Other Side]

It seems to me the meaning of torture has been redefined as any action which causes another human being to be uncomfortable. I'll have to remember that next time a member of management wants to discuss my previous days performance. One can just say "As redefined by Diane Fienstien and the democrats this is now officially torture and I cannot participate in this unlawful practice."

You know, when I think of torture I think of some sadistic person breaking bones with a hammer, tearing out fingernails with pliers, and poking sharp objects into places they don't belong.

These pictures depict what I have always believed to be torture.

Are we really defining torture as belly slaps, sleep deprivation, and water boarding? Give me a break. Those techniques defined as enhanced interrogation techniques hardly rise to the level of torture. In fact I find these techniques quite restrained given the kind of goat raping 14th century throwbacks they were being practiced on. Just remember that if these same type of individuals were able to get their hands on anyone of you your experiences will be much worse. When it comes to retrieving information that can save the lives of innocent Americans and or soldiers on the battlefield I don't particularly care how the information is procured. Its more important that we have it instead.

Again, another "circumstance" to justify the un justifiable.

No matter what YOU think is torture, the law is clear. President Reagan, your hero signed the law and made the agreement with the Geneva Convention.

Now you want to second guess your personal hero?

You use president Reagans image as your avatar, yet question his logic and decision making on something Reagan CHAMPIONED.

You can diminish torture all you want, it doesnt make it so.

You can feel anyway you want, it doesnt make it right.

President Reagan went out of his way to end torture and make the USA a respectable nation under law.

BUSH and his supporters (you) continue to break the law and support the breaking of the law.

TOS.

 

[brett636]

Again, another "circumstance" to justify the un justifiable.

No matter what YOU think is torture, the law is clear. President Reagan, your hero signed the law and made the agreement with the Geneva Convention.

Now you want to second guess your personal hero?

You use president Reagans image as your avatar, yet question his logic and decision making on something Reagan CHAMPIONED.

You can diminish torture all you want, it doesnt make it so.

You can feel anyway you want, it doesnt make it right.

President Reagan went out of his way to end torture and make the USA a respectable nation under law.

BUSH and his supporters (you) continue to break the law and support the breaking of the law.

TOS.

So its obvious you cannot make the distinction between who is covered under the Geneva conventions and who is not? Well then, allow me to educate you..

The Geneva convention on torture specifically covers nation state actors or better understood as people captured fighting on behalf of another nation state. Al Qaeda is hardly a nation state exempting its fighters and leadership from the Geneva convention. Not to mention the fact that no true torture techniques were ever practiced on these individuals anyway.

 

[The Other Side]

So its obvious you cannot make the distinction between who is covered under the Geneva conventions and who is not? Well then, allow me to educate you..

The Geneva convention on torture specifically covers nation state actors or better understood as people captured fighting on behalf of another nation state. Al Qaeda is hardly a nation state exempting its fighters and leadership from the Geneva convention. Not to mention the fact that no true torture techniques were ever practiced on these individuals anyway.

Ok, using YOUR logic then, you are claiming that the USA under president BUSH took prisoners who fought for NO COUNTRY, wore NO UNIFORM nor flew a FLAG for a nation.

In other words, the BUSH administration used rendition to capture innocent civilians and place them into CIA run detention camps and some were tortured while being questioned.

This according to you.

Regardless of who was captured, the GENEVA conventions applied to the UNITED STATES FIRST.

Your excuses are laughable at best. But, then again, its your hero that made the agreement with the Geneva Conventions and he was an idiot, so thanks for confirming it.

TOS.

 

[brett636]

Ok, using YOUR logic then, you are claiming that the USA under president BUSH took prisoners who fought for NO COUNTRY, wore NO UNIFORM nor flew a FLAG for a nation.

In other words, the BUSH administration used rendition to capture innocent civilians and place them into CIA run detention camps and some were tortured while being questioned.

This according to you.

Regardless of who was captured, the GENEVA conventions applied to the UNITED STATES FIRST.

Your excuses are laughable at best. But, then again, its your hero that made the agreement with the Geneva Conventions and he was an idiot, so thanks for confirming it.

TOS.

Seems much more civil than just using drones to kill them without ever finding out if our information was accurate or not.

 

[trickpony1]

Maybe I missed it but I don't remember TOS offering any viable options for obtaining information from our enemy.

Maybe all our troops could carry picnic baskets, complete with blankets, so to prepare a cozy, friendly "picnic" atmosphere to nurture the exchange of intel or;

maybe give the enemy free cell phones, free cars, free food stamps and nice "high rise" apartments to live in.

What do you think?

Bad wars, good warriors.

 

[trickpony1]

oops!....I forgot......

We should arm our troops with toy rifles that shoot ping pong balls.

That would surely show a "good faith" effort at peace and conciliation.

 

[mike1646]

People, learn from the Obama administration and don't break the law.
Just change them at will, make them up as you go or just don't enforce the ones you don't like.

 

[wayfair]

FAIL.


TOS.

you are sadly mistaken and DON'T HAVE A CLUE!

 

[Sportello]

 

[superballs63]

Of course you dont. Your an immature misinformed american, like the rest of the torture supporters.

TOS.

Hey, pal...if you're going to try to hurt my feelings, at least now how the friend to spell.

I'm immature and "misinformed" because I am perfectly fine with these animals being tortured? If that's your definition, then ok...I am immature and misinformed.

But this whole "resident racist" is a damn joke. Any white person who uses the N word is racist, huh? How then about your hero Jesse Jackson with his "hymietown" remark? Seems a bit racist/anti-Semitic, but let's give that hater a platform from which to speak on how to treat people?

My a**

 

[superballs63]

Maybe I missed it but I don't remember TOS offering any viable options for obtaining information from our enemy.

Maybe all our troops could carry picnic baskets, complete with blankets, so to prepare a cozy, friendly "picnic" atmosphere to nurture the exchange of intel or;

maybe give the enemy free cell phones, free cars, free food stamps and nice "high rise" apartments to live in.

What do you think?

Bad wars, good warriors.

I believe I asked what he would do, and in typical liberal fashion, he tried to deflect it and didn't answer.

Also, why in the hell does he arbitrarily CAPITALIZE and quote "certain" words throughout his posts? Is it to show how smart he thinks he is? Cause if so.....it's not working


Although, I agree with pos....don't "torture" them. Just behead those mother friend'ers and leave their corpses for the vultures to pick aparr

 

[bbsam]

Were the people captured and interrogated a member of the armed forces of a nation that signed the Geneva conventions, or beyond that were they a member of a recognized military faction?

No group which we call a terrorist organization has signed the Geneva conventions, much less are they a military faction of nations that have signed. On top of that they do not have any distinctive signs, insignias or uniforms that would designate them as a member of an armed forces group, which eliminates any protections under the Geneva conventions that would be provided towards a regulated armed force that professes allegiance towards a government or authority that may not be a signatory of the conventions.

30% were completely innocent.

 

[superballs63]

30% were completely innocent.

100% of the people who went to work on 9/11 were innocent. They are all dead.

Your innocent 30% missed out on sleep and got a feeding tube up their butts, but they're still breathing

 

[bbsam]

100% of the people who went to work on 9/11 were innocent. They are all dead.

Your innocent 30% missed out on sleep and got a feeding tube up their butts, but they're still breathing

Are you volunteering to undergo that which shall not be called torture?

 

[Sportello]

See the American on the left, pinning down a captured North Vietnamese sol? He was court-martialed for torture.

My, how times change.

 

[trickpony1]

But how many of his fellow soldiers lives did he save with the intel derived from this encounter?

Alot went on during the Vietnam war that no one knows about because people could keep their mouth shut.

Bad wars, good warriors.

 

[wayfair]

FAIL.

Dr. Brown, like everyone else commenting on the torture thread, you dont have the first clue what you are talking about.

ah, so my reading of my Grandfathers "debriefing" tells you I don't have the first clue of what I'm talking about????

dude, please go play in traffic