anonymous4
Well-Known Member
How about we create a false sense of doom to sell the idea? I'm sure it would work just as well as if the doom were a reality and not a theory.
what do part timers want in 2013
- Thread starter 804troublemaker
- Start date
brown_trousers
Well-Known Member
Lol, we already get free healthcare.
If they want to decrease one part of our contract, they need to increase another part. Thus balancing the scales through negotiation. Giving us something we already have doesnt balance anything!
UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)
Well-Known Member
How many other corporations have begun to pass along all or a portion of the health care premiums to their employees?
brown_trousers
Well-Known Member
I think the saying goes, "if you break it, you buy it" UPS breaks our backs, shoulders, knees, and many other joints over the course of a 30 year career. So them paying for our health insurance is their way of "buying it"
moreluck
golden ticket member
"Only 12% of covered employees pay nothing for family medical care benefits (excluding dental care, vision care and prescription drugs), compared with 23% who pay nothing for individual coverage. Employees who share in the cost of dependent coverage pay $377 per month on average, according to the federal Bureau of Labor Statistics. Employers picked up the remaining $409 monthly tab for dependent coverage in BLS's March 2010 National Compensation Survey. This 48% cost-share exceeds the 29% share paid by employees for individual coverage."
anonymous4
Well-Known Member
The day UPS stops paying for all of my heath insurance is the day I walk out the door and never look back. 5 years in my body is starting to feel it in my knees and shoulders. It will only get worse from here. I use the methods but methods don't stop the rapid deterioration of body parts being worked so harshly day in and day out.
I know the response by a select few of you, so save it. UPS not paying for health insurance to take care of the bodies they quite literally break over the course of decades would be a bigger tragedy than anything else they could take.
I know the response by a select few of you, so save it. UPS not paying for health insurance to take care of the bodies they quite literally break over the course of decades would be a bigger tragedy than anything else they could take.
brown_trousers
Well-Known Member
EVERYONE pays for medical insurance. Even as a part-timer making $13.30/hr, I understand that my "real" payrate is probably more like $20/hr, and I am spending $5/hr of my hard-earned money to buy medical insurance. So it is in no way free.
Themostartfulofdodgers
New Member
This was an incredibly sad thread for me to read. This is also the dumbest post a union man could possibly write.
It really shows that income disparity in this country isn't just about the 1% and the 99%. It's also about a divide between the young and the old. What UPSguy, Bug, and others show, is that there really is very little solidarity between Americans of different economic and age groups, even within the union itself.
Just because there are other worse jobs out there doesn't mean the current compensation structure between pts and fts is just. You're essentially saying, you're lucky you get what you get. Be grateful and be silent. You sound more like a CEO wiping the crumbs from his table than a union brother. And if that's not what you're saying, why do you even bring up the green grass of other pt jobs?
Oh yeah? I bet I could walk to my local seven eleven and find a hardworking, diligent latin american or eastern european fellow to take your cushy driving position for 8 bucks an hour to start. I could probably train him to be as fast as you, follow Federal regulations and all the rest.
Oh, but wait, we have a UNION THAT PROTECTS YOU FROM THAT! That's the point of having a union, so that the value of labor isn't subject to the laws of supply and demand that other markets are. We aren't simply commodities, we're human beings with families that we love and want to provide for! Jesus!
Basically you're saying that drivers and full-time workers deserve to be protected from economics/market forces more than part-timers. There are more of us and we're less skilled, so we are more expendable.
You're just as expendable as part-timers. The Union just gives a **** more about you. Dont be a selfish prick. Stand with part timers. Otherwise, the Chris Christies and Scott Walkers are going to finish you off, you little piece of what's left of the middle class. When they come for you, you'll wish you had stood with us.
Secondly, this guy:
That's not the issue here. The real issue is that pts are not getting a proportionate slice of the pie. Whether "a more just slice" is enough to sustain us or just supplement other jobs is irrelevant.
Again, the generational divide. So hypocritical, selfish, stupid, etc.upsguy72 said:
That youngster who feels entitled to a full-time position or driving position, he's waited substantially longer than you had to for the same opportunity. But you're saying he's not willing to work for it? He's probably worked more for it than you ever had to (fans in the trucks notwithstanding). And his pay is probably about the same as what you earned when you started, even though costs have inflated in the last 20-30 years. So he's effectively making less cash too.
Where do you get the balls to this generation of UPSers on hard work?
washington57
Well-Known Member
It is strange to me that some of you seem think that PTs will have to pay or even lose their health insurance in the next contract.
UPS is making money, buying foreign companies and volume is up. There is no way that we will have to pay for our insurance. No give backs to a company that is as successful as UPS from the people who made it all its money.
Our contract demands meeting had at least 300 people show up, many of them PT.
I'm not worried about the new contract, at least up here in the NW.
UPS is making money, buying foreign companies and volume is up. There is no way that we will have to pay for our insurance. No give backs to a company that is as successful as UPS from the people who made it all its money.
Our contract demands meeting had at least 300 people show up, many of them PT.
I'm not worried about the new contract, at least up here in the NW.
UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)
Well-Known Member
Current employees have nothing to worry about. New PT and FT hires as of the ratification date of the contract may have some concerns.
brown_trousers
Well-Known Member
Nice! As a fellow NWer, I'm glad to hear you had some part-timers voice their opinions. I think its about time the part-timers got a little catch-up on wages. Maybe not so much for the new-hires, but I do believe we should be giving larger raises to our seasoned part-timers to encourage them to stay and/or make it an easier transition while waiting 10+ years for a full-time spot to open up. There's nothing I dread more than to find out I have a new-hire preloading my truck!
If us full-time drivers are making $31/hr after only a 3 year progression, I think it would be reasonable for a Part-timer to make $21/hr after 6 yrs. Just a ball-park figure I guess, but I think we need to take care of those part-timers that break their backs for us year after year.
upsman2940
Well-Known Member
Part timers don't need full-time wages they need opportunities for full-time employment!
blackelvis
Member
No disrespect to fulltimers but I think alot you guys tend forget how rough is it part time. Guys who say foolish statements like this irked me. I never understood the logic that just because someone works 4 plus hr more than someone else that makes than more valuable to the company than someone who don't. Truth be told I bet if alot of those full time drivers were told to work 4 hr in the building loading or unloading more than 85% couldn't do it. In a sense I believe UPS enjoy pitting Pt vs Ft. It saves them money and headache, but in the end 'SENIORITY SHOULD PREVAIL AT ALL (NOT SOME) TIMES
brown_trousers
Well-Known Member
True, but its unrealistic to think UPS can offer them all FT positions. Theres just too many PTers vs FTers. Even if they did provide a bunch more FT jobs (which they should), they'd only be reducing a 10 year wait to maybe a 7 year wait.
PiedmontSteward
RTW-4-Less
Exactly. Nation-wide, UPS is refusing to fill the 22.3 positions that are being vacated because of resignation/retirement/early death/transfer. They owe us these jobs and refuse to fill them - we should require the company fill/create the jobs they owe us as a pre-condition to finalizing any contract.
brown_trousers
Well-Known Member
I don't think they are required to give us those specific 22.3 jobs, our rep is telling us that the contract only stated they had to create "more" full-time positions, and that it was up to UPS's discretion what kind of full-time jobs they are. Up here they seem to be dissolving the 22.3 jobs, but creating more 22.2 positions. So we are gaining more full-time jobs, just maybe not the specific ones you want.
Island
Well-Known Member
I'm PT, I have a lot of very close FT friends who I am more than happy to work beside (even knowing they make 4x more than me to do the same work). Just because one of my friends literally owns three cars and two houses and I have a 2-bedroom apartment with two roommates does not mean that we hate each other. I'm going to completely ignore all the arguing between FT and PT folks here and get back to the point.
What I want in the new contract is more equality all-around. In my sort, there is no union presence. None. I would very much like to have a preferred position, I would very much like to get my 3.5 daily, and I would very much like to not be sent out of the building before 40-50 other part-timers who have less seniority than me but get an hour a day more than I do. I would also very much like to keep my pay and benefits. Given the utter lack of comparable jobs anywhere, I'm pretty much stuck at UPS for the foreseeable future and in the past I have worked three other occupations to just scrape by. I came here for the benefits, literally on the doorstep of the recession, and now I find I'm stuck here and my local has the nerve to say that the union is going to be giving more perks to the people who pay the most in dues (FT drivers and feeders), and pay for those perks by bargaining away the few false promises they make to the part-timers like myself.
What I want is solidarity. No givebacks. Stronger language to prevent production harassment, more full-time jobs. My building has actually been reducing full-time positions. I know some people who were hired about five years before me and got into full-time jobs immediately after hire. When I was applying, HR told me I could be a part-time driver in three years. That's what I wanted. Then I found out that if I made part-time driver, I'd be making a lot less than I make now for a couple years. I'm not sure I could survive that, especially when the shift would require a more varied schedule, which would eat up a lot of my daily time. Harder to work other jobs when UPS changes its times. So I'm waiting, hoping to get into a dreaded split shift situation, which is not what I came here to do originally. But the lowest seniority split shifter has around 12-years FT seniority and that means that even if a few positions are added, there are about 300 other people in my building ahead of me in line because they've been waiting for 12 years for that job.
I'd like to not scrape by anymore, and if the company takes any of my benefits or raise pennies away, I'll be leaving the union the same day and the company two weeks later.
Aside: there's a petition on change . org that Make UPS Deliver has been spreading around. It's addressed to the IBT, and describes a platform for the new contract that asks for no givebacks, solid language and more equal treatment of employees. I'd say that also infers that seniority be simplified and not... as stupidly complicated as it is for some people who have had different classifications.
What I want in the new contract is more equality all-around. In my sort, there is no union presence. None. I would very much like to have a preferred position, I would very much like to get my 3.5 daily, and I would very much like to not be sent out of the building before 40-50 other part-timers who have less seniority than me but get an hour a day more than I do. I would also very much like to keep my pay and benefits. Given the utter lack of comparable jobs anywhere, I'm pretty much stuck at UPS for the foreseeable future and in the past I have worked three other occupations to just scrape by. I came here for the benefits, literally on the doorstep of the recession, and now I find I'm stuck here and my local has the nerve to say that the union is going to be giving more perks to the people who pay the most in dues (FT drivers and feeders), and pay for those perks by bargaining away the few false promises they make to the part-timers like myself.
What I want is solidarity. No givebacks. Stronger language to prevent production harassment, more full-time jobs. My building has actually been reducing full-time positions. I know some people who were hired about five years before me and got into full-time jobs immediately after hire. When I was applying, HR told me I could be a part-time driver in three years. That's what I wanted. Then I found out that if I made part-time driver, I'd be making a lot less than I make now for a couple years. I'm not sure I could survive that, especially when the shift would require a more varied schedule, which would eat up a lot of my daily time. Harder to work other jobs when UPS changes its times. So I'm waiting, hoping to get into a dreaded split shift situation, which is not what I came here to do originally. But the lowest seniority split shifter has around 12-years FT seniority and that means that even if a few positions are added, there are about 300 other people in my building ahead of me in line because they've been waiting for 12 years for that job.
I'd like to not scrape by anymore, and if the company takes any of my benefits or raise pennies away, I'll be leaving the union the same day and the company two weeks later.
Aside: there's a petition on change . org that Make UPS Deliver has been spreading around. It's addressed to the IBT, and describes a platform for the new contract that asks for no givebacks, solid language and more equal treatment of employees. I'd say that also infers that seniority be simplified and not... as stupidly complicated as it is for some people who have had different classifications.
brown_trousers
Well-Known Member
Sorry, but even the best contract possible wont help you if you don't have a union rep willing to enforce it. Most of the things you mentioned are already covered under our current contract.
I guarantee you that part-timers pay way more to the union than us full-timers do. even though they each pay less per month than we do, there are just WAY more of them. Plus the fact that part-timers are the ones paying initiation fees which are a huge part of our unions budget.
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