When working in hot weather what do you think is adequate supply of water to have with you for your entire shift?

[Integrity]

Yes they do. Accidents and injuries need to be reported to OSHA. They track accidents and injuries. There is no doubt that mail and package delivery jobs have heat related illnesses/injuries. And OSHA tracks these.

It does not mean that they have jurisdiction to enforce their regulations, other than tracking accidents and injuries, on these jobs. They do have jurisdiction to track accidents and injuries. There is no question about that.

Although, most mail and small delivery companies, including most of Amazon, fall under the jurisdiction of OSHA. I never denied that.

I said that OSHA does not have jurisdiction over any Commercial Motor Vehicle driver, which is the majority of UPS drivers. And now some of the Amazon drivers, that have the new box trucks like ours. Also FedEx ground drivers that drive the same box trucks that we do. Anything over 10,000 lbs GVWR.



OSH Act of 1970

SEC. 4. Applicability of This Act

(b)

(1) Nothing in this Act shall apply to working conditions of employees with respect to which other Federal agencies, and State agencies acting under section 274 of the Atomic Energy Act of 1954, as amended (42 U.S.C. 2021), exercise statutory authority to prescribe or enforce standards or regulations affecting occupational safety or health.



And, if you don't know what the actual wording of the Act means, OSHA has explained it for certain people who refuse to believe what it says. I will post it for the third time. OSHA's determination of Section 4(b)1 of the OSH act. I know you refuse to believe it, so be it.


OSHA is preempted by Section 4(b)1 of the OSH Act from enforcing its regulations if a working condition is regulated by another Federal agency.

For example:

• While traveling on public highways, the Department of Transportation (DOT) has jurisdiction. However, while loading and unloading trucks, OSHA regulations govern the safety and health of the workers and the responsibilities of employers to ensure their safety at the warehouse, at the dock, at the rig, at the construction site, at the airport terminal and in all places truckers go to deliver and pick up loads.

Now, try to keep up. Commercial Motor Vehicle drivers are regulated by another Federal Agency, the Department of Transportation (DOT). Specifically, the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration (FMCSA). OSHA themselves say that they are preempted from enforcing its regulations on employees covered by the DOT.

Are you still with me? This is black and white. There is no ambiguity here. There are no personal opinions about what this says.

What part of this confuses you? Are you starting too many threads on the same subject and are getting confused? Do you just not want to believe that you are wrong?

Please see the portion of your quote that I highlighted with red.

 

[BrownStains]

I usually throw 6-7 16 oz water bottles and 2 small gatorades when I get up a few hours before work. Before I leave they will be partially frozen. Put the drinks in a small cooler and fill ice from the fridge in cooler . Will stay icy cold all day long . Drinking warm water in heat is awful. I’ve done it if I was desperate but you really need that ice cold water to cool your body down.

 

[Integrity]

Here is what @Integrity said.

“The company is really responsible to see that each driver has an adequate supply with them.”

I said that was bullcrap. It is not the Company’s responsibility, nor the Government’s responsibility to make sure that each driver has an adequate supply of water with them.

I disagree with your opinion and interpretation of the OSHA requirements in discussion.

 

[Integrity]

I enforce the contract, right or wrong.

I enforce the laws, right or wrong.

I use every means at my disposal to get warning letters removed or return discharged employees.

Good work.

Pick your damn battles. I will not try and force UPS to supply package car drivers with water when it is not in the contract or not a law. I have bigger fish to fry. If UPS wants to supply water, or Gatorade to drivers, good for them.

Ok.

Have some damn personal responsibility as a grownass adult.

This isn’t personal?

Fill your water jugs with free UPS water before you leave. You say it is life sustaining water. So you want UPS to sustain your life? It is not UPS's responsibility to make sure you take enough water with you, to make sure you drink enough water, to keep you alive and well.

But it is.

That is your responsibility, unless you're still a child and need someone to take care of your needs, because you are not mature enough to do it yourself. UPS supplies you with free water. Take plenty with you.

Not personal, UPS is responsible.

Or do you want UPS to put refrigerators in every package car and stock them with water?

Refrigerators are not a requirement.

Or do you want UPS to drive around and give each driver cool water every 30 minutes?

Not necessary if an adequate supply is provided in the morning.

If you bitch enough, UPS will probably supply you with the water jugs.

Not necessarily. Bitching alone at UPS doesn’t appear to be all that effective.

How much do you make? $100K/yr? Buy your own damn water jugs and fill them with free water before you leave. It is unbelievable what some people pick for their battles and try and force the Company to do. Then, when we actually need something from the Company, we don't get it because they gave us water.

Doesn’t change UPS’s responsibility.

Grow up and take some personal responsibility to keep yourself healthy and alive out there.

Not personal?

 

[Integrity]

I usually throw 6-7 16 oz water bottles and 2 small gatorades when I get up a few hours before work. Before I leave they will be partially frozen. Put the drinks in a small cooler and fill ice from the fridge in cooler . Will stay icy cold all day long . Drinking warm water in heat is awful. I’ve done it if I was desperate but you really need that ice cold water to cool your body down.

Based upon OSHA requirements you are paying for water that UPS should be paying for.

 

[2Down2Many2Go]

Good work.

Ok.

This isn’t personal?

But it is.

Not personal, UPS is responsible.

Refrigerators are not a requirement.

Not necessary if an adequate supply is provided in the morning.

Not necessarily. Bitching alone at UPS doesn’t appear to be all that effective.

Doesn’t change UPS’s responsibility.

Not personal?

Doesn't sound personal at all.

 

[Integrity]

Doesn't sound personal at all.

Ok.

We see some of the comments a bit differently then.

All good.

 

[dudebro]

OSHA guidelines are not immutable law in this case. There's no bright line between safe and "unsafe". It establishes that it's reasonable to drink up to 3 gallons a day. At all times I would take personal responsibility for my hydration first and foremost. Where convenient I'll take free water from the company and if someone were to try to stop me from hydration, I'd refer to the guideline and tell them to kick rocks.
But I'd stop short of a campaign where I'm measuring available water and building spreadsheets.

 

[AccidentProne]

Telling UPS I need two gallons of water just means that I will have two gallons of warm water sitting in the back.

Why not buy two $70 128 oz thermal water bottles to keep your water cool?

 

[qdg2]

Why not buy two $70 128 oz thermal water bottles to keep your water cool?

Why not UPS buy them? You are in their service.....

 

[qdg2]

If someone dies out on the road because they did not drink enough water, that’s a tragedy because it is their responsibility to stay hydrated and stay alive, not the Company’s.

No? Better believe it

Yet,

It's far more complicated than he just didn't drink enough water....

Say, do you work or have ever worked at UPS? If so, we'll explore what it's like to work there.....and apply that to our conversation......hoping to leave out the personal insults(like grow up and such).

Example: Why is there so much resistance(you) to providing onboard water? Why would someone be pressured to run all day without drinking? Or admonished for getting a drink when needed?

And I flatly disagree it's not the Company's responsibility to keep ANYONE alive while at UPS in ANY capacity.

 

[Lineandinitial]

Yet,

It's far more complicated than he just didn't drink enough water....

Say, do you work or have ever worked at UPS? If so, we'll explore what it's like to work there.....and apply that to our conversation......hoping to leave out the personal insults(like grow up and such).

Example: Why is there so much resistance(you) to providing onboard water? Why would someone be pressured to run all day without drinking? Or admonished for getting a drink when needed?

And I flatly disagree it's not the Company's responsibility to keep ANYONE alive while at UPS in ANY capacity.

Spin much?
None of this happens....Drop the helpless victim schtick and grow up and such.

 

[tramtwo]

You know it's been a tough day when you're turning the ice chest up and drinking the last of the melted ice to finish the shift.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

You know it's been a tough day when you're turning the ice chest up and drinking the last of the melted ice to finish the shift.

Hopefully you rinsed it out from when you used it to go fishing.

 

[Trucker Clock]

It's far more complicated than he just didn't drink enough water....

No it's not.

Say, do you work or have ever worked at UPS?

Yes.

hoping to leave out the personal insults(like grow up and such).

If the shoe fits...

Why is there so much resistance(you) to providing onboard water?

They don't have to. Why do you keep pushing for it. Keep yourself alive, do not rely on anyone else. Children rely on others to take care of them.

Why would someone be pressured to run all day without drinking?

They're not.

Or admonished for getting a drink when needed?

They're not.

And I flatly disagree it's not the Company's responsibility to keep ANYONE alive while at UPS in ANY capacity.

And you're wrong again, as usual.

 

[AccidentProne]

Why not UPS buy them? You are in their service.....

Why doesn't UPS buy me a house or car? I'm in their service.....

 

[qdg2]

Spin much?
None of this happens....Drop the helpless victim schtick and grow up and such.

Obtuse much?

How long did you drive pkg? What conditions?

Thanks.

 

[qdg2]

No it's not.



Yes.



If the shoe fits...



They don't have to. Why do you keep pushing for it. Keep yourself alive, do not rely on anyone else. Children rely on others to take care of them.



They're not.



They're not.



And you're wrong again, as usual.

You mentioned "having bigger fish to fry".....than saving lives? Ok. Tell us more. Just how important are you.....saving worlds.

People are dying of heat exhaustion whatever. Fact.

Say, when folks on here say "do whatever it takes to qualify"....what does that mean? That mentality?

And you don't think that translates into dangerous conditions?

 

[qdg2]

Why doesn't UPS buy me a house or car? I'm in their service.....

Gosh....good question.

Let's explore: Do you use this car "in their service"....you know on the clock? PVD's could make a case....

Or your house?(on the clock).....

I believe in my universe......the answer is NO.

Sleepers gets a per diem....as we are always in their service while on the clock. For example. See?

Notice I didn't tell you to grow up...

 

[Trucker Clock]

You mentioned "having bigger fish to fry".....than saving lives? Ok. Tell us more. Just how important are you.....saving worlds.

Not saving worlds. I would rather UPS reduce hours, have better ventilation in package cars, make it perfectly clear that production takes a second to safety in extreme heat, etc. as opposed to just having UPS supply water.

Bigger fish to fry.

People are dying of heat exhaustion whatever. Fact.

What? 2 people. Yes, it's a tragedy. 2 is too many. But 2 people out of 250,000 doesn't translate into a UPS problem. That translated into either some other factor was at play or these 2 employees did not drink enough water.

And I guess I have to tell you again. It is not UPS's responsibility to force you to drink water. They have all their pamphlets about staying hydrated. It is your responsibility to stay hydrated.


You can lead a horse to water........

Say, when folks on here say "do whatever it takes to qualify"....what does that mean? That mentality?

Do whatever it takes. Working hard and fast does not kill you. Not staying hydrated kills you. You can work hard and long and be perfectly fine if you stay hydrated.

And you don't think that translates into dangerous conditions?

Working in heat has its dangers. We've been doing it for over a century. So has other industries.

Or, do you want UPS to shut down when it gets over 90?

Take some personal responsibility for your own life and stay hydrated. Do not expect your employer to make sure you stay hydrated. The alternative is that you may die. Is that what you want?