Why?

[sawdusttv]

There are a lot of rumors circulating as to the pros and cons of this agreement. There are some very good things about this contract and there are other items that bother me a lot. I do believe that UPS's offer to take over the pension is a good thing. While this may not be the ideal path we want to take, it is something positive. We can not continue as we have been and expect the Central States pension do go on forever.
I am not telling anyone how to vote, but I am trying to inform them as to what I believe the facts are. Your length of time at UPS is a big factor as to how good this contract is. The important thing is that you must vote. Every vote is important. Do not let a minority of the people decide for the majority. Get informed! Ask questions! Mail your ballot in as soon as possible! Talk to other employees! Encourage them to vote! Whether this contract or not. It is important to get everyone involved.

Shadow,
While I agree that the concept of UPS taking over the CS pension is a great thing. The offer that is on the table is sub-par at best. They are offering less than we had 11 years ago. 3000 at 30 any age is the same but 11 years ago insurance was 50 dollars a person, now they want us to pay 200 dollars a person, that is not getting into the higher taxes, servivor benifits, etc...
Furthermore, how soon we forget. A couple of years ago UPS executives stood up in front of congress and publicly said that with what they pay into our retirement that we should be getting $7000 a month, then they want to come up with a lame off like this, that is less that what we had 11 years ago.
Folks, you need to study this offer more. They are throwing smoke and mirrors!!!!!!

 

[tieguy]

My local has my number so I assume the IBT does too. If they made a call like that to me I would be livid.

I don't pay them to waste money like that.

You're too full of yourself. Nothing wrong with the teamsters encouraging participation in the process.

I can see you now delivering cardboard well in your sixties telling us all how you really showed em.

 

[tieguy]

Shadow,
While I agree that the concept of UPS taking over the CS pension is a great thing. The offer that is on the table is sub-par at best. They are offering less than we had 11 years ago. 3000 at 30 any age is the same but 11 years ago insurance was 50 dollars a person, now they want us to pay 200 dollars a person, that is not getting into the higher taxes, servivor benifits, etc...

In fairness to ups I think you have to be a little more gracious then this. UPS did tell everyone the pensions were in trouble in 97. UPS did tell everyone that it would be much cheaper and easier to fix in 97 and that the cost would get to be significantly more if we waited. All of this has come to transpire. UPSers are not immune to the exhorbantly rising cost of health care just because we wear brown.

 

[sawdusttv]

In fairness to ups I think you have to be a little more gracious then this. UPS did tell everyone the pensions were in trouble in 97. UPS did tell everyone that it would be much cheaper and easier to fix in 97 and that the cost would get to be significantly more if we waited. All of this has come to transpire. UPSers are not immune to the exhorbantly rising cost of health care just because we wear brown.

Tie,
You are correct, but UPS did not put enough pressure on the teamsters to bring it to a vote. The teamsters would not allow the employees to vote on it so in no way can you blame the houry employees. The falt still falls on the company and the union.

 

[Shadow999]

The amount charged for insurance for retirees is definatly a deal breaker. I am in local 238. We are in Iowa. Our retirees are paying $50 a month for themselves and their spouses. It will raise to $114.36 a month after the first of the year. Members of local 710 are also paying $50 a month at this time, and they are under the Central State insurance. I hear from other parts of the country they that they are paying much more. No one I have talked to can explain these differences. When I contacted UPS they told me that those under the UPS insurance "may" have increases after ratification. I was then informed that that any more questions I have would have to be answered by Central States. I am still waiting for a number from them.
There are a lot of things in this contract offer that I do not like which are in our supplement, but at least they are properly explained so I can make a decision as to which way I choose to vote. By not knowing in advance what the insurance rates are going to be, there is no way I can vote in favor of ratification of this contract.

 

[Captain America]

I got a letter from the District Manager urging a yes vote. The hard sell on this by union and company confirms my NO vote

 

[ups79]

The amount charged for insurance for retirees is definatly a deal breaker. I am in local 238. We are in Iowa. Our retirees are paying $50 a month for themselves and their spouses. It will raise to $114.36 a month after the first of the year. Members of local 710 are also paying $50 a month at this time, and they are under the Central State insurance. I hear from other parts of the country they that they are paying much more. No one I have talked to can explain these differences. When I contacted UPS they told me that those under the UPS insurance "may" have increases after ratification. I was then informed that that any more questions I have would have to be answered by Central States. I am still waiting for a number from them.
There are a lot of things in this contract offer that I do not like which are in our supplement, but at least they are properly explained so I can make a decision as to which way I choose to vote. By not knowing in advance what the insurance rates are going to be, there is no way I can vote in favor of ratification of this contract.

I'am retired out of 710 and believe me we are not under central states.

 

[tieguy]

I got a letter from the District Manager urging a yes vote. The hard sell on this by union and company confirms my NO vote

Good thing he didn't send you a letter asking you to keep your head out of the furnace or we might have lost you. ...

 

[doolittle95]

Good thing he didn't send you a letter asking you to keep your head out of the furnace or we might have lost you. ...

that was funny.

I have to agree with captain america though, no way on this proposal. However, i'll read those future directives from the DM a bit more carefully before i literally "jump" to any conclusions next time.

 

[dammor]

You're too full of yourself. Nothing wrong with the teamsters encouraging participation in the process.

I can see you now delivering cardboard well in your sixties telling us all how you really showed em.

This is painful for me, but I have to agree with tieguy. Why are ya'll so concerned that the Union and UPS are in agreement for a change? Could it be because they have been at this for a year and actually realize this is the best for both sides? Could it be because of the fiasco in 97? And yes I said fiasco. In my humble opinion the Union may have won the battle but in doing so we lost the war. I have been a Teamster for a long time. For that same amount of time my paychecks have come from UPS. It's true this contract is not perfect. I've yet to see one that is for that matter. If you are waiting for one that pays you $7,000 a month when you retire then you are smoking too much crack.

 

[govols019]

You're too full of yourself. Nothing wrong with the teamsters encouraging participation in the process.

I can see you now delivering cardboard well in your sixties telling us all how you really showed em.

They are not encouraging participation. They are encouraging a Yes vote. There is a difference.

Lord willing and the creek don't rise, I'm gone at 55 regardless of how the pension turns out. My retirement planning doesn't include the pension or Social Security. Whatever I get from them will be bonus money.

 

[browned out]

They are not encouraging participation. They are encouraging a Yes vote. There is a difference.

Lord willing and the creek don't rise, I'm gone at 55 regardless of how the pension turns out. My retirement planning doesn't include the pension or Social Security. Whatever I get from them will be bonus money.

Correct

I received a letter from our district manager encouraging yes vote
and a threat that the central states takeover(resulting in better pensions) would have a very high possibility of not being able to take place unless we ratify by the end of this year.

Threats and encouraging a yes vote.

Most of us can think for ourselves but this will sway some uninformed voters and should be illegal.

 

[Dump and Run]

Has anyone else had these pre-recorded messages from the Union?

Yes. I have had two. My vote is in the mail. Whatever your opinion is just vote! If you don't vote then don't complain if the outcome doesn't go your way.

 

[Shadow999]

There has been no attempt here of anyone trying to sway my vote one way or another, (unless you count what I have been reading on the internet). I have spent this week calling around and searching the internet to find some answers as to how I will cast my ballot. I now believe that this contract gives us a chance at actually earning a pension.
With the new pension laws we can not take the chance of our benifits being reduced. Even though this is a far from "perfect" contract I will vote yes.

 

[Captain America]

Good thing he didn't send you a letter asking you to keep your head out of the furnace or we might have lost you. ...

Implying that I do the opposite of everything management or union tell me? Thats just weak.

 

[tieguy]

Implying that I do the opposite of everything management or union tell me? Thats just weak.

That was your point in the post I responded to. I'm not sure why you're so insecure with the union and company selling a contract they negotiated. Listen to all parties explain why they think its a good or bad contract offer and then read the material and make up your own mind. Too many caffiene junkies here screaming the sky is falling everytime they see a cloud float by.

 

[longlunchguy]

This is painful for me, but I have to agree with tieguy. Why are ya'll so concerned that the Union and UPS are in agreement for a change? Could it be because they have been at this for a year and actually realize this is the best for both sides? Could it be because of the fiasco in 97? And yes I said fiasco. In my humble opinion the Union may have won the battle but in doing so we lost the war. I have been a Teamster for a long time. For that same amount of time my paychecks have come from UPS. It's true this contract is not perfect. I've yet to see one that is for that matter. If you are waiting for one that pays you $7,000 a month when you retire then you are smoking too much crack.

Hoorah dammor! Finally, a voice of reason.

 

[tieguy]

Correct

I received a letter from our district manager encouraging yes vote
and a threat that the central states takeover(resulting in better pensions) would have a very high possibility of not being able to take place unless we ratify by the end of this year.

Threats and encouraging a yes vote.

Most of us can think for ourselves but this will sway some uninformed voters and should be illegal.

If it is true that the pension law changes in january 2008 would change this offer would you expect the district manager tell you that or would you expect him to keep this information to himself? You want him to keep this a secret? I just don't understand some of you people. You get pissed when someone who is informed trys to tell you anything different then what the main tdu page has posted on it. If you really have your own mind then open the thing up and consider all sources for information.

 

[BigBrownSanta]

If it is true that the pension law changes in january 2008 would change this offer would you expect the district manager tell you that or would you expect him to keep this information to himself? You want him to keep this a secret? I just don't understand some of you people. You get pissed when someone who is informed trys to tell you anything different then what the main tdu page has posted on it. If you really have your own mind then open the thing up and consider all sources for information.

What exactly is going to happen on Jan 1 2008 if this proposal gets voted down?

What does this new law say that makes this ratification process so important that it has to be done before Jan 1 2008?

 

[Braveheart]

What do you mean by people like me? I'm PT at UPS for 7 months.. I am trying to make the right decision. I plan to vote and I am here for the long term not just bennies. I have been reading up as much as I can but it seems that the union is taking great strides to sway me to vote yes..I take that as a negative and think that they are just trying to get this contract through because it benefits UPS and the union and not we the workers pt and ft. I have to also make a decision as to what the future holds for me in this job and is it going to be harder to become ft. It looks like if a contract goes through like the tenative one we have before us now it will be harder to get ft positions..

Hush Hush contract talks, followed by Rush Rush vote!

Usually if it smells like crap then it is crap!!!