705 and 710 forced to accept contract.

[Bubblehead]

If you yell loud enough.........

And it was much larger than a small minority.



Pension money?



Possibly....Although that is what the loudest yelled about.



Then why do we have 9.5 in the contract if only a small minority want it?

Apparently, your building is not representative of the whole.

Listen to what you are saying, percentages aside....

If we already had effective 9.5 protection, why would a new classification (22.4 hybrid drivers) be needed?
It absolutely works here (the 9.5 opt-in list) btw....and my Local is extremely weak.

Whether newer RPCD's want to work weekends or not (and since when did the IBT care what the lower seniority employee wants), they will eventually matriculate to their preferred schedule....by seniority, as it should be.

So again, why create a new classification???

Are you really advocating for this new concessionary classification?

 

[Mugarolla]

Listen to what you are saying, percentages aside....

If we already had effective 9.5 protection, why would a new classification (22.4 hybrid drivers) be needed?
It absolutely works here (the 9.5 opt-in list) btw....and my Local is extremely weak.

Whether newer RPCD's want to work weekends or not (and since when did the IBT care what the lower seniority employee wants), they will eventually matriculate to their preferred schedule....by seniority, as it should be.

So again, why create a new classification???

Are you really advocating for this new concessionary classification?

Well, we don't seem to have sufficient 9.5 protection, do we?

One of the biggest complaints to the Union to address this contract was excessive OT.

And I am not, read my posts, advocating this new 22.4 position. I could have accepted it if it was done differently, but am not a fan of how it is now. Basically a FT driver making less and no 9.5 protection.

I already stated that I wouldn't oppose the new classification if they had 9.5 protection, if they could work up to full driver rate and if they were used as they should be: half their hours inside and half driving to help eliminate this "excessive" OT that drivers are complaining about.

 

[Bubblehead]

Well, we don't seem to have sufficient 9.5 protection, do we?

One of the biggest complaints to the Union to address this contract was excessive OT.

And I am not, read my posts, advocating this new 22.4 position. I could have accepted it if it was done differently, but am not a fan of how it is now. Basically a FT driver making less and no 9.5 protection.

I already stated that I wouldn't oppose the new classification if they had 9.5 protection, if they could work up to full driver rate and if they were used as they should be: half their hours inside and half driving to help eliminate this "excessive" OT that drivers are complaining about.

I keep forgetting about that noisy minority, that are complaining about "excessive OT"....

 

[Mugarolla]

I keep forgetting about that noisy minority, that are complaining about "excessive OT"....

Of the requests turned into the Union, this issue was a majority of the requests.

Kind of like the minority of actual members (54K out of 250K) that voted the contract down but people want their voice to count?

And yes, I know, it was a majority of actual voters, but still a minority of the membership, similar to your noisy "excessive OT" being a minority of the membership but people don't want their voice to count.

Can't win, can we?

 

[BuckyBadger]

aaaaaannnddd...we're voting when?

WHY IS THERE A DELAY? We have a proposed contract...let's vote on it. This is ridiculous.

 

[Bubblehead]

Of the requests turned into the Union, this issue was a majority of the requests.

Kind of like the minority of actual members (54K out of 250K) that voted the contract down but people want their voice to count?

And yes, I know, it was a majority of actual voters, but still a minority of the membership, similar to your noisy "excessive OT" being a minority of the membership but people don't want their voice to count.

Can't win, can we?

We could win if someone would tell the truth???
Instead, all we seem to get is "slight of hand", half truths, and hard sells.

Do you really believe that supposed "leading proposal" was truly the motivating factor for creating a new full time classification???

I don't, not for a second.

 

[Mugarolla]

We could win if someone would tell the truth???
Instead, all we seem to get is "slight of hand", half truths, and hard sells.

Do you really believe that supposed "leading proposal" was truly the motivating factor for creating a new full time classification???

I don't, not for a second.

I do feel that they heard the drivers about the OT and being forced to work on Saturday.

But, the "main" motivating factor, no.

 

[Bubblehead]

I do feel that they heard the drivers about the OT and being forced to work on Saturday.

But, the "main" motivating factor, no.

So the answer was to create a new classification that sells out the unborn???

While most present day "RPCD's" were hired knowing that they would be Tues-Saturday, they also knew that as additional drivers were hired behind them, they would matriculate to their preferred schedule.
That's a long revered Union premise called "seniority" and a fundamental building block of collective bargaining, that was conveniently bargained around amid a smokescreen of "proposals" to mask a concession.

With this in mind, where was the consideration for the seniority preloader who was forced from a Mon-Fri schedule, to a Tues-Sat schedule as a result of Saturday ground deliveries???

As far as OT is concerned, I will say it again, we already had Article 37 language to protect us from excessive OT.

....and if it wasn't sufficient, then fix it.

In the end, I continue to call to the notion that the IBT was reacting to member proposals when creating this new, concessionary, 22.4 hybrid driver classification.

 

[Benben]

Your idea of excessive OT is different than someone else's idea.

So what is excessive?

The Union took the ambiguity out of the word excessive.

Now, nobody should complain about OT.

Oh, wait, now their complaining about no OT.

The last contract defined excessive as over 9.5! Hense.......THE 9.5 LIST. But the last contract allowed the company to still work us 12 or 13 hours any 2 days they choose. And our families never got to count on us to be there for them!

THAT IS WHAT EVERYONE WAS COMPLAINING ABOUT AND WANTING CHANGED!

 

[Mugarolla]

The last contract defined excessive as over 9.5! Hense.......THE 9.5 LIST. But the last contract allowed the company to still work us 12 or 13 hours any 2 days they choose. And our families never got to count on us to be there for them!

THAT IS WHAT EVERYONE WAS COMPLAINING ABOUT AND WANTING CHANGED!

Looks like they got it, didn't they?

No more excessive OT.

 

[Mugarolla]

So the answer was to create a new classification that sells out the unborn???

I really don't think it started out this way, but may have morphed into something different.

The idea started out as hybrid, or combination drivers.

What does that sound like? How about employees driving and doing something else.

I posted before that it was my impression that these combination drivers would say, preload for 4 hours and then drive for 4 hours and help eliminate OT. Hence combination.

This changed into a lower paid FT dtiver, which I don't agree with.

With this in mind, where was the consideration for the seniority preloader who was forced from a Mon-Fri schedule, to a Tues-Sat schedule as a result of Saturday ground deliveries???

They don't vote in IBT elections or contracts, so the Union really doesn't care.

As far as OT is concerned, I will say it again, we already had Article 37 language to protect us from excessive OT.

See @Benben post eight above.

 

[Brownslave688]

aaaaaannnddd...we're voting when?

WHY IS THERE A DELAY? We have a proposed contract...let's vote on it. This is ridiculous.

After the new year. That way there’s no threat of a work stoppage during peak

 

[BuckyBadger]

After the new year. That way there’s no threat of a work stoppage during peak

if that's really true, then the Union is in bed with UPS. This contract should be voted on, and now. I'm so tired of being incredibly short of people.

 

[Brownslave688]

if that's really true, then the Union is in bed with UPS. This contract should be voted on, and now. I'm so tired of being incredibly short of people.

You really thought you’d vote during peak?

 

[BuckyBadger]

You really thought you’d vote during peak?

here's what 710's site says:

Negotiations were moving slowly for months, so Local 710 pulled the extension agreement, making it expire right before the height of peak season. That motivated the Company to finally make significant movement to reach an agreement.

The entire negotiating committee worked diligently to craft strengthened language throughout the entire contract, and they have unanimously voted to endorse this contract and bring it to the membership for a vote.

The contract is endorsed. It's being brought to a vote. Other sources said the Union would be around in the next week to explain the contract. yes, I thought we'd vote on it during peak. What else is the point here?

 

[Brownslave688]

here's what 710's site says:

Negotiations were moving slowly for months, so Local 710 pulled the extension agreement, making it expire right before the height of peak season. That motivated the Company to finally make significant movement to reach an agreement.

The entire negotiating committee worked diligently to craft strengthened language throughout the entire contract, and they have unanimously voted to endorse this contract and bring it to the membership for a vote.

The contract is endorsed. It's being brought to a vote. Other sources said the Union would be around in the next week to explain the contract. yes, I thought we'd vote on it during peak. What else is the point here?

The point is the national leaders came in and said listen come to
A handshake agreement so this cloud isn’t hanging over peak. If you try to strike during peak we will just absorb you into the national contract.

 

[BuckyBadger]

The point is out here in 710, UPS can't find live bodies. And two days into peak it has been a complete disaster compared to last year. All kinds of stops being brought back, guys starting the day with fourteen(!!) misloads in one driver's case...because UPS pays crap and even though the new contract is still crap pay, they'd get a few more guys at least.

 

[Brownslave688]

The point is out here in 710, UPS can't find live bodies. And two days into peak it has been a complete disaster compared to last year. All kinds of stops being brought back, guys starting the day with fourteen(!!) misloads in one driver's case...because UPS pays crap and even though the new contract is still crap pay, they'd get a few more guys at least.

I understand that but ups is free to pay more than the contract stipulates if they feel they need to to get employees

 

[zimbomb]

Let UPS set the starting wage (no $300 a week bonuses) for new hires. Let the market dictate it, $15, $20.... But no current employee doing the same job should make less. Hire during peak at $16 everyone makes atleast $16. Hire people at $12 in the spring and when peak rolls around they get a fat raise.

 

[zimbomb]

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