9.5 Contract Opinions

[Back first]

So let's say you was borderline 9.5 Mon-Weds...do you still believe it reads this way? This is where it becomes murky. This is where people's perspective comes into play rather than the language wording it outright the way it should be. So as usual we have 3 different interpretations: the drivers, management, and the unions and sadly MOST times they never see eye to eye. I'm not being smart with you I'm just curious if this is how your management team treats this? In my center if you didn't get 9.5ed Mon-Weds you are gonna get totally blown out Thurs-Fri.

Yes I do. Just because you didn't work any days over 9.5 doesn't give management right to hammer you on the remaining days. I have been on the list twice before and filed over excessive OT on the remaining days. If you have a strong local, this will not happen again.

 

[wide load]

This only applies to when you are getting on the list. This does not apply to Thursday's and Friday's.

Ridiculous response. Your wrong.

 

[wide load]

I love people that are ignorant to the truth, then you feed it to them and they immediately spit it out.

 

[Bubblehead]

Yes I do. Just because you didn't work any days over 9.5 doesn't give management right to hammer you on the remaining days. I have been on the list twice before and filed over excessive OT on the remaining days. If you have a strong local, this will not happen again.

I took this issue all the way to the National Panel in DC last May, on the very premise you describe.

I asked for triple time for all hours over 9.5 that week (2 days worth) and was denied.
The panel did however advise the Company to make sure the issue didn't come back, because it may not be ruled on the same next time (not part of the written decision).

It was the only panel hearing I have ever attended, at any level, where the panel chair for both Union and Company actually asked parties to stay and proceeded to explain the decision.
Very cool and much appreciated.

You see the language actually says; the Company wont "retaliate" on the "two REMAINING days",....meaning AFTER you have been violated.
Remember that sentence follows "for any three (3) days in a workweek".

It really doesn't protect us "literally", if they choose to violate us on two days only, although I believe both sides knew it was the "intent" of the language and the decision was a bit of a "one bite of the apple" for the Company.
The language also does not specifically provide for a penalty in regards to the "2 day scenario".

The whole process, two years plus worth, was a valuable experience that I look back on proudly.
In the end, I hope it will help influence improved "9.5 Opt-in List" language in the future.

 

[MC4YOU2]

If you're over 9.5 (9.51) you can file, once you've met the requirements.

Being borderline has no bearing at all. You're either over or not.

 

[BigUnionGuy]

I took this issue all the way to the National Panel in DC last May, on the very premise you describe.

I asked for triple time for all hours over 9.5 that week (2 days worth) and was denied.
The panel did however advise the Company to make sure the issue didn't come back, because it may not be ruled on the same next time (not part of the written decision).

It was the only panel hearing I have ever attended, at any level, where the panel chair for both Union and Company actually asked parties to stay and proceeded to explain the decision.
Very cool and much appreciated.

You see the language actually says; the Company wont "retaliate" on the "two REMAINING days",....meaning AFTER you have been violated.
Remember that sentence follows "for any three (3) days in a workweek".

It really doesn't protect us "literally", if they choose to violate us on two days only, although I believe both sides knew it was the "intent" of the language and the decision was a bit of a "one bite of the apple" for the Company.
The language also does not specifically provide for a penalty in regards to the "2 day scenario".

The whole process, two years plus worth, was a valuable experience that I look back on proudly.
In the end, I hope it will help influence improved "9.5 Opt-in List" language in the future.

Good post.

Thanks for sharing it with everyone.

You see the language actually says; the Company wont "retaliate" on the "two REMAINING days",....meaning AFTER you have been violated.
Remember that sentence follows "for any three (3) days in a workweek".

It really doesn't protect us "literally", if they choose to violate us on two days only, although I believe both sides knew it was the "intent" of the language and the decision was a bit of a "one bite of the apple" for the Company.

The part I underlined, I believe (and others) is the intent of the language.


Reason being;

The company could load you up on Monday and Tuesday, keep you under the rest

of the week.... and still be in compliance with the language.



-Bug-

 

[BigUnionGuy]

If you're over 9.5 (9.51) you can file, once you've met the requirements.

Being borderline has no bearing at all. You're either over or not.

It's funny that you mention this.

The company has been known to try and take the position that 9.51....

"isn't really a violation". It's more like splitting hairs.


To which my response has always been.... then Next Day Air isn't late at 10:31 am.

It ends the conversation pretty quick.



-Bug-

 

[MC4YOU2]

Here's the technique they used with those on the list at my center:

Pick any three days (usually Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday) to send you out with a decent dispatch. Then, make any two days (usually Thursday and Friday) your heavy days.

Then, they'd try to "ratchet up" the production on your "light" days, by increasing stops until you were basically at 9-9.3 hours.

Soooo, I just started becoming more attentive to the pickup time window compliance, and other time consuming things I was previously shaving in their favor, and, presto! I'm over 9.5 on my light days. We also had late air, 4 out of 5 days, so that usually added a good 20/30 minutes as well.

After they realized I was on to them, they made an effort not to be ridiculous on the dispatch. Most of the time.

You have to push back, unfortunately.

 

[VDUBINIT]

Fridays are the easiest part, I put in for an 8 hr day every Friday. I go over 8.5 just a bit so that I can file a grievance. Then i put in for another 8 hr day the next friday. Rinse and repeat every week.

In the summer I call in sick all 5 days for a week, before my vacation and after. 2 occurances 3 weeks off. Rinse and repeat in July and August every year.

 

[542thruNthru]

Fridays are the easiest part, I put in for an 8 hr day every Friday. I go over 8.5 just a bit so that I can file a grievance. Then i put in for another 8 hr day the next friday. Rinse and repeat every week.

In the summer I call in sick all 5 days for a week, before my vacation and after. 2 occurances 3 weeks off. Rinse and repeat in July and August every year.

So you're saying you intentionally make sure you don't make your 8 every friday?

 

[MC4YOU2]

Bogus.

 

[IVE GOTTA PACKAGE 4U]

So you're saying you intentionally make sure you don't make your 8 every friday?

They will catch him if that's the case.

 

[BigUnionGuy]

They will catch him if that's the case.

"Plan your work, and work your plan".


Don't take advice from UPS internet commandos.

11 posts....

Pfft.



-Bug-

 

[IVE GOTTA PACKAGE 4U]

"Plan your work, and work your plan".


Don't take advice from UPS internet commandos.

11 posts....

Pfft.



-Bug-

You been playing this game a long time too. If you are being dishonest, they will find a way to get you. These guys do not relaize the technology they have on us

Give them an honest day, you are getting paid for it. Fight the correct battles, don't make extra problems for yourself.

But you already know that

 

[wide load]

Fridays are the easiest part, I put in for an 8 hr day every Friday. I go over 8.5 just a bit so that I can file a grievance. Then i put in for another 8 hr day the next friday. Rinse and repeat every week.

In the summer I call in sick all 5 days for a week, before my vacation and after. 2 occurances 3 weeks off. Rinse and repeat in July and August every year.

No Dr note required for 5 days? I smell something...

 

[VDUBINIT]

So you're saying you intentionally make sure you don't make your 8 every friday?

Intentionally go over 8, no my route is about 45 min from the building. I have 4 pickups everyday which prevents my route from ever working less than 8.75 hours.

There's only two routes I'm my area. "Military base". The other driver gets an 8 hr day every Wednesday and Thursday. "He goes over every week also." Exiting the base @ 445-5 TAKES along time, Package car has to be inspected entering and exiting the base everyday.

 

[VDUBINIT]

No Dr note required for 5 days? I smell something...

Dr note isn't required, my wife is my primary physician so they don't ask for one.


21 years as a ft package driver, I have seen ALOT of things over the years. If they ask for a note when I come back I just tell them the Dr can't get me in until next Monday would you like me to come back next Monday?

 

[HULKAMANIA]

Fridays are the easiest part, I put in for an 8 hr day every Friday. I go over 8.5 just a bit so that I can file a grievance. Then i put in for another 8 hr day the next friday. Rinse and repeat every week.

In the summer I call in sick all 5 days for a week, before my vacation and after. 2 occurances 3 weeks off. Rinse and repeat in July and August every year.

Wouldnt you wanna work next to this guy?

 

[UnconTROLLed]

Wouldnt you wanna work next to this guy?

Frankly, it doesn't bother me.

 

[Dragon]

Dr note isn't required, my wife is my primary physician so they don't ask for one.


21 years as a ft package driver, I have seen ALOT of things over the years. If they ask for a note when I come back I just tell them the Dr can't get me in until next Monday would you like me to come back next Monday?

employee of the quarter right here.