satellitedriver
Senior Member
Another question is, "What shenanigans has the teamster/CS plan pulled on UPS employees already"?
GuyinBrown
Blah
I could be mistaken, but from what I've gathered from reading other threads on the issue, it has a lot to do with the disproportionate amount of retirees in the CS plan from companies other than UPS. Many of which no longer exist.
satellitedriver
Senior Member
Very bad investments. Played the dot.com bubble and lost.
Western took a prudent long term investment view and prevailed.
in the UK if your face fits and kiss ass plus no nothing you can progress in 3 mouths I have team leaders at my centre who don't even no all the jobs there and just do the same thing day in day out I think if you can not do the job your self then you are not ready to move up here in the UK the turn over of staff is very high as a lot of the management have NO man management skills at all
Based on how this thread is meanering, I hate to bring it up, but I can tell you that as a 15 year supervisor, I made significantly less than a full wage driver. Including the stock at the end of the year (ignore the effect of the ex-wife). Now that I am at 20+, I may be equal but that is it. Stock is not the answer it used to be for management, but some of us will be here because of the 'golden handcuffs'. Can't really afford to stay, can't afford to leave. Keep that in mind as hourly wages are evaluated. Upper level salaries I can't speak too.
705red
Browncafe Steward
You are aware that ups also has trustees on the cs plan, right? What quarantee do we have the same wont happen? Ups (trustees) had to approve the investments.
satellitedriver
Senior Member
You also are aware that the federal government mandated that the teamsters could no longer control the investments of CS due to mob influence. UPS has no say as to CS's investment stradegy(sp), which has been dismal.
705red
Browncafe Steward
Satelite what year was that mandate? So you are admitting that its not all the teamsters fault? Not trying to spin your response but you are the first one to admit that the government has been handling the cs plan and hold some blame on this also.
705red
Browncafe Steward
Cole your right, but how long ago was that? It did not happen recently, but everyone wants to blame the teamsters of today for that! Its like comparing what the president and the congress did 20 years ago and blaming it all on bush and congressman of today. Both (teamsters and bushs administration) have their flaws but we cant blame everything on them. See what i mean cole!
satellitedriver
Senior Member
Spin?
Teamsters/Hoffa/ Mafia controlled the investments in CS until the govt took their hand out of the cookie jar, but not their influence over CS.
I would have to look up the date when that happened and it is too late tonight.
The government has never handled the CS plan. It only regulated who could not use it for a slush fund.
If CS continues going south with our pension, the the govt will step in and handle it.
Sweet Jesus, I hope that day never comes around.
Cole
Well-Known Member
I know exactly what you mean Red, but we cannot ignore what was done with the massive amounts of members money in those days, and it was Hoffa's Dad that was in office when it happened. If they had not allowed the crooks free rein with our money, we wouldn't be having this discussion.
It happened then when people were not paying attention, and we have to relflect on the how's and why's to keep it from ever happenning again, and it could happen no matter who our Union is, if people do not get involved and hold the union accountable.
It happened then when people were not paying attention, and we have to relflect on the how's and why's to keep it from ever happenning again, and it could happen no matter who our Union is, if people do not get involved and hold the union accountable.
705red
Browncafe Steward
Hey im all for holding the union accountable, but i do take exception when i see people slam the union and attempt to divide and conquer. Especially when they had a hand in undermining the union, now they want to slam and bash the unions efforts when they themselves didnt give any effort in supporting of the union.
705red
Browncafe Steward
I havent seen any where in this thread where any one thinks the cs pension is a good deal! But just because ups is considering buying out doesnt mean that ups's proposal will be better, just have to wait and see. If ups is willing to spend between $4 billion and $12 billion to do it you have to ask why? Whats the reason behind it!
satellitedriver
Senior Member
They???
705red
Browncafe Steward
Are you asking if you fit into that description? Are you feeling a little guilty for something?
Yes you are one of the people i was talking about. Obviously you made some bad decisions which undermined the teamsters, now you attempt to bash the teamsters for failures while at the same time you wouldnt stand next to us in a time of crisis(97 strike). When times got tough you tucked tail and ran, while the teamsters (of today) are attempting to fix the cs pension plan without causing more damage to it and still its not good enough for you. I understand that the plan is probably one big hit away from going belly up, but some of the investments over the last 2 or 3 years has helped grow slowly. Its no where near where we all would like to see it, and its not fair to all participants of that plan, but its also not fair to rip away at the structure of the teamster core because of what happened years ago. I am not a hoffa fan did not vote for the guy but he won an election that over 80% of us decided wasnt important enough to make a check mark and stick into 2 envelopes and drop into a mailbox, it doesnt get any easy then that!
My whole point here is the teamsters arent perfect, ups isnt perfect, alot of things in life arent perfect, and sometimes its easy to just complain about it. Then their are guys who will stand up for what the believe without bashing the efforts of those involved by having their voices heard and showing a support for their union without attempting to dismantle it.
