Gas Prices
- Thread starter moreluck
- Start date
If gas prices were really an issue right now for americans like you THINK it is, why isnt NEWT gaining any traction with his promise of 2.50 a gallon gas? He is LOSING GROUND to the others with this claim.
But, YOU guys think gas is an issue.
Peace
TOS
But, YOU guys think gas is an issue.
Peace
TOS
Buddybrown
Well-Known Member
No, gas prices were only an issue when G.W. was president. Get a clue on how things work in your media!
tourists24
Well-Known Member
You go ahead and keep on thinking that the price of gas isnt going to be important
BrownArmy
Well-Known Member
When George Bush Jr. was running for reelection, gas prices were right around $3.50 - $4.00 per gallon in my neighborhood.
After he got elected, the prices fell some, and then rose right back to $3.50+ per gallon.
Right now, gas prices are...wait for it!
Around $3.50 - $4.00 per gallon in my neighborhood.
Under Obama's presidency, the US as a whole has increased domestic oil drilling on a variety of fronts...whether or not this has anything to do with Obama is irrelevant. We're actually EXPORTING oil right now...weird, right?
According to an AP study of the last 36 years of domestic oil production vs. gasoline prices, there seems to be no relationship between how much the US drills and gas prices at home.
I'm pretty sure the President has little or no control over daily prices at the pump; the price of gas is much more subject to the situation in the middle east, the fact that we're in an election cycle, etc...*
It bums me out to hear the republican candidates jumping on Obama about gas prices. It's just a political game. When Newt says (if he gets elected) gas prices will drop to $2.50, he's being disingenous - where's the plan? If there was something Obama (or any president) could actually do to drop the price of gas by over a $, don't you think they would have done it?
Bush didn't do it, Obama didn't do it, the next president won't be able to do it either. It's a red herring.
*Saudi Arabia just announced that they're going to 'open the floodgates' and send several extra supertankers of oil to the US, to try and help lower the price of gas. We have the demand, they have the supply, it's that easy. We're drilling more oil now than in the past, but we lack the facilities to refine it all, which is just one of the many reasons we're held hostage to the middle east...
After he got elected, the prices fell some, and then rose right back to $3.50+ per gallon.
Right now, gas prices are...wait for it!
Around $3.50 - $4.00 per gallon in my neighborhood.
Under Obama's presidency, the US as a whole has increased domestic oil drilling on a variety of fronts...whether or not this has anything to do with Obama is irrelevant. We're actually EXPORTING oil right now...weird, right?
According to an AP study of the last 36 years of domestic oil production vs. gasoline prices, there seems to be no relationship between how much the US drills and gas prices at home.
I'm pretty sure the President has little or no control over daily prices at the pump; the price of gas is much more subject to the situation in the middle east, the fact that we're in an election cycle, etc...*
It bums me out to hear the republican candidates jumping on Obama about gas prices. It's just a political game. When Newt says (if he gets elected) gas prices will drop to $2.50, he's being disingenous - where's the plan? If there was something Obama (or any president) could actually do to drop the price of gas by over a $, don't you think they would have done it?
Bush didn't do it, Obama didn't do it, the next president won't be able to do it either. It's a red herring.
*Saudi Arabia just announced that they're going to 'open the floodgates' and send several extra supertankers of oil to the US, to try and help lower the price of gas. We have the demand, they have the supply, it's that easy. We're drilling more oil now than in the past, but we lack the facilities to refine it all, which is just one of the many reasons we're held hostage to the middle east...
moreluck
golden ticket member
Saudi oil takes much more work to be made usable......like it's not as refined as say Iran oil. It's not apples to apples.
Right or wrong, the president is always blamed for stuff like gas prices, unemployment numbers, overspending, etc.
$4.59 at the 76 station this morning!!
WOW ,
Prices in Los Angeles down 2 cents on friday. Look for futher reductions to follow. The spike is over. Low prices coming to a neighborhood near you, too bad they dont drop as fast as they rise!
Peace
TOS
av8torntn
Well-Known Member
Wait a minute there is still speculation on oil and the leftists have been claiming that oil speculation drives up gas prices so what gives?
av8torntn
Well-Known Member
moreluck
golden ticket member
Pre-mature excitement !!!
I paid $4.25 today for fuel, was at $4.37 last week. Sorry your town gas station is sticking it to you. But then again, maybe im not.
Peace
TOS
wkmac
Well-Known Member
But is there a really free market to let that happen should they be able to do that?
av8torntn
Well-Known Member
Yep remember it doesn't have to sell in the states.
wkmac
Well-Known Member
Now that's true. The bigger questions should that occur,
1) With oil now de-valued as a monetary backing commodity (petro dollar) with air being the conveyance fuel of choice, would global banking interests demand intervention to protect their own interests?
2) Would world oil interests demand intervention to protect their turf?
3) Would the US gov't not to mention other nationstates who tax oil as a major revenue source institute/demand intervention to protect not only central taxation models but taxing models to pay for roads?
4) How do you tax air to pay for road support?
5) How would natonstates maintain centralized power with a transportation energy source that screams de-centralization all over it?
These same questions apply to any non-petroleum solutions for vehicle energy.
20 Experts Who Say Drilling Won't Lower Gas Prices
By Jocelyn Fong, Media Matters for America
24 March 12
In a pretty impressive act of journalism, the Associated Press recently conducted a "statistical analysis of 36 years of monthly, inflation-adjusted gasoline prices and U.S. domestic oil production." The result: "No statistical correlation between how much oil comes out of U.S. wells and the price at the pump." It's neat to see math cut through the talking points and get straight to the truth of the matter - which is that expanding drilling is a fundamentally ineffectual response to gas price spikes.
Given that changes in U.S. oil production don't move gasoline prices, it should be clear that U.S. government policies related to drilling are of even smaller consequence. Indeed, 92 percent of economists surveyed by the Chicago Booth School of Business agreed this week that "changes in U.S. gasoline prices over the past 10 years have predominantly been due to market factors rather than U.S. federal economic or energy policies."
Still not convinced? How about another 20 economists and analysts from across the political spectrum who will tell you the same thing:
Ken Green, American Enterprise Institute, "If the U.S. produced more of its own oil, it would probably reduce imports, but it's not likely that it would reduce prices ... We probably cannot produce so much oil to exert downward pressure on prices compared to the world market."
Peter Van Doren and Jerry Taylor, Cato Institute: "Sure, more domestic oil creates the possibility of fewer refined imports tied to the price of Brent crude, but given that the price of Brent sets the price for crude generally, the result would be more profit for domestic crude producers rather than significantly lower gasoline prices for Americans (not that there's anything wrong with that)."
Doug Holtz-Eakin, American Action Forum: "Domestic action to increase production will not lower gas prices set on a global market."
Christopher Knittel, MIT economist: "There are not many markets where the United States can't impose its will on market outcomes ... This is one we can't, and it's hard for the average American to understand that and it's easy for politicians to feed off that."
Pinelopi Goldberg, Yale economist: "US domestic policy has only tiny effect on the world price of oil. US foreign policy is probably more relevant than energy policy."
Steve Koonin, Institute for Defense Analyses: "When you hear the international oil companies advocating for energy independence, it's really about making money, which isn't a bad thing ... If they produce a million more barrels a day, they're not going to change the global price much. And since they know the global price is going up, they'll just make more money. There's nothing wrong with that, but it doesn't solve the price problem or the greenhouse gas problem."
Michael Levi, Council on Foreign Relations: "The amount of oil you produce at home doesn't affect the price ... You can lower your vulnerability to price by lowering your consumption of oil, but not by increasing your production."
Severin Borenstein, UC Berkeley economist: "Producing more oil domestically will enrich the U.S. economy, particularly U.S. oil companies and their workers. With oil so valuable, it may be a good idea, though the value must be weighed against environmental consequences. But it will have no discernible impact on gas prices, because it will change the world's supply/demand balance for oil by less than 2 or 3 percent over a decade or more."
David Peterson, Duke statistician: "U.S. production and demand have little to do with the price of gasoline in the U.S."
Edward Melnick, NYU statistician: When U.S. production goes up, the price of gas "is certainly not going down ... The data does not suggest that whatsoever."
David Sandalow, former Brookings fellow: "Drilling offshore to lower oil prices is like walking an extra 20 feet per day to lose weight. ... It's just not going to make much of a difference."
Tom Kloza, Oil Price Information Service: "This drill drill drill thing is tired ... It's a simplistic way of looking for a solution that doesn't exist."
Richard Newell, former Administrator of Energy Information Administration: "We do not project additional volumes of oil that could flow from greater access to oil resources on Federal lands to have a large impact on prices given the globally integrated nature of the world oil market."
Dean Baker, Center for Economic and Policy Research: "There is almost no disagreement among economists that drilling everywhere all the time offshore will have almost no impact on the price of gas in the United States. The reason is that we have a world market for oil. The additional oil that might come from offshore drilling is a drop in the bucket in a world oil market of almost 90 million barrels a day."
Lou Crandall, Wrightson ICAP LLC: "Higher oil prices today are a global phenomenon, and the additional supply from increased drilling by the U.S. would not alter the global balance of supply and demand greatly. Gasoline prices at the pump would be higher either way. The only difference is that a somewhat larger share of the revenue would accrue to domestic interests (governmental and private) rather than to foreign suppliers."
Paul Bledsoe, Bipartisan Policy Center: "The notion that somehow we can produce so much domestically that we will move the global price is incorrect."
Tom O'Donnell, The New School: "The amount of extra oil that the U.S. would produce, as far as affecting the world price of oil, is almost insignificant."'
Deborah Gordon, Carnegie Endowment for International Peace: "We can drill doggedly in our own backyards, but the price of gasoline will remain more a matter of speculation over externally-driven factors than tapping new sources of oil at home."
Joseph Dukert, energy analyst: "Americans tend to exaggerate the price effects of fluctuations in domestic production in relation to the total amount of oil in global trade. On the larger stage, the perception of geopolitical risks is more important."
Phyllis Martin, Energy Information Administration: "In 2009, the U.S. produced about 7 percent of what was produced in the entire world, so increasing the oil production in the U.S. is not going to make much of a difference in world markets and world prices ... It just gets lost. It's not that much." Even Fox's John Stossel acknowledged recently that U.S. energy policy "doesn't make that much of a difference" on gas prices, contrary to what others at Fox News are claiming.
There's simply no excuse for political reporters to tolerate, let alone advance claims that more U.S. oil production will meaningfully address our gas price woes. (Here's a taste, from the past week alone, of the type of he-said/she-said reporting that is just not cutting it: CNN, New York Times, Washington Post, Wall Street Journal, USA Today.) This is crucially important because once we understand that the U.S. is incapable of holding down the price of gasoline, we can start looking seriously at the options we do have to make ourselves less vulnerable to these inevitable price spikes.
By Jocelyn Fong, Media Matters for America
24 March 12
In a pretty impressive act of journalism, the Associated Press recently conducted a "statistical analysis of 36 years of monthly, inflation-adjusted gasoline prices and U.S. domestic oil production." The result: "No statistical correlation between how much oil comes out of U.S. wells and the price at the pump." It's neat to see math cut through the talking points and get straight to the truth of the matter - which is that expanding drilling is a fundamentally ineffectual response to gas price spikes.
Given that changes in U.S. oil production don't move gasoline prices, it should be clear that U.S. government policies related to drilling are of even smaller consequence. Indeed, 92 percent of economists surveyed by the Chicago Booth School of Business agreed this week that "changes in U.S. gasoline prices over the past 10 years have predominantly been due to market factors rather than U.S. federal economic or energy policies."
Still not convinced? How about another 20 economists and analysts from across the political spectrum who will tell you the same thing:
Ken Green, American Enterprise Institute, "If the U.S. produced more of its own oil, it would probably reduce imports, but it's not likely that it would reduce prices ... We probably cannot produce so much oil to exert downward pressure on prices compared to the world market."
Peter Van Doren and Jerry Taylor, Cato Institute: "Sure, more domestic oil creates the possibility of fewer refined imports tied to the price of Brent crude, but given that the price of Brent sets the price for crude generally, the result would be more profit for domestic crude producers rather than significantly lower gasoline prices for Americans (not that there's anything wrong with that)."
Doug Holtz-Eakin, American Action Forum: "Domestic action to increase production will not lower gas prices set on a global market."
Christopher Knittel, MIT economist: "There are not many markets where the United States can't impose its will on market outcomes ... This is one we can't, and it's hard for the average American to understand that and it's easy for politicians to feed off that."
Pinelopi Goldberg, Yale economist: "US domestic policy has only tiny effect on the world price of oil. US foreign policy is probably more relevant than energy policy."
Steve Koonin, Institute for Defense Analyses: "When you hear the international oil companies advocating for energy independence, it's really about making money, which isn't a bad thing ... If they produce a million more barrels a day, they're not going to change the global price much. And since they know the global price is going up, they'll just make more money. There's nothing wrong with that, but it doesn't solve the price problem or the greenhouse gas problem."
Michael Levi, Council on Foreign Relations: "The amount of oil you produce at home doesn't affect the price ... You can lower your vulnerability to price by lowering your consumption of oil, but not by increasing your production."
Severin Borenstein, UC Berkeley economist: "Producing more oil domestically will enrich the U.S. economy, particularly U.S. oil companies and their workers. With oil so valuable, it may be a good idea, though the value must be weighed against environmental consequences. But it will have no discernible impact on gas prices, because it will change the world's supply/demand balance for oil by less than 2 or 3 percent over a decade or more."
David Peterson, Duke statistician: "U.S. production and demand have little to do with the price of gasoline in the U.S."
Edward Melnick, NYU statistician: When U.S. production goes up, the price of gas "is certainly not going down ... The data does not suggest that whatsoever."
David Sandalow, former Brookings fellow: "Drilling offshore to lower oil prices is like walking an extra 20 feet per day to lose weight. ... It's just not going to make much of a difference."
Tom Kloza, Oil Price Information Service: "This drill drill drill thing is tired ... It's a simplistic way of looking for a solution that doesn't exist."
Richard Newell, former Administrator of Energy Information Administration: "We do not project additional volumes of oil that could flow from greater access to oil resources on Federal lands to have a large impact on prices given the globally integrated nature of the world oil market."
Dean Baker, Center for Economic and Policy Research: "There is almost no disagreement among economists that drilling everywhere all the time offshore will have almost no impact on the price of gas in the United States. The reason is that we have a world market for oil. The additional oil that might come from offshore drilling is a drop in the bucket in a world oil market of almost 90 million barrels a day."
Lou Crandall, Wrightson ICAP LLC: "Higher oil prices today are a global phenomenon, and the additional supply from increased drilling by the U.S. would not alter the global balance of supply and demand greatly. Gasoline prices at the pump would be higher either way. The only difference is that a somewhat larger share of the revenue would accrue to domestic interests (governmental and private) rather than to foreign suppliers."
Paul Bledsoe, Bipartisan Policy Center: "The notion that somehow we can produce so much domestically that we will move the global price is incorrect."
Tom O'Donnell, The New School: "The amount of extra oil that the U.S. would produce, as far as affecting the world price of oil, is almost insignificant."'
Deborah Gordon, Carnegie Endowment for International Peace: "We can drill doggedly in our own backyards, but the price of gasoline will remain more a matter of speculation over externally-driven factors than tapping new sources of oil at home."
Joseph Dukert, energy analyst: "Americans tend to exaggerate the price effects of fluctuations in domestic production in relation to the total amount of oil in global trade. On the larger stage, the perception of geopolitical risks is more important."
Phyllis Martin, Energy Information Administration: "In 2009, the U.S. produced about 7 percent of what was produced in the entire world, so increasing the oil production in the U.S. is not going to make much of a difference in world markets and world prices ... It just gets lost. It's not that much." Even Fox's John Stossel acknowledged recently that U.S. energy policy "doesn't make that much of a difference" on gas prices, contrary to what others at Fox News are claiming.
There's simply no excuse for political reporters to tolerate, let alone advance claims that more U.S. oil production will meaningfully address our gas price woes. (Here's a taste, from the past week alone, of the type of he-said/she-said reporting that is just not cutting it: CNN, New York Times, Washington Post, Wall Street Journal, USA Today.) This is crucially important because once we understand that the U.S. is incapable of holding down the price of gasoline, we can start looking seriously at the options we do have to make ourselves less vulnerable to these inevitable price spikes.
