Golf Cart "Drivers"

[Article 3]

Residential here.



So are PVD's. They do not have to be plated as commercial.

Remember, a commercial motor vehicle definition?

Commercial motor vehicle means any self-propelled or towed motor vehicle used on a highway in interstate commerce to transport passengers or property when the vehicle—

(1) Has a gross vehicle weight rating or gross combination weight rating, or gross vehicle weight or gross combination weight, of 4,536 kg (10,001 pounds) or more, whichever is greater; or

(2) Is designed or used to transport more than 8 passengers (including the driver) for compensation; or

(3) Is designed or used to transport more than 15 passengers, including the driver, and is not used to transport passengers for compensation; or

(4) Is used in transporting material found by the Secretary of Transportation to be hazardous under 49 U.S.C. 5103 and transported in a quantity requiring placarding under regulations prescribed by the Secretary under 49 CFR, subtitle B, chapter I, subchapter C.



Not plated as commercial.



I know.



Or not to be used in an enclosed space without proper ventilation.



Proper ventilation is only 2 square feet. They may be enclosed, but are not sealed.



Guess not.



May be true, but ours are residential.

Not inclusive. The Vans we used are not rated at 10,000 GVW or over yet they had to be plated commercially.
There's more to it than that little excerpt.

Was that proper ventilation description from the manufacturer of that heater? BTUs and carbon monoxide output have everything to do with the rating of cfm's to sweep an area and I bet NFPA has regulations covering the situation as well.

I bought a small Chevrolet truck a few years ago that had a custom area built in the rear out of fiberglass. It only weighed 3500 pounds and the manufacturer only allowed it to be plated for 6000 GVW. I tried to get residential plates on it but because the VIN number was set up to be a commercial vehicle the license bureau would not let me change it.
There's other variables at play here.

 

[OrioN]

UPS “borrowed” the Smith system.

Nah, your company is paying Mr Smith annually to have the copyrighted material be taught to your drivers.

FedEx Ground used to pay for that same material, but did away with it.

Formed their own acronym for the similar "space cushion driving" S.A.friend.E.

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I'm still trying to find the specifics on this though...

 

[Mugarolla]

Not inclusive.

Yes inclusive.

Those are the FMCSA Regulations defining what a Commercial Motor Vehicle is.

The Vans we used are not rated at 10,000 GVW or over yet they had to be plated commercially.

Yes they are.

You're confusing gross vehicle weight with gross combination vehicle weight.

There's more to it than that little excerpt.

Nope. Look up the regulations for yourself.

Was that proper ventilation description from the manufacturer of that heater?

Yes.

BTUs and carbon monoxide output have everything to do with the rating of cfm's to sweep an area and I bet NFPA has regulations covering the situation as well.

Probably.

I bought a small Chevrolet truck a few years ago that had a custom area built in the rear out of fiberglass. It only weighed 3500 pounds and the manufacturer only allowed it to be plated for 6000 GVW. I tried to get residential plates on it but because the VIN number was set up to be a commercial vehicle the license bureau would not let me change it.

Your truck has a GVW of 6000 lbs. This includes the weight of the truck and the weight of cargo in the bed.

How much weight is your truck rated to pull?

Bet you a beer this puts your trucks gross combination vehicle weight over 10,000 lbs, requiring commercial plates.

There's other variables at play here.

Nope.

(1) Has a gross vehicle weight rating or gross combination weight rating, or gross vehicle weight or gross combination weight, of 4,536 kg (10,001 pounds) or more, whichever is greater

 

[Mugarolla]

Nah, your company is paying Mr Smith annually to have the copyrighted material be taught to your drivers.

FedEx Ground used to pay for that same material, but did away with it.

Formed their own acronym for the similar "space cushion driving" S.A.friend.E.

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I'm still trying to find the specifics on this though...

Smith System - Five Principles of Safe Driving | Platinum Drivers Inc.

 

[OrioN]

Smith System - Five Principles of Safe Driving | Platinum Drivers Inc.

I already know the 5 keys, butt where did FedEx ground come up with

S.A.friend.E.

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[Mugarolla]

I already know the 5 keys, butt where did FedEx ground come up with

S.A.friend.E.

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Don't know.

Off hand, could only find this.

Safety

 

[Article 3]

Yes inclusive.

Those are the FMCSA Regulations defining what a Commercial Motor Vehicle is.



Yes they are.

You're confusing gross vehicle weight with gross combination vehicle weight.



Nope. Look up the regulations for yourself.



Yes.



Probably.



Your truck has a GVW of 6000 lbs. This includes the weight of the truck and the weight of cargo in the bed.

How much weight is your truck rated to pull?

Bet you a beer this puts your trucks gross combination vehicle weight over 10,000 lbs, requiring commercial plates.



Nope.

(1) Has a gross vehicle weight rating or gross combination weight rating, or gross vehicle weight or gross combination weight, of 4,536 kg (10,001 pounds) or more, whichever is greater

I'm not a bit confused about anything. The minivans UPS used to use were plated as commercial but did not require an employee to pass a dot to drive because of what they were rated to haul with total combination weight being under 10,000 lbs.

My personal vehicle was rated at 3 tons total combination weight. You can plate a commercial vehicle for more than it's rated. I would not suggest it.

You're saying those heaters may be enclosed in a two ft square area and that's "proper ventilation". Clearance to combustibles may be two feet from the flame but I'd have to read that two ft squared area is sufficient to believe it.

 

[Mugarolla]

I'm not a bit confused about anything.

Whether your vehicle is plated as commercial by the BMV standards, and whether your vehicle classifies as a commercial vehicle for DOT purposes, placing you under the rules of the DOT, are two different things.

You are correct. Your truck needs commercial plates according to the BMV but does not fall under the laws of the DOT governing commercial vehicles since it is less than 10,000 GVWR.

The definition of a commercial motor vehicle in 49 CFR Section § 390.5 relates to needing a DOT number and Medical Card and placing you under the laws and rules of the FMCSA.

Vehicles registered to a company need commercial plates also, but do not necessarily need a DOT number or a Medical Card to drive, unless the FMCSA Commercial Motor Vehicle definition is met.

The UPS vans under 10,000 technically do not need a Medical Card or DOT number, plated as commercial because they are classified as trucks under the BMV, but less than 10,000 lbs, although all UPS vehicles have the same DOT number, and you, as a UPS employee, are not going to be limited to just driving less than an 8 cube, so all drivers need a medical card.

So you are correct, even the vehicles under 10,000 lbs need commercial plates since they are registered to a company and also classified as trucks.

As for your pick up, it is classified as a truck, as you even mentioned. Vans, buses and box trucks are also classified by the BMV as trucks, needing commercial plates. There are 8 classes of commercial trucks, based on weight, all needing commercial plates, but not necessarily classifying you as a commercial motor vehicle for DOT purposes, needing a DOT Number or Medical Card.

• 
  
  • Class 1- GVWR ranges from 0 to 6,000 pounds (0 to 2,722 kg)
  • Class 2- GVWR ranges from 6,001 to 10,000 pounds (2,722 to 4,536 kg)
  • Class 3- GVWR ranges from 10,001 to 14,000 pounds (4,536 to 6,350 kg)
  • Class 4- GVWR ranges from 14,001 to 16,000 pounds (6,351 to 7,257 kg)
  • Class 5- GVWR ranges from 16,001 to 19,500 pounds (7,258 to 8,845 kg).
  • Class 6- GVWR ranges from 19,501 to 26,000 pounds (8,846 to 11,793 kg)
  • Class 7- GVWR ranges from 26,001 to 33,000 pounds (11,794 to 14,969 kg)
  • Class 8- GVWR is anything above 33,000 pounds (14,969 kg)

This is why UPS ads for PVD's state their vehicle must be under 10,001 lbs. They can still have a pick up plated as commercial and not fall under the DOT regulations. Class 1 or 2. If they are Class 3 or above, they would need a Medical Card and a DOT number.

You're saying those heaters may be enclosed in a two ft square area and that's "proper ventilation".

No.

I'm saying there must be a 2 square foot area open, in an enclosed space about the size of a 2 person tent, for proper ventilation to run the heater continuously. But these heaters do have an oxygen depletion sensor that will shut the heaters off if the oxygen level drops too much.

Look, they are going to use golf carts anyway. Give them some heat. With proper ventilation combined with an oxygen depletion sensor, that's the best we got.

Yes, we can push for the electric heaters. Go ahead and grieve it. See where it goes.

I won't hold my breath.

 

[BigUnionGuy]

The UPS vans under 10,000 technically do not need a Medical Card or DOT number, plated as commercial because they are classified as trucks under the BMV, but less than 10,000 lbs, although all UPS vehicles have the same DOT number, and you, as a UPS employee, are not going to be limited to just driving less than an 8 cube, so all drivers need a medical card.

Came here to say exactly this.

The issue has come up before with air drivers, and why they need a

DOT medical card. You're not guaranteed on what vehicle you might be driving.

So you are correct, even the vehicles under 10,000 lbs need commercial plates since they are registered to a company and also classified as trucks.

Yep.

A business involved in domestic commerce, has to register the vehicle as a truck.

People that are self employed in the construction business run into this problem.


For example;

If you use a van, as a work vehicle.... take out the removable rear seat and

it needs commercial tags. Cops like to nail people on that. Or, the overloaded

20 year old pickup with ladder racks and a "crew" stuffed inside the cab.


I like the debate in this thread.

It's a good distraction from the normal nonsense.



-Bug-

 

[Mugarolla]

Came here to say exactly this.

The issue has come up before with air drivers, and why they need a

DOT medical card. You're not guaranteed on what vehicle you might be driving.





Yep.

A business involved in domestic commerce, has to register the vehicle as a truck.

People that are self employed in the construction business run into this problem.


For example;

If you use a van, as a work vehicle.... take out the removable rear seat and

it needs commercial tags. Cops like to nail people on that. Or, the overloaded

20 year old pickup with ladder racks and a "crew" stuffed inside the cab.


I like the debate in this thread.

It's a good distraction from the normal nonsense.



-Bug-

I'm right with you.

No hard feelings toward anybody. I just love a good debate.....

Even if I am proven wrong.

 

[Bubblehead]

I like the debate in this thread.

It's a good distraction from the normal nonsense.



-Bug-

I'm right with you.

No hard feelings toward anybody. I just love a good debate.....

Even if I am proven wrong.

How about we get back on the OP's original question?

We aren't all hypnotized by the word "safety"...

Are these employees helpers, or seasonal drivers?



~Bbbl~™

 

[5habits100]

How about we get back on the OP's original question?

We aren't all hypnotized by the word "safety"...

Are these employees helpers, or seasonal drivers?



~Bbbl~™

Drivers IMO

 

[Mugarolla]

How about we get back on the OP's original question?

We aren't all hypnotized by the word "safety"...

Are these employees helpers, or seasonal drivers?



~Bbbl~™

We both answered that question.

Where you been?

Sounds like they are seasonal drivers.
-Bug-

I agree
.

 

[Bubblehead]

We both answered that question.

Where you been?

No offense, but I also relish other opinions?

....but in all fairness, -Bug- and yourself were tagged in my post, so....

Was actually hoping to hear how it is being paid elsewhere?

Perhaps I should have phrased things differently?


~Bbbl~™

 

[Dhydratd]

Dvir books

Lmao!!

"OK for service"....

 

[Rack em]

"OK for service"....

Looks like the golf cart I had in Mexico after I finished (not sure if I actually finished) 18 holes BLACK OUT drunk. Golf in Mexico is the bees knees.

 

[Mugarolla]

No offense, but I also relish other opinions?

....but in all fairness, -Bug- and yourself were tagged in my post, so....

Was actually hoping to hear how it is being paid elsewhere?

Perhaps I should have phrased things differently?


~Bbbl~™

Paid as helpers here.

 

[35years]

DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION
National Highway Traffic Safety Administration
49 CFR Part 571
[Docket No. NHTSA 98-3949]
RIN 2127-AG58

Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards

AGENCY: National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA), DOT.

ACTION: Final rule

SUMMARY: This final rule responds to a growing public interest in using golf cars(1) and other similar-sized, 4-wheeled vehicles

https://one.nhtsa.gov/cars/rules/rulings/lsv/lsv.html

 

[Article 3]

Whether your vehicle is plated as commercial by the BMV standards, and whether your vehicle classifies as a commercial vehicle for DOT purposes, placing you under the rules of the DOT, are two different things.

You are correct. Your truck needs commercial plates according to the BMV but does not fall under the laws of the DOT governing commercial vehicles since it is less than 10,000 GVWR.

The definition of a commercial motor vehicle in 49 CFR Section § 390.5 relates to needing a DOT number and Medical Card and placing you under the laws and rules of the FMCSA.

Vehicles registered to a company need commercial plates also, but do not necessarily need a DOT number or a Medical Card to drive, unless the FMCSA Commercial Motor Vehicle definition is met.

The UPS vans under 10,000 technically do not need a Medical Card or DOT number, plated as commercial because they are classified as trucks under the BMV, but less than 10,000 lbs, although all UPS vehicles have the same DOT number, and you, as a UPS employee, are not going to be limited to just driving less than an 8 cube, so all drivers need a medical card.

You have forgotten that employees under ADA and those that didn't pass their DOT can still deliver pkgs in the small vans. I know people who would benefit from that option that are now forced to work inside.

I've had and driven with a Class A CDL for 25+ years. I understand the ratings and exclusions.

To your statement about the propane heaters being equipped with an ODS; if the Oxygen level gets that low the damage from CO and CO2 is already done. Headaches and nausea is onset before the flame dies (due to lack of oxygen) and closes the safety valve actuated by the internal thermocouple. These emissions attack the blood stream and some people's adverse reactions are more acute than others'.

Let's talk money....the thing the company reacts to:

Using just 1 cylinder (presumed to be a 16 oz unit) at $4.00 each for only 40 days coupled with the price of the 3000 btu unit you posted that is being used the it's apparent the cost far exceeds the price of an electric 12v heater.

With electric heat there are no compressed flammable gas, no toxic emissions, and they could be negotiated with the price of renting the cart so it comes equipped from the get go.

The readings and studies on the effects of burning propane ((typically studied in a 100 ft cubed area not a 2 ft squared space with multiple air exchanges) are far reaching and comprehensive. And not good.

 

[Article 3]

Paid as helpers here.

All the while driving what would be the equivalent of a PVD vehicle with a lot less pay. That's bullcrap.