The unions aren't what's destroying companies. They were destroyed well before by Reagan's lifting of foreign tariffs which made us non-competitive and then Clinton's NAFTA (started by H Bush but championed by Clinton) that opened the doors for companies to outsource. It's hardly the unions fault that companies were sausaged by legislation from BOTH sides of the table. There was a time when union and management worked together to keep a corporation in line and fair. But now it's us versus them. More partisan BS. But our countries tax structure is slanted towards the top 120,000 richest families. There is not a single person here who can argue that the middle class is better than it was in the 50's and 60's. Even the 70's before the gas crisis was better than we are now. I will never understand how a tax break for a business or for someone rich is suppose to create jobs. It might create a few jobs. But if the middle class gets a tax break, suddenly they can buy shtuff, and since we're a much larger base, the rich will still make more money than they and their generations after them could spend, the government gets revenue from sales, and any tax loss from the upper class would be more than made up for in profits. Take the stupid greed out of the equation. The only way to take out greed in a free market capitalist society is to have smart safeties put into place either through legislation or employee boards (gasp! Unions!) I used to be a flag waving republican. I can't in good conscious follow the party line though. I'm far from a Democrat as well. I have to admit...I was more than impressed with Willard saying that he will label China a currency manipulator and raise tariffs on them. Raising tariffs makes it so manufacturing will come back to us. EVERY country that has a high income per family aside from oil countries have one thing in common. They still make stuff. Manufacturing is a must. Bring em back.
Obama? Really?
- Thread starter JohnnyO
- Start date
grgrcr88
No It's not green grocer!
as do the Union, depending on the candidate
Anonymous 10
Guest
Come on if you are a teamster is there a guestion???????? Romney wants our kids to sufer. Obama
Overpaid Union Thug
Well-Known Member
There is no logic in assuming his rate could be .00000000001%.
Overpaid Union Thug
Well-Known Member
Thats about as dishonest as you can get. But then again......I expect as much from the desperate.
UnconTROLLed
perfection
Would he be the only one paying little to no taxes, then? of course not. Where is the logic there?
How much did GE kick in wrt taxes?
Overpaid Union Thug
Well-Known Member
But he doesn't pay little to no taxes. He pays a percentage of his taxable income and because he made a substantial amount of money he also pays a substantial amount in taxes even though the percentage is less. It's rather easy to understand. Well, should be anyway. Can't please everyone though. The only way to make it 100% fair to everyone is to have a flat tax but that will never happen.
SteeltownBrown
Active Member
After reading all the posts in this thread I have come to one conclusion. We will never be able to solve any of the big problems facing our country if we can't even agree as to what the facts are.
As much as I'd like to see a flat tax happen I tend to agree with you. If the poor and even us as a middle class had to pay a flat 25% tax, we/they'd be pissed. That would mean no refund. Zero. After tax refunds and child tax credits and such I pay about 15-20% But that's just a payroll tax. However, if we had a flat tax and we taxed someone like Romney or Obama or Buffet...let's use Buffet as an example...in 2010 he had an AGI of 62.8 million. He had an income tax bill of just under 7 million. That's 11-ish percent. If he pays a flat tax of 25% then it would have been 15.5. This is income on money he receives, not what he has laying around. If all of us are taxed at that rate, we could have a balanced budget with all of our infrastructure taken care of AND national healthcare if we wanted it. But it won't happen. I won't even go into capital gains tax. It's at 15%...some of it 20%. That means the government lost somewhere between 3 and 10% depending on what kind of shares and dividends he gets. It's one of the reasons why I don't like CEO's getting paid in stock options.
Anonymous 10
Guest
He made the bulk of his money cutting people's throats my sending their jobs oversees. Some of these people don't bounce back from this so yea he's cutting throats. I love middle class people who think that you can relate to this guy as he can relate to you. Whatever I'm staying out of the rest of this political conversation with you I think you are irrational.
Overpaid Union Thug
Well-Known Member
And speaking of irrational....Liberalism is a mental disorder. You are all like children letting emotions dictate your decisions. Flame me all you want little child. I will still bring a huge dose of common sense and calm and collective political thought to the table and you will still be dragged through life by the leash of the union and community organizers.
Mr Blonde
Member
Both candidates serve the interests of the rich and corporations, but certainly Romney represents the most anti-worker sentiments, and supports an agenda of cutting everything for working class and poor people in this country in favor of the wealthiest a**holes.
Obama is not the answer, but he is the lesser of two evils. That said, I think our union needs to take a strong look at our priorities. I would like to see the emphasis of our resources and power focused on organizing the millions of unorganized workers in America, and strengthening our union through education and building up our ability to strike like the Chicago Teachers did to win against the anti-worker agenda in this country. You do those two things and we could start pushing for a real political movement that reflects the interests of Teamsters and working class people in America... jobs, healthcare, and education for all Americans willing to work for it... put the traitors who outsource American jobs on trial for treason, and end the pointless wars and foreign aid costing us trillions of dollars for nothing.
Obama is not the answer, but he is the lesser of two evils. That said, I think our union needs to take a strong look at our priorities. I would like to see the emphasis of our resources and power focused on organizing the millions of unorganized workers in America, and strengthening our union through education and building up our ability to strike like the Chicago Teachers did to win against the anti-worker agenda in this country. You do those two things and we could start pushing for a real political movement that reflects the interests of Teamsters and working class people in America... jobs, healthcare, and education for all Americans willing to work for it... put the traitors who outsource American jobs on trial for treason, and end the pointless wars and foreign aid costing us trillions of dollars for nothing.
Anonymous 10
Guest
See what I mean you are irrational you think I'm a liberal I'm not anything and I think you're a Whack job. I'm sitting here laughing my ass off because you are crazy. Go get them Rush Limbaugh. You should have your own show on Fox News
You need to read up on Bain Capital some more I think. All is not what it seems in politics (go figure) and Romney while maybe not the shiniest of people is not an evil person by a long shot. People forget that Obama is worth 11 mil these days. He may have struggled and scratched to get there but he wasn't middle class for very long either and we are for the most part not as poor as he was...speaking for myself mainly and most UPSers that are full time. I think neither can appreciate the middle class. People like to focus on the 15-20% of businesses that Bain let fall apart and ignore the 80-85% that are healthy growing and thriving. Bain is an investment firm not a management firm. Plus there's plenty of evidence that those companies were on their way out when they were bought. You can make an argument that Bain's loan obligations caused the companies to go bankrupt but you can make a strong argument that they would have gone bankrupt on their own much earlier than when Bain got them. Here's a really good non partisan article by factcheck.org. One of the few places that checks facts only with laws, whole conversations, and actual numbers. Great site to check up on the BS.
FactCheck.org : Lemon-Picking Bain Capital, Obama-style
FactCheck.org : Lemon-Picking Bain Capital, Obama-style
Mr Blonde
Member
Your logic is inconsistent, while I agree with your criticism that Obama is also rich and doesn't represent working class people like us. Romney is in the same boat, but he's richer and more representative of the wealthy and their politics. If that's one of your criticisms of Obama, (which I agree with), it begs the question why the hell should we support Romney?
In general though, the simple answer is that the unions are focused more on defeating Romney, who would push national right to work laws which would force hard working union members to pay and represent free loaders and thiefs, and also enjoy some favorable NLRB appointments which help workers keep their job and help us build a stronger union that can help all working class people and especially all people in our industries.
The choice is between a slow bleed, or a shotgun blast to the leg this year. Neither are good, and IMO the unions are the only group that if they got their ***** together could organize a real alternative in this country. It starts by us getting involved in our local unions, make your union strong at work, go organize more people in the community, and push for change in your community. Don't like who the union endorses? Go get involved in your screening process and make your voice heard.
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Overpaid Union Thug
Well-Known Member
Go shine the the cover of your copy of "Rules for Radicals" and your Stalin statue. Or maybe try thinking for yourself for a change instead only thinking about yourself. Maybe I could have my on show. I'd beat the crap out of your crackpot socialist networks anyway. It wouldn't be very hard. Especially if it were on the radio. I wouldn't be able to touch Rush of course but I'd smear your socialist talk radio shows pretty easily. Oh wait....there aren't still around even worth mentioning. LOL!
LOL. Funnier post by frothing-at-the-mouth post
moreluck
golden ticket member
If Romney wins, the Dems. are moving to Canada ..... Isn't that reward enough?How many minds do you think we've changed with our 20,000 political posts about the election?
Sorry More, they're moving to California and we're gonna watch y'all sink into the ocean with the next earthquake!
