Should you lose your seniority?

[mike1646]

We don't hire off the street feeder drivers

 

[East coast navy]

In our local is the same way, change classification lose center seniority.
When I went to feeders started from the bottom all over again.

What local are you in?

 

[Mugarolla]

In my building you keep your seniority for life. Off the street Feeder drivers don't like it because almost every time a Package Car driver bids into Feeders they get knocked down again.

Do they actually get knocked down or do they just not move up?

Is not the only time a package driver can bid feeders is when there is an open job?

So if there is an open job, due to retirement or discharge, and a package driver bids into it, the off the street driver does not move down one, he just doesn't move up one.

If it is a new job put in, the off the street hire still does not really get kicked down one, he still has the same number of drivers below him.

There is a big difference between getting knocked down one and not moving up one.

 

[mike1646]

What local are you in?

769

 

[East coast navy]

769

Is that south Texas?

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

Is that south Texas?

Nope.

http://www.teamsters-local769.com/

 

[BigUnionGuy]

In my building you keep your seniority for life. Off the street Feeder drivers don't like it because almost every time a Package Car driver bids into Feeders they get knocked down again.

Yep.

Most locals in the Central, are like that.

Off the top of my head.... Indy, is an exception.

Bidding from pkg to feeders, you end-tail in seniority.

Do they actually get knocked down or do they just not move up?

Is not the only time a package driver can bid feeders is when there is an open job?

So if there is an open job, due to retirement or discharge, and a package driver bids into it, the off the street driver does not move down one, he just doesn't move up one.

If it is a new job put in, the off the street hire still does not really get kicked down one, he still has the same number of drivers below him.

There is a big difference between getting knocked down one and not moving up one.

When dovetailing.... "some" can be moved down a notch.

And we all know, in feeders, seniority is everything.


It's funny, when "off-the-street" feeder drivers complain about pkg drivers

bidding in to feeders. (who have more company seniority)


They claim "they are stealing our work".

Even worse, when a laid off feeder driver bumps in to pkg.

Oh dear Lord....



-Bug-

 

[PT Car Washer]

Even worse, when a laid off feeder driver bumps in to pkg.

When has that ever happened?

 

[BigUnionGuy]

When has that ever happened?

Uh.... since forever ??

Does your local, not have a "written" seniority practice ??



-Bug-

 

[Mugarolla]

When dovetailing.... "some" can be moved down a notch.
-Bug-

This is true. But does that happen very often?

Most times it is just a package driver being trained for feeders due to an open job and the off the street hire just stays where he is. Not really kicked down a notch.

But not loved up one either. Sorry, but this is the way it should be.

A 20 year package driver going into feeders should always have more seniority than a 1 or 2 year, or whatever, driver off the street.

Like you said, it is like that for most areas in the Central, but it should be in the Master.

 

[Coldworld]

We have PT and FT seniority in our area. Don't know why it's that way in 177, but it sounds like the intent is to keep full timers within their original classification.

FT seniority always trumps PT seniority for bidding, etc. in our area except for displacement in a layoff situation. A FT'er with less "company seniority" cannot bump a PT'er from their job in a layoff situation.

In my opinion, we should just have one seniority date.. but I'm not going to hold my breath.

Is this something that could be changed at the national level to blanket the whole company or wound it have to be changed local by local??

 

[PiedmontSteward]

Is this something that could be changed at the national level to blanket the whole company or wound it have to be changed local by local??

It could always be proposed as national contract language, but seniority in the NMA mostly deals with "maintenance of seniority," ie. over long term disability or a leave of absense.

Seniority practices are part of "local autonomy" and each area does things differently; they'd have to be changed on the supplement/rider level.

 

[Coldworld]

That would really hurt the outside full-time driver hire as the part-time inside hires advance to full-time and surpass them in seniority. I would have loved this when I finally got called up.

Who cares about an outside hire...afaic a part timer who has waited 10 years for a shot to drive and gets passed up by a off the street..I understand a street rat is just taking advantage of the contract but the ratio should be 10 to 1 and it should have been that for the last 50 years... And I don't care if "you don't need to know how to load em' to deliver em'" so don't even try it... You know who you are!!

 

[Coldworld]

It could always be proposed as national contract language, but seniority in the NMA mostly deals with "maintenance of seniority," ie. over long term disability or a leave of absense.

Seniority practices are part of "local autonomy" and each area does things differently; they'd have to be changed on the supplement/rider level.

I understand the pt and ft but if I go into feeders I should be able to keep my years for bidding on vacations and runs... No way in hell a 25 year driver goes into feeder and should have January vacation... That is BS

 

[Jones]

Classification seniority for full time is so clearly wrong, I figure the only way it happens is when a bunch of feeder drivers get on the E board and put that language in to protect their little buddies.

 

[Coldworld]

In my building you keep your seniority for life. Off the street Feeder drivers don't like it because almost every time a Package Car driver bids into Feeders they get knocked down again.

Yep... That's the way it should be... And they shouldn't be hiring feeder off the street unless they can't get any ft or pt people to sign up

 

[Mugarolla]

Classification seniority for full time is so clearly wrong, I figure the only way it happens is when a bunch of feeder drivers get on the E board and put that language in to protect their little buddies.

That is exactly what it is.

There should be one seniority date for employees. The day they were hired. Let that take you where it takes you.

This is the only thing we have at UPS, seniority. Let us use it.

 

[BigUnionGuy]

Classification seniority for full time is so clearly wrong, I figure the only way it happens is when a bunch of feeder drivers get on the E board and put that language in to protect their little buddies.

That is exactly what it is.

Don't be so quick to judge, without knowing the history behind it.

There should be one seniority date for employees. The day they were hired. Let that take you where it takes you.

Seniority wise, "carte blanche" is a sticky subject.

Comparing PT versus FT.... ?



-Bug-

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

Who cares about an outside hire...afaic a part timer who has waited 10 years for a shot to drive and gets passed up by a off the street..I understand a street rat is just taking advantage of the contract but the ratio should be 10 to 1 and it should have been that for the last 50 years... And I don't care if "you don't need to know how to load em' to deliver em'" so don't even try it... You know who you are!!

Do you really think that someone applying for a driver's position off the street has any clue or concern about what is in the contract? They are simply trying to provide for their families.

When I was hired in 1989 the ratio was 3-1. This was a period of growth and there were 3 of us hired at the same time. Two of us became FT drivers. I am the only one of the 3 still here.

You can call me a "street rat" all you want. I couldn't care less. I had a young family to provide for and did what I needed to do. I would have preferred to use my degree but numerous resumes were sent out with little to no response.

You state that the ratio should be 10-1 but fail to mention that numerous centers are having problems filling vacancies from within as PTers don't want to drive.

 

[Mugarolla]

Don't be so quick to judge, without knowing the history behind it.





Seniority wise, "carte blanche" is a sticky subject.

Comparing PT versus FT.... ?



-Bug-

I know the history behind it. I still do not agree that UPS is split between PT and FT employees.

You are hired by a company. That should be your seniority date.

It is a sticky subject with opinions on both sides. This is just my opinion.

If I recall, UPS had to terminate me as a PTer, and then rehire me as a FTer when I went into driving. Their system was set up for two classes of employees, PT and FT.