Anonymous 10
Guest
Your manager is promoting dishonest behavior call the 1-800# and drop a dime its called fudging numbers.
10 minutes "inside building" the rest is on road no matter what...
- Thread starter Just_another_day_at_work
- Start date
I agree with what you are saying but if you are using a pay phone it will cost a quarter.
Better yet, get your union local involved on Monday!
Anonymous 10
Guest
True that should go with out saying always keep your steward informed.
danlin
Well-Known Member
Another reason it is there is for satellite centers. We have a 45 to hour sort and load.
UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)
Well-Known Member
One point that I did not see is late air caused by the delay in leaving the bldg. If you show your left building time as 10 minutes after your start time but you didn't actually leave until 25 minutes after start time and have late air this could come back to bite you as they will then ask why it took you so long to get to your first stop and why did you end up with late air.
On the days when the preload is not wrapped I will put the time I spend closing out the PC under sort/load. I know that it gets charged against the preload but why should it be up to the driver to "make it up on the road"? Get the trucks wrapped on time and it won't be an issue.
Bubblehead
My Senior Picture
Recording it this way will reduce your overallowed but will have no affect on you AM time.
Your AM time is the time from between when you punch in and you leave the building.
Any coded time may make it explainable, but the number doesn't change by virtue of these codes.
My AM time is circled every day on the operation report.
I don't go near my truck till after the PCM.
90% of the drivers are wrapped up and ready to go as soon as the PCM ends.
That's when I go to my truck and do everything they did for free.
Soon I'm the only one left on line.
It's almost comical watching the steam come out of their ears.
Lately, due to road salt from winter weather and the consistant neglect of the car wash, I routinely round up window washing equipment and wash all my windows.
All in the name of safety.
This really burns their ass, but what can they say?
I use the DIAD as tool to accurately represent the tasks of my day.
I will falsefy nothing whether they instruct me to or not.
Believe me, if you call their bluff, they will fold.
dannyboy
From the promised LAND
unless they put it in writing, they are instructing you to falsify your time stamp on the diad.
after sitting through a lot of hearings, i began to understand how some of the little things can become unbelievably huge in the arbitrators mind. being verbally instructed to alter your time stamp on the diad will not hold up, should you be questioned about your time.
late air, injuries on the job, accidents are all things that are very detailed in their descriptions. and the first thing they do is look at the time line. when something is not right, that throws the driver under suspicion for being dishonest. you dont want or need that hassle.
if they want you to punch off the preload within 10 minutes, then be moving away from the building when you hit left building, regardless of what is left.
remember, there is a reason they dont put this in writing to the drivers.
just dont do it.
d
after sitting through a lot of hearings, i began to understand how some of the little things can become unbelievably huge in the arbitrators mind. being verbally instructed to alter your time stamp on the diad will not hold up, should you be questioned about your time.
late air, injuries on the job, accidents are all things that are very detailed in their descriptions. and the first thing they do is look at the time line. when something is not right, that throws the driver under suspicion for being dishonest. you dont want or need that hassle.
if they want you to punch off the preload within 10 minutes, then be moving away from the building when you hit left building, regardless of what is left.
remember, there is a reason they dont put this in writing to the drivers.
just dont do it.
d
soberups
Pees in the brown Koolaid
Ask your supervisor what would happen to you if you scanned a Next Day air pkg 5 or 10 minutes before you actually delivered it in order to keep it from showing as late on "the report".
You would be fired for dishonesty. Why should your management be allowed to break the same rules?
Tell them you are going to enter your actual left building time from now on, and if they dont like it they are certainly free to edit your time card in order to generate whatever make-believe number they want to look at. They wont do this, of course, because editing a timecard creates a paper trail that exposes their dishonesty. They would much rather have you be the dishonest one and do their dirty work for them.
tracker2762
Well-Known Member
When our sort is not complete they extend PCM, we're instructed to code as "other work saftey meeting." Just doing what I'm told
dannyboy
From the promised LAND
again, work as instructed while in the pcm, but dont be dishonest in your classification of work.
if they insist, tell them to put in in writing, because you feel uncomfortable following instructions you think to be dishonest.
bet all my time at ups, they wont.
they can and will fire you and make it stick if you are dishonest with information entered into your diad. and when your feet are held to the fire of getting fired, i will guarantee you they wont say they instructed you to be dishonest, and the majority of drivers wont have your back either.
just my experience at big brown.
d
soberups
Pees in the brown Koolaid
Your "left building time" is the time that your vehicle drives thru the gate or off of the property. It is what it is, and to enter anything other than the exact time that the event occured is an act of dishonesty.
The company certainly has the right to require you to code time for various work functions, and to define the manner in which that coding takes place. If you help the preloader wrap up your truck...or are delayed in some other manner....the company has every right to instruct you to code that time out.
What the company cannot do...is to instruct you to falsify a timecard by saying you "left the building" at any time other than when it actually happened.
If they need to be spoon-fed some make believe number, they are free to edit your timecard themselves.
The company certainly has the right to require you to code time for various work functions, and to define the manner in which that coding takes place. If you help the preloader wrap up your truck...or are delayed in some other manner....the company has every right to instruct you to code that time out.
What the company cannot do...is to instruct you to falsify a timecard by saying you "left the building" at any time other than when it actually happened.
If they need to be spoon-fed some make believe number, they are free to edit your timecard themselves.
No, No, No!!!! You tell your sup that by putting in the 10 minutes you are falsifying records. But if he tells you to do it make note of it for that day that you were instructed to do so. Your am time ends when you leave the property line! I was told this by a time study person. Same with pm time it's when you hit the property line. Also if you take your last break back at the building as some do, you put it in exactly when you take it. Not before you get back to building. This is just another way for them to make numbers look good. They want your time to be on road. Thats where they come up with your sphor number. You know the one that they are forceing down our throats for performance!!!!!
browned out
Well-Known Member
Spot on. Who cares about the time getting charge to the preload sup. Just do whatever you can to stick to your morals and what they percieve to be theirs; document it, film it; and you will be fine.
dannyboy
From the promised LAND
so you are saying that if a sup tells you to steal, and you document it, film it, you will be fine?
i disagree.
first off, you wont get a sup to let you film a thing. it is also against company policy to film anything on ups property.
so in reality, filming something is not viable in the real world.
and just because they tell you to do something you know to be dishonest does not absolve you from the punishment.
so with your documentation, there will be two looking for a job, not just one.
when they haul you into the office for failure to follow, ask them to be specific about the instructions, and have the shop steward include those instructions in the grievance.
like they will ever repeat it in front of the steward..........
cya, never do dishonest things at work. it can and will be used against you later on.
example. your start time is 8:30, and they tell you to punch out at 8:40. you normally get to your first stop 20 minutes after you actually leave the building.
today, because of what ever reason of the month, your load is not ready until 9:20. but as instructed verbally, you put down you left at 8:40 instead of 9:20. you get to your first stop at 9:40, and bust ass getting done.
a month later, lp walks up to you and asks you why you are stealing time. you show almost an hour on what should have taken you 20 minutes to drive.
now, your behind is in a tough spot. and i am sure you will quickly spout off that you were told to punch out at 8:40, which the sup will refute.
unless there are a lot of other drivers willing to put their necks on the line (thats if they even find out about it) and come to your defense, your days at ups are over. and with a discharge for dishonesty, you dont draw unemployment etc.
ive seen this happen more than once. and while in our center there was no one permenently fired, several drivers have had suspensions and gone through the trauma of being told they are fired and have to fight to get their jobs back.
is that really what you want?
d
The preloads supes used to complain and try to get in my face when I had 20 minutes or more in my A.M. time. I got right back in their face and told them "then get my truck wrapped up on time!" If my supe or manager complained about it, I told them to come and watch me wrap up and tell me if I am doing anything wrong. In any case, don't put the wrong time in your diad. When they got on one of their excessive A.M. kicks, they often had a supe at the gate writing down times that the trucks went through the gate so that they could fire guys for dishonesty.
Just_another_day_at_work
Well-Known Member
Thank you for the responses.
So far talked to Billy and the LP guy. Explained the situation. He said he is going to look into it, but until then work as directed and document my "left building" time. As far as video recording and stuff, I don't have a crew with me to do that
and I don't think it's a proper response in this case. Today we had an over 5 min PCM, I will look at the ops what are the in building times for the others (just curiosity). I will update later.
So far talked to Billy and the LP guy. Explained the situation. He said he is going to look into it, but until then work as directed and document my "left building" time. As far as video recording and stuff, I don't have a crew with me to do that
and I don't think it's a proper response in this case. Today we had an over 5 min PCM, I will look at the ops what are the in building times for the others (just curiosity). I will update later.Dustyroads
Well-Known Member
When we do loading, for example, when air is late, we enter the time in the inside building screen under sort and load. One can punch the time button to get the exact time one begins and ends loading. Then, you don't actually get full credit for your load time, as in bonus centers, however, you do get an allowance equal to what the effectiveness of the preload was that day. For example, if the preload was only 92% effective that day, or ran "overallowed", a driver doing loading would be given an allowance of 92% of the time they actually took, the remaining 8% would simply be over allowed. Anyway, that's the way we are instructed to show sort and load, and how it's been explained by our management team with regard to the allowance for it.
