10 step pay raises

[Oldfart]

This is all true.

The 401k was really designed for individuals with much higher than normal incomes. I think Kodak lobbied the government to give the income of two highly paid execs this special tax consideration and not be taxed. That's why its called the 401k because that's how its designated in the tax code.

The median American worker earns $28,000-$29,000. It is going to be nearly impossible for most workers to take money out of that in large enough amounts over many years to save a substantial amount of retirement money and the actual reality of 401k's bares this out. They don't work for most workers.

LOL. The K has nothing to do with Kodak. It is just the next letter in the alphabet. Actually Johnson and Johnson was the first company to implement the 401k

 

[59 Dano]

There's plenty of that. But don't tell me the company doesn't put heavy pressure on them to perform. Whenever directors come by I've seen mgrs hang on their every word like they're God. And seen mgrs turn from groveling sycophants to angry psychos just as soon as the director left.

What reaction would you expect if you're a lousy manager and have just been read the riot act? I don't know what kind of pressure you think they're under, but what they're expected to do is more than reasonable in most cases.

 

[59 Dano]

There you go Dano. You and Smith can bang your head on the keyboard. Smith said they are still promising new hires 6-10% raises

OK, aside from one person, no one is saying....

 

[vantexan]

What reaction would you expect if you're a lousy manager and have just been read the riot act? I don't know what kind of pressure you think they're under, but what they're expected to do is more than reasonable in most cases.

I've seen both seniors and ops mgrs fired. I've seen how stressed many of them are. I've seen snarling directors, Sr mgrs, and ops mgrs. Might be more polite where you at, but over the years I've seen enough to turn down going into management, which didn't go over well with the seniors offering it.

 

[Oldfart]

I've seen both seniors and ops mgrs fired. I've seen how stressed many of them are. I've seen snarling directors, Sr mgrs, and ops mgrs. Might be more polite where you at, but over the years I've seen enough to turn down going into management, which didn't go over well with the seniors offering it.

THANK YOU!!!

 

[Oldfart]

OK, aside from one person, no one is saying....

LOL Did you get a headache from banging your head on the keyboard? Looks like I was correct after all. And you made fun of me for being correct. Bummer

 

[!Retired!]

LOL. The K has nothing to do with Kodak. It is just the next letter in the alphabet. Actually Johnson and Johnson was the first company to implement the 401k

Johnson and Johnson no longer offers pensions to new hires. In fact, only 99 of the Fortune 500 companies offer pensions. So bitch and moan all you want about how crappy our pension is.....at least we get one.

 

[Oldfart]

Johnson and Johnson no longer offers pensions to new hires. In fact, only 99 of the Fortune 500 companies offer pensions. So bitch and moan all you want about how crappy our pension is.....at least we get one.

I am extremely satisfied with my pension situation. Its the miserables and misinformed like Tex that hates our pension, hates our company and hates his life.

 

[vantexan]

I am extremely satisfied with my pension situation. Its the miserables and misinformed like Tex that hates our pension, hates our company and hates his life.

I'm not you, therefore I'm quite content where I'm at. Just not going to let the company off the hook for what they did. Which gets to you. Bonus!

 

[SmithBarney]

There you go Dano. You and Smith can bang your head on the keyboard. Smith said they are still promising new hires 6-10% raises

Yes and current steps are 6-10% moldfart

 

[refineryworker05]

Lack of a match? We get 3.5% to our 6%. A 401k should not run out of money if it is invested properly. Like my example. If you take 4% yearly and draw a conservative 4 or 5%, you are basically pulling interest only from the account. You seem to forget the account will still be invested and growing while you are drawing from it.

Lack of choices? We have plenty of choices with. Vanguard and they have an excellent track record.

I have never heard anyone say a 401k is a poor option for retirement, other than you.

While a pension is a great tool because it was provided by the employer at no cost, I know very few people who are able to comfortably retire with a pension alone. In many instances, the 401k is the backbone on the retirement process. If you want to live on 50% of your working income when you retire, depend solely on your pension. If you want to totally replace your working income in retirement, you are gonna need a good 401k in place.

First of pensions and 401k's are based on the employer promising to pay a part of your compensation into a retirement account just for you the worker. Pensions are not free they aren't gifts, they are the employees money their income which is being set aside and used for their retirement

You really don't know much about 401k's. The man who first suggested that 401k's would work for most workers has been heavily criticizing the industry over the design of the 401k and the fees they charge.

Here are some links to reality.

Bogle: The Problems With 401(k)s

John C Bogle who founded Vanguard:

Now the problem with 401(k)s are a couple. The big one for me is, it's a thrift plan that we've tried to redesign into a retirement plan. It was never created, the 401(k), to be a retirement plan. So you have all kinds of things that you would not put in a retirement plan, like the ability to take out money when you want to by borrowing, and the ability to make capital withdrawals under certain reasonably extreme circumstances. The ability to take all your money when you move from one job to another, as so many people in America do today. And all that flexibility and letting you have access to your accumulated capital is a terrible way to build up a lifetime retirement plan.

John Bogle: The "Train Wreck" Awaiting American Retirement

John C Bogle who founded Vanguard:

I start off, simply put, with Social Security, which has to be changed in gradual, small ways to become solvent again. … Then you go to corporate defined benefit plans. They are assuming — and state and local government defined benefit plans even worse — they are all assuming that the market return in their portfolio will be 8 percent a year.

There is no way under the sun that they’re going to earn 8 percent. It’s just impossible. No matter what they do, they’re stuck in a bind given the kind of markets we expect in stocks and bonds. … The best they can really hope for is a 5 percent return unless some wonderful, attractive scenario for the future unfolds, which is really unimaginable. If anything, it’s going to be worse.

So if you think about them compounding their returns at 4 percent instead of the 8 percent that they build into the plan, they’re going to have to start putting a lot of money into those plans. They’re going to be bankrupt.

 

[refineryworker05]

Lack of a match? We get 3.5% to our 6%. A 401k should not run out of money if it is invested properly. Like my example. If you take 4% yearly and draw a conservative 4 or 5%, you are basically pulling interest only from the account. You seem to forget the account will still be invested and growing while you are drawing from it.

Lack of choices? We have plenty of choices with. Vanguard and they have an excellent track record.

I have never heard anyone say a 401k is a poor option for retirement, other than you.

While a pension is a great tool because it was provided by the employer at no cost, I know very few people who are able to comfortably retire with a pension alone. In many instances, the 401k is the backbone on the retirement process. If you want to live on 50% of your working income when you retire, depend solely on your pension. If you want to totally replace your working income in retirement, you are gonna need a good 401k in place.

When you post that no one thinks 401k is a poor option for retirement. It means you don't know what you are talking about. You haven't actually researched the 401k.

So my question becomes why defend something you don't know anything about?

Why defend this abstract thing "the 401k" which was created as a way for Kodak to hide the income of two highly paid execs in the tax code over pensions?

Why suggest it is great for retirement without actually bothering to research that claim?

Anyway Here are more links to reality:

Why 401(k)s Have Failed

Unfortunately, while Frontlne's Martin Smith and his many great guests focused on costs (too high), poor guidance and employer neglect, the larger point is that employers don't have to provide 401(k)s at all -- and probably shouldn't.

The 401(k) plan was never meant to be a mainstream pension plan and is a poor substitute for one. It's a voluntary program that was intended to supplement retirement savings -- one of those quirky little options in the byzantine tax code that employers seized upon as a way to save money while pretending that they were doing the right thing by their employees.


The Retirement Revolution That Failed: Why the 401(k) Isn’t Working


Nearly half of all working-age families have no money in retirement accounts at all. The median family has $5,000 saved. Even for people between the ages of 56 and 61, the median retirement account savings is a paltry $17,000. While the top 10 percent have at least $274,000 saved, the bottom 50 percent have next to nothing. “We are moving toward a retirement system that magnifies inequality instead of just reflecting it,” Morrissey said on a conference call Thursday.

This was not always the case. Pensions used to be far more egalitarian, held by people of modest incomes as much as the wealthy. Pensions were even held relatively equally by white and black populations. (Hispanics, Morrissey points out, always lagged behind.)

Is the 401(k) experiment a failure?


You need to know this number: $18,433.

That's the median amount in a 401(k) savings account, according to a recent report by the Employee Benefit Research Institute. Almost 40 percent of employees have less than $10,000, even as the proportion of companies offering alternatives like defined benefit pensions continues to drop.

Older workers do tend to have more savings. At Vanguard, for example, the median for savers aged 55 to 64 in 2013 was $76,381. But even at that level, millions of workers nearing retirement are on track to leavethe workforce with savings that do not even approach what they will need for health care, let alone daily living. Not surprisingly, retirement is now Americans' top financial worry, according to a recent Gallup poll.

 

[Oldfart]

Yes and current steps are 6-10% moldfart

Then why did you make the claim that managers were still making promises there were 6-10% raises like it was a lie? I never put pen to paper but you made the claim they were lying to new hires.

 

[Operational needs]

Then why did you make the claim that managers were still making promises there were 6-10% raises like it was a lie? I never put pen to paper but you made the claim they were lying to new hires.

 

[dezguy]

I am extremely satisfied with my pension situation. Its the miserables and misinformed like Tex that hates our pension, hates our company and hates his life.

Ummmm... Maybe it's just me, misreading what Van posts but to me, it seems like Van is very satisfied with life. He's retired, living his dream while the rest of us have to go to work every day.

Yet another troll post with nothing of merit, coming from oldfart.

 

[59 Dano]

I've seen both seniors and ops mgrs fired. I've seen how stressed many of them are. I've seen snarling directors, Sr mgrs, and ops mgrs. Might be more polite where you at, but over the years I've seen enough to turn down going into management, which didn't go over well with the seniors offering it.

Are we talking about how nice people are or what they expect from their underlings? One has nothing to do with the other.

 

[59 Dano]

LOL Did you get a headache from banging your head on the keyboard? Looks like I was correct after all. And you made fun of me for being correct. Bummer

Oh yeah, really zonked me. I said no one does something and you found one person who does. Like, TOTALLY pwned me and EVERYTHING.

 

[vantexan]

Are we talking about how nice people are or what they expect from their underlings? One has nothing to do with the other.

You told me that the demands put on managers are very reasonable. I'll agree that there are plenty in management who shouldn't be. I've seen too many that are users, abusers, only thinking of themselves and what we can do for them. That's why IMO if you run into one that does seem concerned about his employees, works as hard or harder than everyone else to keep things moving, tries to make a pleasant environment for everyone, you should stick with that one and reward him every SFA. And doing all that is tough given the demands and pressures they're under. I don't expect the workplace to be utopia. But I've seen too many abusive SOB's. And yes I've seen very unreasonable demands put on mgrs by their bosses. A director wanting another district in Florida demanding his mgrs have zero overtime in areas where OT is inevitable. Trying to keep their job caused them to do things that cheated both customers and employees. That was the worst case I dealt with but there are others.

 

[Oldfart]

Ummmm... Maybe it's just me, misreading what Van posts but to me, it seems like Van is very satisfied with life. He's retired, living his dream while the rest of us have to go to work every day.

Yet another troll post with nothing of merit, coming from oldfart.

The guy cries about stuff that happened in 1991, 1995,1999, on and on. How can anyone that holds a grudge after all these years be happy. I don't believe he would be happy no matter what the circumstances are. Some people are just mad at the world and never happy. Like tex

 

[Oldfart]

When you post that no one thinks 401k is a poor option for retirement. It means you don't know what you are talking about. You haven't actually researched the 401k.

So my question becomes why defend something you don't know anything about?

Why defend this abstract thing "the 401k" which was created as a way for Kodak to hide the income of two highly paid execs in the tax code over pensions?

Why suggest it is great for retirement without actually bothering to research that claim?

Anyway Here are more links to reality:

Why 401(k)s Have Failed

Unfortunately, while Frontlne's Martin Smith and his many great guests focused on costs (too high), poor guidance and employer neglect, the larger point is that employers don't have to provide 401(k)s at all -- and probably shouldn't.

The 401(k) plan was never meant to be a mainstream pension plan and is a poor substitute for one. It's a voluntary program that was intended to supplement retirement savings -- one of those quirky little options in the byzantine tax code that employers seized upon as a way to save money while pretending that they were doing the right thing by their employees.


The Retirement Revolution That Failed: Why the 401(k) Isn’t Working


Nearly half of all working-age families have no money in retirement accounts at all. The median family has $5,000 saved. Even for people between the ages of 56 and 61, the median retirement account savings is a paltry $17,000. While the top 10 percent have at least $274,000 saved, the bottom 50 percent have next to nothing. “We are moving toward a retirement system that magnifies inequality instead of just reflecting it,” Morrissey said on a conference call Thursday.

This was not always the case. Pensions used to be far more egalitarian, held by people of modest incomes as much as the wealthy. Pensions were even held relatively equally by white and black populations. (Hispanics, Morrissey points out, always lagged behind.)

Is the 401(k) experiment a failure?


You need to know this number: $18,433.

That's the median amount in a 401(k) savings account, according to a recent report by the Employee Benefit Research Institute. Almost 40 percent of employees have less than $10,000, even as the proportion of companies offering alternatives like defined benefit pensions continues to drop.

Older workers do tend to have more savings. At Vanguard, for example, the median for savers aged 55 to 64 in 2013 was $76,381. But even at that level, millions of workers nearing retirement are on track to leavethe workforce with savings that do not even approach what they will need for health care, let alone daily living. Not surprisingly, retirement is now Americans' top financial worry, according to a recent Gallup poll.

The 401k only works if you use it. If you don't invest, you won't have any retirement. Your example about people having nothing in a 401k because they don't invest reminds me of people that don't receive Social Security when they retire because their government job opted out of SS. Their pension is about 55 or 60% of their working income and they complain they can't live on that. Why didn't they invest the 6% the rest of us have to put into SS each month and they would be sitting on plenty to retire with.

I am not as smart as Tex but I know the 401k works for those that are smart enough to use it. You start when you are young, invest a little at a time and get a company match of up to 55% of your contribution. You stay with it, getting 10 to 15% returns plus saving 12 to 15% on your taxable income come tax season. 30 to 40 years later, you are sitting on a nice nest egg come retirement.

If you just save $100 a month between your contribution and the company match for your entire work career and get a very conservative 8% return, you will be sitting on close to 300k come retirement. That would be about $20 from your weekly check and $5 company match. People that complain they can't save $20 a week are the same people drinking Starbucks 5 days a week, driving new cars with huge car notes and watching every possible premium channel on their TV at home while they have the latest and newest I-Phone every time they come out. Most Fedex employees can save money, they just have their priorities in the wrong place.