Christianity

[El Correcto]

@Integrity
Christ sacrifice represents subjective morality being okay with god. The right to grow apart from God’s morality. Grace alone god will love you no matter what as long as you have faith in him, as laid out in the Bible.
That belief doesn’t hurt anything, but people take that Bible nonsense way too far and it does start hurting people in the name of god.

 

[Thebrownblob]

@Integrity
Christ sacrifice represents subjective morality being okay with god. The right to grow apart from God’s morality. Grace alone god will love you no matter what as long as you have faith in him, as laid out in the Bible.
That belief doesn’t hurt anything, but people take that Bible nonsense way too far and it does start hurting people in the name of god.

Ok and all extremism ends up hurting people. Shouldn’t happen. But people think they are god. Or believe they are justified.

 

[El Correcto]

I would say religion gets in trouble when it pretends to be the source of morality, not just when it claims to be the understanding of reality.

 

[Thebrownblob]

I would say religion gets in trouble when it pretends to be the source of morality, not just when it claims to be the understanding of reality.

Well, I would say to you, the only basis of morality I have is in the next life. If you don’t believe in the next life, then I’m not here to tell you what to do.

 

[El Correcto]

Ok and all extremism ends up hurting people. Shouldn’t happen. But people think they are god. Or believe they are justified.

There are people on this site that believe in the Adam and Eve creationist myth. There are people on this site who by extension of that believe it is okay to execute gay people for being gay.

If you go so deep into the Bible as the literal truth of reality and god’s word you are willing to deny 400 year+ of scientific discovery and human advancement in favor of a creationist myth, there is no doubt in my head you are a unhinged individual who would excuse the execution of gays by the government.

 

[El Correcto]

Well, I would say to you, the only basis of morality I have is in the next life. If you don’t believe in the next life, then I’m not here to tell you what to do.

Oh but I do, and I’ll be there to teach you about my morality.

 

[Thebrownblob]

There are people on this site that believe in the Adam and Eve creationist myth. There are people on this site who by extension of that believe it is okay to execute gay people for being gay.

If you go so deep into the Bible as the literal truth of reality and god’s word you are willing to deny 400 year+ of scientific discovery and human advancement in favor of a creationist myth, there is a doubt in my head you are a unhinged individual who would excuse the execution of gays by the government.

Lol I believe in Adam and Eve. Why would that make someone want to execute anyone?
And if that’s even true ignore them.

 

[El Correcto]

Lol I believe in Adam and Eve. Why would that make someone want to execute anyone?
And if that’s even true ignore them.

Because Adam and Eve is an extension of the literal truth of the Bible. God literally believes it is okay to execute homosexuals for their sin.

If you don’t believe it is righteous for gays to be murdered you do not believe in the Bible as the objective truth of the creator of the universe. His word in there you just choose to look away when it is convenient to you.

 

[Thebrownblob]

Because Adam and Eve is an extension of the literal truth of the Bible. God literally believes it is okay to execute homosexuals for their sin.

If you don’t believe it is righteous for gays to be murdered you do not believe in the Bible as the objective truth of the creator of the universe. His word in there you just choose to look away when it is convenient to you.

But that you twisted view, what about liars? What about thieves? What about disrespectful to the parents? Those people get death as well. But of course it’s a Death of damnation. Not of murdering you. When you choose, sin you murder your self. The ultimate hell would be separation from the father. If you’re a Christian. You’re not, so why are you worried about it?

 

[El Correcto]

But that you twisted view, what about liars? What about thieves? What about disrespectful to the parents? Those people get death as well. But of course it’s a Death of damnation. Not of murdering you. When you choose, sin you murder your self. The ultimate hell would be separation from the father. If you’re a Christian. You’re not, so why are you worried about it?

No they literally executed those people. Go look up Jewish stonings during that time period. They would throw you off a ledge and then drop a boulder on you. If you were still alive they would have people stone you to death with rocks.

Nope, Grace alone not through works. The problem is when people interpret the Bible as the literally pinnacle of morality and understanding.
Your morality would then include the execution of homosexuals for being gay as commanded by god in the Bible and your understanding would be counter to everything science has discovered about reality in the last 400+ years.

 

[Thebrownblob]

No they literally executed those people. Go look up Jewish stonings during that time period. They would throw you off a ledge and then drop a boulder on you. If you were still alive they would have people stone you to death with rocks.

Nope, Grace alone not through works. The problem is when people interpret the Bible as the literally pinnacle of morality and understanding.
Your morality would then include the execution of homosexuals for being gay as commanded by god in the Bible.

Good grief you’re going way back. I thought you’re talking about now, they stoned folks for a lot of reasons. Who cares?

 

[El Correcto]

Good grief you’re going way back. I thought you’re talking about now, they stoned folks for a lot of reasons. Who cares?

You cherry pick the Bible but that is god’s word found in Leviticus 20:13 and Romans 1 26-32.
That is the objective morality of this reality when laid out by the divine creator and was enacted through his believers in law for thousand+ years to this very day.

 

[vantexan]

You cherry pick the Bible but that is god’s word found in Leviticus 20:13 and Romans 1 26-32.
That is the objective morality of this reality when laid out by the divine creator and was enacted through his believers in law for thousand+ years to this very day.

The old law was done away with. We are under the New Testament and nowhere are we told to kill homosexuals. I know you want to characterize it that way but it isn't so. Just because someone is worthy of death doesn't mean we are to kill them. It means no matter what they've done they can turn to Christ and be forgiven. Read all the New Testament, don't do as you say others do and cherry pick.

 

[El Correcto]

The old law was done away with. We are under the New Testament and nowhere are we told to kill homosexuals. I know you want to characterize it that way but it isn't so. Just because someone is worthy of death doesn't mean we are to kill them. It means no matter what they've done they can turn to Christ and be forgiven. Read all the New Testament, don't do as you say others do and cherry pick.

Romans1 26-32 righteous decree and deserving of death.

 

[vantexan]

Romans1 26-32 righteous decree and deserving of death.

Where do you see Christians in the U.S. grabbing anyone doing any of the sins listed there and killing them? You brought up Uganda. They have a terrible problem with AIDS and are overreacting to it. They aren't right to do so. You're taking something out of context and being just as fundamentalist about it as you say others are.

 

[El Correcto]

Where do you see Christians in the U.S. grabbing anyone doing any of the sins listed there and killing them? You brought up Uganda. They have a terrible problem with AIDS and are overreacting to it. They aren't right to do so. You're taking something out of context and being just as fundamentalist about it as you say others are.

I never said I did. You are trying to deflect away from the conversation about objective morality and god’s law.
Objective morality is a moral fact outside of human beings, our morality is a very subjective one, god’s isn’t.
God’s morality or objectively good morality is exactly what they want to do to homosexuals in Uganda. That is Leviticus 20:13 and Romans 1 26-32. It is objectively good morality to kill those gay men.

You don’t believe in the objective morality as laid out by the Bible if you are trying to deflect away from the state sponsored execution of gays and not actively supporting it. You should be celebrating god’s objective morality being inflicted on your fellow man if that is where your morality truly comes from.

 

[vantexan]

I never said I did. You are trying to deflect away from the conversation about objective morality and god’s law.
Objective morality is a moral fact outside of human beings, our morality is a very subjective one, god’s isn’t.
God’s morality or objectively good morality is exactly what they want to do to homosexuals in Uganda. That is Leviticus 20:13 and Romans 1 26-32. It is objectively good morality to kill those gay men.

You don’t believe in the objective morality as laid out by the Bible if you are trying to deflect away from the state sponsored execution of gays and not actively supporting it. You should be celebrating god’s objective morality being inflicted on your fellow man if that is where your morality truly comes from.

No, I read the New Testament in its entirety and know what God wants for us today. You hone in on some verses and misinterpret their meaning in the New Testament. And we are no longer under the Old Testament. Sorry, you want it to be so to condemn Christianity but it isn't.

 

[El Correcto]

No, I read the New Testament in its entirety and know what God wants for us today. You hone in on some verses and misinterpret their meaning in the New Testament. And we are no longer under the Old Testament. Sorry, you want it to be so to condemn Christianity but it isn't.

Oh so you know more about Christianity than Paul the Apostle now? You know more than a man that was blinded by Jesus and had a divine revelation? Yes you are given freedom by the grace of Jesus’s sacrifice on behalf of all of us. But that doesn’t change what is objectively good in the eyes of god. God will forgive you for not being objectively good, but that doesn’t change that it is objectively good to murder homosexuals for being gay.

You should be celebrating that god’s objective goodness is being enacted by law.

 

[El Correcto]

If something is objectively good as laid out by a creator why do you fight its divine wisdom so much and argue that it isn’t true. It’s written for you to see, Leviticus 20:13 and Romans 1 26-32.
It is objectively good to execute the sinners.

Most of your objective morality comes directly from Jewish apostles with an exception or two thrown in there for gentiles. Saul the persecutor was a very Jewish individual, well versed in Jewish law and Jewish tradition. He was Pharisee among Pharisees, a Jewish nationalist, a Hebrew among Hellenistic Jews.
Yet @vantexan wants to pretend there is no such thing as objectively good morality in the New Testament and wants to challenge his wisdom.

 

[El Correcto]

Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God.2 Consequently, whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. 3 For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and you will be commended.4 For the one in authority is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God’s servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer. 5 Therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also as a matter of conscience.
6 This is also why you pay taxes, for the authorities are God’s servants, who give their full time to governing. 7 Give to everyone what you owe them: If you owe taxes, pay taxes; if revenue, then revenue; if respect, then respect; if honor, then honor.

Bible Gateway passage: Romans 13 - New International Version

Submission to Governing Authorities - Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. Consequently, whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God...

www.biblegateway.com

The government is the divine extension of god in Christian eyes. They would have absolutely no problem with god’s wrath being carried out on sinners or living under a theocracy.