Drivers who pass away shortly after retirement

[ITwannabe]

Could it be that they (corporate) have increased the workload to the point where they know that this is no longer a 30 year job?

Could be I guess that's why they are going to a two tier wage system. Figuring they can get people to work a few years and then quit. But is it for health? Or to save on their pension payments? More than likely to save from paying the massive pensions

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

Could be I guess that's why they are going to a two tier wage system. Figuring they can get people to work a few years and then quit. But is it for health? Or to save on their pension payments? More than likely to save from paying the massive pensions

I wouldn't call their pensions "massive"----$3,500/month is a decent amount.

I think you will a shift away from pensions in favor of 401k's for new hires. The 401k's are portable and allow the employee to take them with them when they leave to find work elsewhere.

 

[ITwannabe]

I wouldn't call their pensions "massive"----$3,500/month is a decent amount.

I think you will a shift away from pensions in favor of 401k's for new hires. The 401k's are portable and allow the employee to take them with them when they leave to find work elsewhere.

60k a year is a lot to pay for a pension. They can't even pay them now lol

But it much rather have a 401k and match than a pension. I don't feel very confident with who is managing my pension

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

60k a year is a lot to pay for a pension. They can't even pay them now lol

You are confused on the pension issue.

UPS has never had a problem meeting it's pension obligation, whether it be for the hourlies on their plan or for their contributions to Teamster plans.

The problems are with the multi-employer plans, such as mine, where employers drop out and the number of retirees exceeds the number of actives. More money going out than coming in simply does not work.

 

[ITwannabe]

You are confused on the pension issue.

UPS has never had a problem meeting it's pension obligation, whether it be for the hourlies on their plan or for their contributions to Teamster plans.

The problems are with the multi-employer plans, such as mine, where employers drop out and the number of retirees exceeds the number of actives. More money going out than coming in simply does not work.

Is that the Central State thing where they cut drivers pensions in half?

 

[dudebro]

It makes me wonder about all these young employees who just starting driving. They have much heavier days, longer days, and a lot heavier box s compared to the guys who started 30 years ago. And the guys(some of them) who started 30 years ago are passing away soon after retirement. I would imagine to see this trend more and more? Just goes to show you how stressful and physical UPS driving is. Maybe coorporate should look at that statistic since they seem to like stats so much ...

OK, here's where we differ a little.
The UPS corporate mission statement doesn't include this. This is what UPS corporate (more or less) says it's going to do:

• Grow our global business.
• Maintain a financially strong company-with broad employee ownership-that provides a long-term competitive return to our shareowners.
• Inspire our people and business partners to do their best..
• Lead by example as a company in the communities we serve.

It doesn't say anything about the employee's well being, it leaves that up to the employees. You can call that evil, some would call it freedom. Others might have a philosophical take on a point (Isn't making sure the employees are healthy a part of #4?), but in my mind, they don't say anything.

So it's on each and every one of US to take care of ourselves as well as we can. For some of you that's filing 9.5 grievances and requesting 8 hour dispatches. For others, it's getting as much OT (or MIP) as possible to feed our family. But the company is telling you up front that THEY are NOT DOING IT. So you know this going in.

Every day you wake up and make a business decision to rent your body and mind to the company for whatever the agreed upon wage is. If you think that is going to kill you, then either participate in the contract talks in 2018, sit down with your manager, or find another line of work / start your own business. That's on YOU.

 

[ITwannabe]

OK, here's where we differ a little.
The UPS corporate mission statement doesn't include this. This is what UPS corporate (more or less) says it's going to do:

• Grow our global business.
• Maintain a financially strong company-with broad employee ownership-that provides a long-term competitive return to our shareowners.
• Inspire our people and business partners to do their best..
• Lead by example as a company in the communities we serve.

It doesn't say anything about the employee's well being, it leaves that up to the employees. You can call that evil, some would call it freedom. Others might have a philosophical take on a point (Isn't making sure the employees are healthy a part of #4?), but in my mind, they don't say anything.

So it's on each and every one of US to take care of ourselves as well as we can. For some of you that's filing 9.5 grievances and requesting 8 hour dispatches. For others, it's getting as much OT (or MIP) as possible to feed our family. But the company is telling you up front that THEY are NOT DOING IT. So you know this going in.

Every day you wake up and make a business decision to rent your body and mind to the company for whatever the agreed upon wage is. If you think that is going to kill you, then either participate in the contract talks in 2018, sit down with your manager, or find another line of work / start your own business. That's on YOU.

UPS does not give us a choice to take care of our body....the stretches we do are pointless...bending backwards does not stretch your back lol (so stretch on your own)...but the methods contrary to popular belief are for production...not safety. Any time of repetative motion is bad over time. Tucking a mirror is pointless....stepping off forward is much worse for your knees and shoulder than stepping off backwards. If we don't follow the methods we could lose our job.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

Is that the Central State thing where they cut drivers pensions in half?

Not quite that drastic but pretty damn close.

No, I am in the Upstate NY Teamsters Pension Plan and our proposed cuts are 20% for actives, 33% for retirees and 50% for orphans.

One of our recently retired drivers was supposed to get $5,400/month. He is divorced and his ex gets half, bringing him down to $2,700. 33% of $2,700 is $900 which brings his pension down to the grand total of $1,800/month.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

dudebro, do you still see the driver's position as a 30 year job for new hires?

 

[dudebro]

UPS does not give us a choice to take care of our body....the stretches we do are pointless...bending backwards does not stretch your back lol (so stretch on your own)...but the methods contrary to popular belief are for production...not safety. Any time of repetative motion is bad over time. Tucking a mirror is pointless....stepping off forward is much worse for your knees and shoulder than stepping off backwards. If we don't follow the methods we could lose our job.

I think you DO have some choice. The union has seen to it that you have your out. You might have to do it UPSs way, but the union has ensured that you can generally do it at YOUR speed.

So, instead of BOUNDING out of a package car, you can set the package down, grasp the handle, and STEP out. This really isn't easy to be this mindful all day, every day, in fact, it's mentally taxing. You might have to put up with discussions with your management and stand your ground. But there ARE choices people can make every day that change outcomes.

And yea, I don't know where stretching in the morning came from, I'd love to see the analytics behind that. As someone who takes Tae Kwon Do I've learned that static stretching isn't good for much, dynamic stretching until your muscles are warm (basically, calisthenics) is what protects muscles from strain. So, if that's true, and you have a 45 minute to/from, you have cold muscles again when you get on area.

 

[ITwannabe]

Not quite that drastic but pretty damn close.

No, I am in the Upstate NY Teamsters Pension Plan and our proposed cuts are 20% for actives, 33% for retirees and 50% for orphans.

One of our recently retired drivers was supposed to get $5,400/month. He is divorced and his ex gets half, bringing him down to $2,700. 33% of $2,700 is $900 which brings his pension down to the grand total of $1,800/month.

That's why I don't trust the pension

 

[ITwannabe]

I think you DO have some choice. The union has seen to it that you have your out. You might have to do it UPSs way, but the union has ensured that you can generally do it at YOUR speed.

So, instead of BOUNDING out of a package car, you can set the package down, grasp the handle, and STEP out. This really isn't easy to be this mindful all day, every day, in fact, it's mentally taxing. You might have to put up with discussions with your management and stand your ground. But there ARE choices people can make every day that change outcomes.

And yea, I don't know where stretching in the morning came from, I'd love to see the analytics behind that. As someone who takes Tae Kwon Do I've learned that static stretching isn't good for much, dynamic stretching until your muscles are warm (basically, calisthenics) is what protects muscles from strain. So, if that's true, and you have a 45 minute to/from, you have cold muscles again when you get on area.

But even beyond the physical aspect of the job the worst part for your health is the stress.

 

[dudebro]

dudebro, do you still see the driver's position as a 30 year job for new hires?

Yes, with a qualifier. Genetically, there are people who can do it for 50 years, even now. Then there are people who can't. 1) You have to be mentally tough just to do the job, and even tougher on yourself the way I described in my post above, in a way you might not have had to do before. 2) You don't HAVE to remain a driver for 30 years if it isn't what you want. There are opportunities as a Teamster to go to feeders, porters, inside clerical, etc.

 

[ITwannabe]

It drives me crazy when people say UPS is a good job....I always respond....no it's a very well paying job with good benefits....the job itself if long long hours, fast paced ball busting work that is stressful, even hostile at times, and you work a lot during the holidays and eventually we will be working weekends also. But financially you are taken care of and you get good vacation.

A good job in my option is solid pay with 8-4 or 9-5 hours, weekends off and holidays off.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

That's why I don't trust the pension

Rather than not trust I would say that you should not be reliant solely on the pension as your only source of retirement income.

 

[dudebro]

But even beyond the physical aspect of the job the worst part for your health is the stress.

Everyone responds differently, but stress is 10% what happens and 90% your attitude toward it.

I have friends who've come back from Iraq and told stories about not even missing a bite of food during lunch while mortars are falling. When I ask why they didn't panic and take cover, they'd give me a bored look and say "Do you really think hiding under a plastic table is going to help if one hits your position?"

Point is, some of the people on here really have it right. They tell you that they go out, do the job as prescribed, and that's it. IF there are going to be late airs, they tell the center to reduce the dispatch and document it. IF they're going to have missed pieces, they tell the center again at 2PM or whenever your centers "how many done, how many left, eta?" message comes out.

 

[1989]

Not quite that drastic but pretty damn close.

No, I am in the Upstate NY Teamsters Pension Plan and our proposed cuts are 20% for actives, 33% for retirees and 50% for orphans.

One of our recently retired drivers was supposed to get $5,400/month. He is divorced and his ex gets half, bringing him down to $2,700. 33% of $2,700 is $900 which brings his pension down to the grand total of $1,800/month.

When are the cuts happening? So you are basically stuck working until the cuts happen.

 

[ITwannabe]

Everyone responds differently, but stress is 10% what happens and 90% your attitude toward it.

I have friends who've come back from Iraq and told stories about not even missing a bite of food during lunch while mortars are falling. When I ask why they didn't panic and take cover, they'd give me a bored look and say "Do you really think hiding under a plastic table is going to help if one hits your position?"

Point is, some of the people on here really have it right. They tell you that they go out, do the job as prescribed, and that's it. IF there are going to be late airs, they tell the center to reduce the dispatch and document it. IF they're going to have missed pieces, they tell the center again at 2PM or whenever your centers "how many done, how many left, eta?" message comes out.

That's for sure true. If you can manage the stress and keep work at work and go home to your family with a positive outlook you can last at this job.

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

When are the cuts happening? So you are basically stuck working until the cuts happen.

If approved, the cuts take effect 7/1/17.

This will definitely change the retirement plans for those who were thinking about leaving a bit early as you have to be on the books as an active on 6/30/17 in order to avoid the retiree cuts.

I am not eligible until 7/1/18.

These will be a one time cut-----they can't cut us 20% as an active and then come back looking for an additional 11-13% once we retire.

 

[dudebro]

I truly wish no one had their pensions cut, but....isn't this one backwards a little?
The retirees, many of whom can't work again, are getting cut 33% and they're more vulnerable than current workers, who are cut 20%, but many of these still have an option to change plans, retirement date, etc.