Raise in new contract

[Coldworld]

9.5 is an 1.5 of OT. If your on the list then you should never be dispatched over 9.5 hours

I have the app, but there wasn’t a link to the webinar when I checked Thursday.

 

[Just A UPS Guy]

I have the app, but there wasn’t a link to the webinar when I checked Thursday.

You register for it on the app, then you get an email link the day of.

 

[DELACROIX]

Is the reason I hope the IBT does not cave in. The flock will follow their leaders. And if the leadership caves, the rank and file will follow.

Study the history of the Carey strike… now study the history of the previous Contract. The later would be a prime example of leadership caving in and the rank and file didn’t follow.

If the Company wants to start a strike so be it,

I was around way before the “97” strike, seen this game before, nothing new.

 

[DOK]

There's no reason that dispatch can't be held accountable/responsible for dispatching drivers fairly.

For example, why are some drivers dispatched in a way that they can get their route done in 7 hrs, take a code 5 and go home, while others are dispatched where they are ALWAYS working 10-12hr days? Don't management have enough tools and metrics that detail which drivers are typically under-allowed and which drivers are typically over allowed so that they can adjust the dispatches to make it more even across the board?

Sure, you'll say "What about drivers that run and gun, or drivers that sandbag." Well that's what OJS/Route survey ride alongs are designed to weed out right?

From what I heard, dispatch is incredibly hamstrung with respect to how much control they have on how they configure the routes. And if that's the case, all of our whining and moaning about dispatch being unbalanced (even mine above) falls on deaf ears because there's friend'all they can do about it even if they wanted to.

IMHO why can't we have something written in the contract that states that a fair day's work amounts to a 9 hour(or another objectively chosen time) dispatch, based on the type of route (urban/rural/business/resi/etc) and capability of the driver assigned to the route.

And language in the 9.5 grievance section that states that any more than X number of "paid out" 9.5 grievances in Y weeks based on being over dispatched will trigger an automatic adjustment of dispatch to be reduced by the average length of time the employee is over 9.5.

Anyways, I'm rambling now. TL;DR - the new penalties for 9.5 sounds good but I think more can be done in the contract to help force management/company to take steps beyond paying us out to fix our dispatches.

While I agree, I can’t help but think of the reaction of my center manager from the late eighties had I brought something like this to his attention

 

[Cowboy Mac]

About half our members think this is the best contract ever because SOB says so. I think they are so scared to strike they would Vote YES even with no raise and worse working conditions. So far this contract blows

Calm down junior.

 

[BigUnionGuy]

He didn't run on ending forced overtime.

Where do people come up with this stuff ?

 

[DOK]

I get where you're coming from, but it's a little one sided.

UPS takes in around 100 billion a year. Of that, last year they profited 13 Billion, this is true.

To keep this really simple, and to use your example, Suppose UPS simply spent 1.5 Billion less on stock buyback last year. Boom, raise covered and 13 billion profit retained.

It's about allocation.

Yeah can’t lower shareholder allocations.

 

[BigUnionGuy]

Our BA has been close friends with the labor manager outside of work for many year. No one shaking when our BA shows up for sure. Lol

If he sucks so bad.... why don't you do something about it ?

 

[Bubblehead]

I don't think the problem is with members, the union isn't as strong as they used to be. I remember 21yrs ago, when the union business agent came for a visit, every manager and supervisor were scared to death. Now, they could care less. Maybe a strike will get their minds right again.

The membership is "the Union", and if the membership is weak, it doesn't matter who gets elected and walks into your building.

You say the supervisors used to be scared to death, I say you and your coworkers are scared to death now and are just looking for someone to take care of you.

That's not going to happen until the majority rise up and empower your BA to take care of you.

It's really that simple.

 

[Bubblehead]

There's no reason that dispatch can't be held accountable/responsible for dispatching drivers fairly.

For example, why are some drivers dispatched in a way that they can get their route done in 7 hrs, take a code 5 and go home, while others are dispatched where they are ALWAYS working 10-12hr days? Don't management have enough tools and metrics that detail which drivers are typically under-allowed and which drivers are typically over allowed so that they can adjust the dispatches to make it more even across the board?

Sure, you'll say "What about drivers that run and gun, or drivers that sandbag." Well that's what OJS/Route survey ride alongs are designed to weed out right?

From what I heard, dispatch is incredibly hamstrung with respect to how much control they have on how they configure the routes. And if that's the case, all of our whining and moaning about dispatch being unbalanced (even mine above) falls on deaf ears because there's friend'all they can do about it even if they wanted to.

IMHO why can't we have something written in the contract that states that a fair day's work amounts to a 9 hour(or another objectively chosen time) dispatch, based on the type of route (urban/rural/business/resi/etc) and capability of the driver assigned to the route.

And language in the 9.5 grievance section that states that any more than X number of "paid out" 9.5 grievances in Y weeks based on being over dispatched will trigger an automatic adjustment of dispatch to be reduced by the average length of time the employee is over 9.5.

Anyways, I'm rambling now. TL;DR - the new penalties for 9.5 sounds good but I think more can be done in the contract to help force management/company to take steps beyond paying us out to fix our dispatches.

....or you could just eliminate bonus and watch the Company do what our members should do, concentrate on working by the hour and watch everything else level itself out.

I hate the word "dispatch" in every context it is being used in this conversation, because it gives power to the Company's make believe metrics.

 

[Brownslave688]

If he sucks so bad.... why don't you do something about it ?

Our BA are appointed. Once they suck up enough to the right people it’s basically a lifetime job.

 

[Bubblehead]

Our BA are appointed. Once they suck up enough to the right people it’s basically a lifetime job.

Who elects "the right people" every three years?

 

[Thebrownblob]

Our BA are appointed. Once they suck up enough to the right people it’s basically a lifetime job.

BAs are appointed and they can also be terminated. We’ve had it happen. Several times, they come in and can’t do the job or don’t do the job and enough people complain and eventually they go back to the Barns they came from.

It’s a political position, and if an executive board keeps a business agent who isn’t doing the job on the payroll there’s a good chance. Those people will be out of a job as well during the next election.

 

[RangerMan06]

O’Brien ran on ending forced excessive OT. Some quotes just refer to forced OT because O’Brien and the Union agree that a package driver can work up to 9 1/2 hours per day.

That 1 1/2 hours OT after your 8 hours is not considered forced OT. Hours worked over 9.5 on multiple days of the week is the forced OT he ran on.

He never ran on eliminating OT, eliminating working past 8 hours.

The current 9.5 language they've agreed to won't even slow them down. It will be 5 more years of excessive OT.

 

[Thebrownblob]

The current 9.5 language they've agreed to won't even slow them down. It will be 5 more years of excessive OT.

Maybe,
maybe not
I can confidently state the current 9.5 language was pretty effective at slowing them down. We went from over $300,000 in grievances one year to almost nothing the next. With management making sure people were not going over 9.5 I would personally know because I was involved every morning in making sure drivers got the work taken off of them. Maybe where you are people didn’t file or it wasn’t enforced well enough?

We trade our labor for compensation. The only thing we can do is charge more for our labor the longer we work through the day, telling the company they cannot use our labor isn’t a smart choice. We just have to make it really expensive for them to do so, and hold their feet to the fire.

 

[TheBrownNote]

Maybe,
maybe not
I can confidently state the current 9.5 language was pretty effective at slowing them down. We went from over $300,000 in grievances one year to almost nothing the next. With management making sure people were not going over 9.5 I would personally know because I was involved every morning in making sure drivers got the work taken off of them. Maybe where you are people didn’t file or it wasn’t enforced well enough?

We trade our labor for compensation. The only thing we can do is charge more for our labor the longer we work through the day, telling the company they cannot use our labor isn’t a smart choice. We just have to make it really expensive for them to do so, and hold their feet to the fire.

What good is 9.5 when your start time is 9:30

 

[Thebrownblob]

What good is 9.5 when your start time is 9:30

Currently it’s good for double the pay if you’re violated. If you’re expecting the next contract to dictate start times, you’ll be disappointed.

 

[9.5mania]

The membership is "the Union", and if the membership is weak, it doesn't matter who gets elected and walks into your building.

You say the supervisors used to be scared to death, I say you and your coworkers are scared to death now and are just looking for someone to take care of you.

That's not going to happen until the majority rise up and empower your BA to take care of you.

It's really that simple.

Ok, what a silly ad hominem attack, I make an observation about the company not respecting union BA’s anymore and you immediately blame the members. I guess you would blame all of us for the pathetic 2018 contract even though it was rejected by the members? Union leadership had nothing to do with that I guess, we just wanted someone to take care of us. And yes, I pay dues for those guys to “take care of us” and to lead. We are the muscle, they are the direction, so their leadership matters a great deal.

Our union BA’s used to wear suits back in the day, and the company feared them, not so much anymore, showing up in blue jeans and a shirt. We just elected a new slate last election because we wanted change. My building has lost more grievances at panel then I can remember the last 3 yrs. Union membership has declined 3-4% over the last 2 decades. Guys in RTW states like mine don’t see value in it and current members are pissed they are constantly sending things to panel. Sure, you can attack the soldiers but without respect from the enemy, no reason to come to the table.

I’m not trying to blame the union or BA’s, they have an impossible job, but surely we can recognize a lack of respect from the company lately.

 

[Coldworld]

The current 9.5 language they've agreed to won't even slow them down. It will be 5 more years of excessive OT.

But according to this video drivers will have more time with the kiddos…

Is it just me or does this sound like a company made video.

 

[Coldworld]

Currently it’s good for double the pay if you’re violated. If you’re expecting the next contract to dictate start times, you’ll be disappointed.

Unfortunately some of that are drivers who will bust it out when starting so late. Some could have a start time of 8:00 or 10:00 and they would still get done at the same time…our own worst enemy syndrome strikes again.