SUPS working all day every day?

[UPS Preloader]

Once you punch in you have a target on your back anyway. So there are only 2 options, allow it to happen or file grievances. Some people are afraid. Trust me, the more you do it, the better the results.

Agreed, filing is best.

 

[PiedmontSteward]

You should see how sweaty sups get here in 177 land. Been going on for years!

Are you out of Local 177? If so, you guys actually had a Division Manager try and argue that each supervisor was allowed to work 20 minutes per day at a national panel case. Guess how that ended?

 

[BrownDooDoo]

I'm just going to have to play it by ear and decide what's more important. Staying on the good side of my sups/co workers or filing when they work. I'm a newb, but the way I see it is this....

Just like us, the SUPS have family to support. Crap flows down hill and theyre getting it from corporate. I'll have to take a stand one way or the other once my initiation is paid.

 

[curiousbrain]

I'm just going to have to play it by ear and decide what's more important. Staying on the good side of my sups/co workers or filing when they work. I'm a newb, but the way I see it is this....

Just like us, the SUPS have family to support. Crap flows down hill and theyre getting it from corporate. I'll have to take a stand one way or the other once my initiation is paid.

If you start a war of filing, they will bend every rule in the book to throw you out; and, depending on your business agent, when you hit panel (which you will, rest assured), you will have to trust him or her.

I am not saying you shouldn't file on it whenever you see it, but what I am saying is that you should have absolutely no illusions about how you will be dealt with by management - if they ever allow one person to get away with it, then everyone will follow suit.

 

[BrownDooDoo]

If you start a war of filing, they will bend every rule in the book to throw you out; and, depending on your business agent, when you hit panel (which you will, rest assured), you will have to trust him or her.

I am not saying you shouldn't file on it whenever you see it, but what I am saying is that you should have absolutely no illusions about how you will be dealt with by management - if they ever allow one person to get away with it, then everyone will follow suit.

That's exactly what I was thinking. The head supervisor I can tell from his demeanor would do everything he could to get rid of me. I'll probably just keep quiet for a while, but it is rather annoying. The SUP does things like asking me to work before my start time, and working him self before start time. He'll start unloading about the first wall of each truck, then scanning the packages and sending them back to one person on sort belts. It's like damn dude, that's definitely at least a good 5-10 minutes off the time we PT get paid for.

So far I've said nothing to anyone though. Just kept quiet and observed.

 

[UPS Preloader]

If you start a war of filing, they will bend every rule in the book to throw you out; and, depending on your business agent, when you hit panel (which you will, rest assured), you will have to trust him or her.

I am not saying you shouldn't file on it whenever you see it, but what I am saying is that you should have absolutely no illusions about how you will be dealt with by management - if they ever allow one person to get away with it, then everyone will follow suit.

That's money out of your pocket dude. Once you have seniority you should start filing on it. If you let it go it will only get worse. Don't worry about what management will do to you. Just work as directed and you'll be fine.

 

[BrownDooDoo]

Thanks for the advice everyone, I have 3 weeks left until initiation is paid off. Then I'll talk to my shop steward first and see what he says about it all. Maybe I can get all "the guys" together and talk something out. I just hate to come off as the young new guy making a stink lol.

 

[Squint]

That's exactly what I was thinking. The head supervisor I can tell from his demeanor would do everything he could to get rid of me. I'll probably just keep quiet for a while, but it is rather annoying. The SUP does things like asking me to work before my start time, and working him self before start time. He'll start unloading about the first wall of each truck, then scanning the packages and sending them back to one person on sort belts. It's like damn dude, that's definitely at least a good 5-10 minutes off the time we PT get paid for.

So far I've said nothing to anyone though. Just kept quiet and observed.

If you stick up for what is right, the Union would be stronger as they would have to hire more Teamsters. More teamsters means more dues=stronger Union.

 

[twoweeled]

I work in a small hub, but for some reason things seem to be ran fairly inefficiently. I'm coming up on my 90 working days and have 3 weeks left until my union initiation is paid off and I'm a member....I guess.

Anyway, I know that SUPS aren't supposed to do any hourly work what so ever. I work in the unload section for right now and every day I witness a manager doing something. Whether they are in the trailer for a few minutes (or some cases a whole trailer), SPA'ing packages, or sorting smalls, they do some work every day without fail. I've seen the operation manager on the pick off line for a period of time.

Also, every day I see managers working the red and blue (in my hub) load belts. Not supervising, but actually getting packages and putting them in package cars. Is that ok? My steward does nothing.....no one says anything. I do have one co-worker that gets pissed but he never files any paper work that I know of.


Is this normal? Is "the contract" really just a joke?

Yes it is a joke. All except for the part about having your dues deducted every month. That is a firm rule the union will not give in, on!!

 

[BrownDooDoo]

Other things they do at my hub: SUP regularly has to go back on the sort belt to help keep the packages from burying the sorters. It's always 4 people unloading verse 3 people on the sort. If they would just give us one more on the sort it would be so much SAFER. Not even thinking about just being easier here, it also becomes unsafe when packages are falling all over the damn place.

SUP regularly sends employees home to the point that he has to start doing things like scanning, dumping smalls, etc.

What sucks is my SUP is a cool guy, he's just trying to cover his ass. He lets us stick around and clock extra hours when technically he should cut us sometimes, so I don't know, Im stuck. This friday is my last initiation payment so we'll see after that. It's a shame cause I could use the extra minutes of payment lol.

 

[Areyoukiddinme]

We have all been in your shoes, gain your seniority then get with your steward and tell your sup you will file whenever he is doing bargaining unit work. Take notes of when he's working now. That's called building a case. They would do it to you if you were doing something wrong

 

[BrownDooDoo]

We have all been in your shoes, gain your seniority then get with your steward and tell your sup you will file whenever he is doing bargaining unit work. Take notes of when he's working now. That's called building a case. They would do it to you if you were doing something wrong

True, and no matter how cool the guy is, I guess it's still money out of my pocket. Like before I'm just keeping quiet and watching, keeping my mouth shut so I don't put my foot in it. Thanks for all the replies!

 

[UPS Preloader]

Other things they do at my hub: SUP regularly has to go back on the sort belt to help keep the packages from burying the sorters. It's always 4 people unloading verse 3 people on the sort. If they would just give us one more on the sort it would be so much SAFER. Not even thinking about just being easier here, it also becomes unsafe when packages are falling all over the damn place.

SUP regularly sends employees home to the point that he has to start doing things like scanning, dumping smalls, etc.

What sucks is my SUP is a cool guy, he's just trying to cover his ass. He lets us stick around and clock extra hours when technically he should cut us sometimes, so I don't know, Im stuck. This friday is my last initiation payment so we'll see after that. It's a shame cause I could use the extra minutes of payment lol.

What's a shame is the fact that your letting sups work, violate the contract, and take money out of your pocket as well as your brother's and sisters, Your last initiation payment should have nothing to do with it. Once you have seniority you should and need to confront sups performing bargaining unit work and file grievances as needed. That is the only way they are going to stop.

 

[Drink Craft Beer]

When filing, do you need witnesses to sign the sheet saying they also saw Sups working? Do those who sign as a witness get paid to if it is successful?
I wanted to a while back ( 2 days after the fact) but was told by the steward that I had to go through the processes of doing so, but never told me what they were. She's worthless anyways and watches Sups work and never says anything.

Someone said you put a bulls eye on your back by filing, but if any harassment ensued shortly after winning a grievance, that could be proved that is the direct reason for the harassment.

 

[PiedmontSteward]

When filing, do you need witnesses to sign the sheet saying they also saw Sups working? Do those who sign as a witness get paid to if it is successful?
I wanted to a while back ( 2 days after the fact) but was told by the steward that I had to go through the processes of doing so, but never told me what they were. She's worthless anyways and watches Sups work and never says anything.

Someone said you put a bulls eye on your back by filing, but if any harassment ensued shortly after winning a grievance, that could be proved that is the direct reason for the harassment.

No. You simply ask the other bargaining unit member if they mind being a witness and list them if they agree. For example:

"On 7/10/13, I saw John Doe supervisor loading door 101 in the outbound from 1:00 PM - 2:00 PM. John Smith Teamster and Jack Smith Teamster both witnessed this."

Only the grievant will be paid for a supervisors working grievance, unless you decide to "spread the wealth" by asking for other affected employees to be paid in the remedy. For example, under the remedy for the time above, you would request: "For grievant to be paid one hour at double rate of pay." Or "For John Smith Teamster and Jack Smith Teamster to each be paid for thirty minutes at double rate of pay for the work performed by John Doe supervisor."

If it's something especially egregious (multiple supervisors working in an area for an entire week, for example) then having witness statements from your witnesses helps. Generally, you don't need to go that far unless the case goes to panel (the local then needs to get notarized statements from all witnesses) but that's fairly unlikely with a supervisors working grievance.

 

[Drink Craft Beer]

Thank You for the Info.

Just seems like it would be hard to prove how long they were working. Basically my word (45mins.) compared to theirs (it was only 10mins) for example.

 

[PiedmontSteward]

Thank You for the Info.

Just seems like it would be hard to prove how long they were working. Basically my word (45mins.) compared to theirs (it was only 10mins) for example.

It doesn't matter. It's your word against theirs but you have witnesses. Generally, with supervisors working grievances, adding on two bargaining unit members at witnesses makes it an open and shut case. You simply need to make sure you have accurate start and stop times and that your witnesses aren't spineless nancies that will shrivel up because the sort manager frowned at them.

 

[Bagels]

When you go to your hearing, UPS will typically attempt to negotiate with you.

For example, if you've documented -- with supporting witnesses -- $300 in penalties for management working, they may offer you $100. They'll persist that either management wasn't working, or that management had good reason to work, and they're merely trying to settle the issue - but they're willing to go to panel. They may even up their offer, but unless they've demonstrated clear, irrefutable reasons, you'll likely get your full payment. If you have a strong case, your manager may try to settle before any hearing (usually by adding time to your time card, over one or more pay periods).

If you do file, expect retaliation. It's also a good idea to get your steward to take witness statements (written or oral) since often the fear of retaliation leads witnesses to getting cold feet.

A couple years ago I was chased from the building at 3.5. Me and another employee would clock out and observe management work to complete the sort. My boss was adamant that supervisors had the ability to load air and pull add/cuts, and the labor manager & district manager seemingly agreed, insisting we were heading to panel. At the last minute, they agreed to cut us a check in the full amount. With a week, I received a certified letter from the district manager that notified me that if I did not vacate the building immediately after clocking out (I would be permitted to use the rest room near the entrance of the building, however) that UPS would consider me to be trespassing and I would be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. My BA laughed it off.

 

[Returntosender]

When you go to your hearing, UPS will typically attempt to negotiate with you.

For example, if you've documented -- with supporting witnesses -- $300 in penalties for management working, they may offer you $100. They'll persist that either management wasn't working, or that management had good reason to work, and they're merely trying to settle the issue - but they're willing to go to panel. They may even up their offer, but unless they've demonstrated clear, irrefutable reasons, you'll likely get your full payment. If you have a strong case, your manager may try to settle before any hearing (usually by adding time to your time card, over one or more pay periods).

If you do file, expect retaliation. It's also a good idea to get your steward to take witness statements (written or oral) since often the fear of retaliation leads witnesses to getting cold feet.

A couple years ago I was chased from the building at 3.5. Me and another employee would clock out and observe management work to complete the sort. My boss was adamant that supervisors had the ability to load air and pull add/cuts, and the labor manager & district manager seemingly agreed, insisting we were heading to panel. At the last minute, they agreed to cut us a check in the full amount. With a week, I received a certified letter from the district manager that notified me that if I did not vacate the building immediately after clocking out (I would be permitted to use the rest room near the entrance of the building, however) that UPS would consider me to be trespassing and I would be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. My BA laughed it off.

A part of me wonders how UPS Public relations would spin that in court.

 

[Drink Craft Beer]

Good info

Thanks guys