There will be "concessions"
- Thread starter krash
- Start date
I dont understand why any of you are worrying about the next contract already???
There are many things to be discussed, there are many issues that are being addressed right now. Committees are being formed and ideas being created. I know, I am sitting on a committee here on the west coast representing southern california.
I can guarantee you that CONCESSIONS isnt on the table.
The company has a ton of dead weight management that technology is replacing. Like the auto makers in the 60's and 70's, technology and automation is eliminating the need for these overpriced do nothing suits eating company profits.
The decision making ability has been removed from the low level suits at UPS and that includes center managers, on road sups and part time supervisors.
Any increases in hourly pay will be offset in suit removals. Its that simple.
UPS is profitable, volume isnt going anywhere, its being DIVERTED. Customers are'nt seeking other carriers for pricing, they are being led to other arms of the UPS network. This is the focus of the next contract.
Job security is something we will never conceed.
You all need to relax and give it a break. Your inputs are better served at your local meetings or with your executive officers of your locals.
To openly discuss your "fears" on a blog isnt a helpful tool.
Peace.
There are many things to be discussed, there are many issues that are being addressed right now. Committees are being formed and ideas being created. I know, I am sitting on a committee here on the west coast representing southern california.
I can guarantee you that CONCESSIONS isnt on the table.
The company has a ton of dead weight management that technology is replacing. Like the auto makers in the 60's and 70's, technology and automation is eliminating the need for these overpriced do nothing suits eating company profits.
The decision making ability has been removed from the low level suits at UPS and that includes center managers, on road sups and part time supervisors.
Any increases in hourly pay will be offset in suit removals. Its that simple.
UPS is profitable, volume isnt going anywhere, its being DIVERTED. Customers are'nt seeking other carriers for pricing, they are being led to other arms of the UPS network. This is the focus of the next contract.
Job security is something we will never conceed.
You all need to relax and give it a break. Your inputs are better served at your local meetings or with your executive officers of your locals.
To openly discuss your "fears" on a blog isnt a helpful tool.
Peace.
menotyou
bella amicizia
How is it helpful when you go to a local meeting, one of the few left who actually attends as the others believe it will accomplish nothing to go, when at the meeting your local officials believe that since you are the only coming to the meeting and bitchin'- it must be you that is the problem. The local level is as bloated and power drunk as the upper levels. The suits of the union need to put some browns back on and actually work!
beentheredonethat
Well-Known Member
TOS, you really think that in these economic times, customers aren't willing to switch to FDX if they offer 5-10% savings? If you are the logistics mgr and you are responsible to reduce costs in your department and you currently spend 5 million a year with UPS and you can switch carriers and save 5-10%. Don't you think you'd do it. You can show your boss you saved the company $250 - 500K per year due to the switch. (5-10% of 5 Million spend). This will help you to keep your job and possibly promoted. Remember the folks who work in the warehouse who may or may not like the UPS driver doesn't make the decision on which carrier gets used (esp when it's a large shipper).
FDX ground grew by almost 400K pkgs per day over the last 3 years. That to me is the biggest threat to UPS and to the teamsters. If we had those packages there would be more UPS jobs. To have long term job security, you first have to have a company that will be around for a long time. Also, working for a profitable company is the best thing an employee could want. A lot of you folks have said, UPS is profitable so why offer concessions. But then often you "badmouth" the company for being profitable. You should want your company being profitable and a leader in it's industry so you will have long term job stability.
UPS has a big advantage over FDX, and our customers ( and i know, ive been here 21 years) would rather pay the higher 5 to 10% if that meant having greater access to moving their packages. FDX has limited capacity, and their times are limited, cube space is a the biggest problem for them. Reliability is worth the 10% if it insures that the customer is satisfied. Do you buy all your shoes at payless shoe stores?
UPS has continued to blow its advantages in the marketplace by mis-using its fleet. Concerns over spohr and distracting itself from service is the reason customers make the switch to FDX. Not allowing the drivers the flexibility to service customers when "they " need it contributes to diversion.
Failed pickups on a daily basis by UPS is another large contributor to the diversion of pkgs to FDX.
Numbers are something "IE GEEKS" worry about. Customers will pay the price for UPS shipping if it means consistency, service, flexibility and reliability.
UPS "IE GEEKS" have damaged this aspect of the UPS operation. If I could have one minute alone with Scott Davis, i would punch him in the mouth and then sit down and talk to him about changing the direction of the operation.
For the last 7 years, UPS has has gone away from service and driven itself into tunnel vision on spohr and other useless programs that take the focus off service.
The list is endless for service failures. From overloaded pickup strings that result in daily missed pickups, to overloaded package cars where drivers are knocking on doors at 9pm, to package cars that are completely misloaded using EDD/PAS and appearing as if they were loaded with a shovel, UPS has lost its ability to run itself.
The DRIVERS are the ones "Correcting" the errors of the company management. Everyday, DRIVERS compensate for the stupidity of dispatch and find ways to finish the day. From calling each other on their own cell phones asking other drivers for help, to working with customers to adjust for the lack of time allotted for the job, its the DRIVERS who are running this company.
At 8pm, when a driver is buried with 90 stops left, the center has no answers, its THAT driver who reaches out to his fellow drivers to ask them for help. When they punch out at 945pm or 1030pm in some cases, they know "THEY" made it happen, and not some division manager, center manager or on road sup.
Nobody badmouths the company, "We" are the company. "WE" make it happen, "WE" make it what it is. "WE" make the corrective action.
NOT SUITS. YOU make it worse.
UPS should FLUSH the current operational system down the toilet from which they fished it out of, and start anew. A new direction, less overtime, more flexibility, customer satisfaction, less customer complaints, MORE SERVICE, and less hassle.
Customers of UPS are more HASSLED today than ever before.
If they order something, and it needs a signature, UPS sends them an email telling them we will be there between 9am and 6pm at their home, the customers take a day off, wait for us, and then we knock on the door promptly at 845pm. This customer BLOWS A GASKET, makes the usual threats of never using us again, and we can only smile, obtain the signature and move on to the next unhappy customer in the remaining DOL.
FDX is growing because UPS is failing. We could put FDX out of business if we only did the job the way its suppose to work. We have more trucks, more cube capacity, more people, more hubs, more planes and unfortunately, more management people than we need.
UPS also wastes MORE paper than any other company that I know of. Reports for reports of reports reporting other reports. It is a clusterphuque system of useless paper. Ever hear of save a tree?
UPS could effectively remove every center manager and replace him with an hourly director, someone with over 20 years of service in that center, one who KNOWS the delivery area and customers, someone with leadership ability and able to motivate his staff of drivers from a position of "practical working experience".
It works. There are many centers in california doing just that.
UPS should increase its capacity on road and utlilize its fleet, instead of having P12's and P11's returning to the building at 9PM empty without pickups, because they thought it best to have 200 stops on the car for the day. Other trucks are jammed packed with pickups because of cube space limitations and unavailable help.
You and other management want to worry about FDX growth as if you are doing nothing wrong, But the fact of the matter is, you are doing everything wrong. FDX only offers them more flexibility, flexibility that we dont have because some "IE GEEK" wants 175 stops average in the cars.
Not everything is equal in all centers. Not all routes are alike. Not all delivery areas have the same delays. To run a business like every car is the same is a reciepe for disaster, and the proof is in the "numbers".
The harder UPS tries to micro manage the operation with "reports", the worse our service is becoming.
YOU want those 400K pkgs back into the UPS system? Then trash the ideas that are in place and start over using the ideas from the hard working UPS'ers who are fixing your ingenious programs on a daily basis.
UPS management isnt the solution, its the problem with lost volume.
Peace.
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Catatonic
Nine Lives
I think you lost your way out of the Current Events forum.
I truly feel sorry for you, bless your heart.
Coldworld
Well-Known Member
you have mentioned that 100 times already....give it a rest nobody cares!
if you truly don't care, the company has nearly won already.
brownman15
Well-Known Member
there has been an increase in ground volume but it is going to the post office with sure post and ups mail
innovations
Coldworld
Well-Known Member
W
more of a jab toward Mr. Know it all but I hear what your saying...
Amen, brother
22.34life
Well-Known Member
we will see a two tier pay system in the new contract.
thessalonian13
Well-Known Member
ground, air, international... It doesn't matter... UPS makes billions in clean profit every year... And that's a good thing....
Dont feel sorry for me, Im the voice that is replacing voices like yours in the operation.
Peace.
beentheredonethat
Well-Known Member
TOS.. In regards to your response (#26). You need to figure out if UPS is better then the competition or worse. In one paragraph you say people will pay a premium for our services. In the next you talk about how we lost our way and we push production at the expense of service. You mention the drivers fix all the problems, but you mention pissed off customers. If the drivers fixed everything, why are there pissed off customers? If it's because the drivers couldn't fix everything, then maybe our service isn't worth 5-10% more. FDX unfortunately for us, does a decent job. I have had a few deliveries made by them. The box showed up on time, in good shape. I know I won't change your mind. I freely admit, that there are mistakes that we have made in management. It's amazing how 100% of time UPS mgmt is wrong, 100% of time UPS Teamsters are right. 100% of time Bush is wrong, 100% of time Obama is right. I freely admit there are shades of gray in all areas. It's amazing you know so much and are always right. You should become President of UPS or President of the teamsters or President of the US. I'm sure each could use a person that is right 100% of the time. Oh wait... Obama already is... Still leaves you two other options.
Well, my first reaction to your post is to question your intelligence on UPS. I think I was clear in my post, but for those who are intellectually challenged, let me Repeat myself.
UPS is a great company, its concepts for a business were excellent for providing a service to consumers. ALL DRIVERS believe that SERVICE should be our ONLY priority, whereas, guys like you would prefer to paper push a concept that is HURTING this companys operation.
You pointed out that FEDEX rates are cheaper than UPS rates, this is true, however, I countered you with a question. I asked you if you bought your shoes from PAYLESS SHOE SOURCE because those shoes are 80% cheaper than Tom McCann or FootLocker? Are cheaper prices the gauge that all people use to make a business decision?? I am sure you wouldnt walk into a UPS meeting in a pair of PAYLESS shoes on your feet.
I am sure you would invest in a more expensive shoe because of the reliability and ultimate service you would get out of the shoes for the higher price.
I think I have been clear, the management of UPS from the top down have incorporated a position of "weakness" in the daily operation, looking for excuses for every aspect that is failing in the daily operation. Technology was introduced to "dumbdown" the job functions and simplify things, but the only thing that has been "dumbdowned" are the managers like yourself who look upon these programs as a recipe for success.
UPS is "stockpiling" excuses for its operational failures and I will tell you what I have told my Division Manager, "if it were my decision, most of the current managers wouldnt be working for UPS any longer."
IE creates some ludicrous numbers for the day, pickups end up missed, large numbers of NDA are late, average paid day in center is 11.56 hrs (my center yesterday) packages returned to building un-serviced, pickup pieces are returned after 9PM delaying unload, and the feeder load wall, unloaders are walking around for half a shift with nothing to do (on the clock) as they wait for us to trickle in after 830PM.
The next morning, in the managers meeting, everyone reaches for a copy of this book, in order to prepare for the conference call from the Regional who will want to know what happened:
I am not sure if you appreciate "irony" in you life, but what I wrote was very clear. Indeed, we can do great service and be a great company, yet, managers like yourself buy into the contaminated dung that is the current operational structure and screw it all up. It isnt "our" decisions as drivers who gets pissed off or pissed on, its YOURS. If you are in operations, and you accept some load of crap from IE at 430am and you know it will destroy your centers day and the likelyhood of service failures and missed pickups and late NDA will result AND you run the plan nonetheless, then you are an expendable WASTE OF TIME and company PROFITS.
You give that same scenario to a 20+ year driver and he will find solutions and offer "blowback" to who ever punched those stupid numbers in the first place. Thats the problem with todays managers, youre all a bunch of "sackless" drones just trying to make it to retirement and not make waves. This is the problem. Your all weak.
As I said, we have the infrastructure to put FDX out of busines, but we go in the opposite direction. Let me give you an example. In 1997, T. Robinson, the district manager at the time of my region, held a meeting and told us that he wanted us to be the first cars on the road each and every business day, he wanted the customers to see us before they saw any FDX trucks on the road. HE wanted us to make sure there was no late air arriving to customers. Sounds great! We agreed.
But what happened? The company decided to delay the start times of preload pushing our departure times back 45 mins (915am- with 1030am commits and a 20 min drive to area). IN addition, some genious thought it would be great if UPS could offer Vegas to Los Angeles in one day, along with SF to LA in one day and AZ to LA in one day.
Now, the corridors are so tight, that the feeders arrive at the hubs after 8am and the unload, PAS and load belts are backed up and delayed causing our departure times to get pushed back to 935am to 945am with 1030 commits.
Now, we are the last delivery service vehicles on the road and the last to be seen on the road for the day. FEDEX trucks are already burning gas while we sit in the hub waiting for the shovel load just so we can get out of the building and fix the disaster in the truck. By the time I get to my first business stop, FEDEX has already delivered 10% of their loads!! But, wait, you want me to provide a lead...? Get serious.
Further, as each hub cuts routes and keeps drivers out longer(9pm) the unload and load walls go down 2 hours later causing the "HOT" loads from reaching LA in time for a proper sort.
The err's in NDA are caused by this ridiculous program, yet UPS cares less about the customers who paid for premium pkgs and more about some jacked up numbers punched out by some IE GEEK in atlanta who doesnt have the first clue on the operation.
FEDEX isnt increasing volume because its successful, its increasing because "WE" are failing.
You try to make jokes about pissed off customers, you may think its funny. But it AINT YOU standing on that porch at 9PM asking for a signature after you woke up someones kids by ringing the doorbell, honking the horn and yelling out UPS in the dark. All we can do at that point is try to salvage the delivery and possibly the customer. TO YOU, its just the way we do business.
Scott Davis should be embarrassed that he has thousands of service providers in that scenario each and everyday. That is failed leadership. Here's a report to generate, how about a report showing every delivery made after 8PM and 9Pm and have that on Scotts desk so he can see how his handywork is going?
Unfortunately, the truth gets washed out long before anyone at corporate sees the light. The book of excuses does wonders for the UPS management.
As a driver, my load is one of the worst loads in the hub. I average 15 off area a week or 60 off area service failures a month! And no matter how many times you bring it to the attention of someone in charge, its back to the yellow book of excuses.
Why is it, that in the am, a driver can walk in, take a look at his load, make an observation of service, and in a matter of minutes determine how long he will be on the road within a couple of minutes, and UPS has 4 hours to do the same and yet believes it can be done in less time? At the end of the day, the driver is right on , and the dispatch blown to hell.
UPS management is making this company "Weak" and vulnerable to the competition. We can be the best, like we used to be before the wrong people with the wrong ideas took charge.
20 years ago, i would do my route, fill up my truck with pickups, a supervisor was always on road with an empty P10, we would switch and I would continue in the empty till that one was full, then I was in by 7pm breaking standard by 2 hours. Today, i wouldnt do an extra pickup if YOUR life depended on it.
Back then , incentive meant something, today its useless. Working hard was a part of the program 20 years ago, today, you have made us unwilling to go the extra mile if all that waits for us is a warning letter or a threat of job loss.
You want to hand me a warning letter cause I didnt make that .3 extra on spohr? BLOW IT OUT YOUR
.Peace.
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beentheredonethat
Well-Known Member
No I do not buy my shoes at Payless where they are 80% cheaper. There are a few brands I like to use due to fit, comfort and quality. However, I do not shop at the same store out of blind loyalty. I will check out zappos.com, Or other similar web sites. One time on vacation, I happened to stop by a sale that Ecco shoe itself was having and bought dress shoes for $50 a pair. There were a lot of styles I didn't like but I found a few I liked and stocked up. So in short, I kept the quality and do it at a reduced price. FDX does do a decent job. As I indicated, they have delivered some packages to my house (although I personally don't purchase items if I know it will be delivered by FDX.) When you are purchasing a car and you've always gone to dealer X. But you find you can get a similar car (same model, same year, same color etc etc) and get it for 10% less at dealer Y. Wouldn't you buy it at dealer Y?
Most people would switch even if they "liked" dealer X.
BTW, I am not an operations mgmt person, although I was in operations for a long time both as a PT hourly, FT Driver and in mgmt operations. I often work on trying to improve the quality of service to our customers by coming up with unique solutions to their problems.
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