UPS-Vette
We voted out bonus about 6 months ago (Didn't make any differance, about 20% of us are still over 9.5 every day) and we were told at the time, once its voted out it is gone forever. How would we reinstate it?
Voting out Bonus
- Thread starter Ruralbrownman
- Start date
We voted out bonus about 6 months ago (Didn't make any differance, about 20% of us are still over 9.5 every day) and we were told at the time, once its voted out it is gone forever. How would we reinstate it?
breadbooze
Well-Known Member
I work at a bonus center, and come in about 50-100 clicks under everyday with between a 8-9 hour planned day. It has a noticable impact on the paycheck. There are also "bonus" routes which are heavy on the pickups (around 600-800 pieces, mostly letters), and get anywhere from 1-3 hours of bonus. Supposedly the time allowance is higher for pickup pieces than deliveries.
retired2000
Well-Known Member
here in upstate ny we never had bonus routes. i do not see them as a good thing. the faster you move the more likley to get hurt ofr have an accident. use the methods and let brown put on more routes
retired2000...I know Upstate NY (Syracuse area) had no Bonus Centers, but there were several Bonus Centers in the western part of NY, around the Buffalo, Jamestown area.
The main reason some parts of the country don't have Bonus is because the Union is opposed to it. You ask why would "MY" Union be opposed to Bonus? Well, one reason is that it takes the control of a drivers earnings away from the Union and gives it to the individual driver. The driver would have the ability to increase his/her earnings over and beyond what the Union had negotiated, based on that driver's skills. As you all know, Unions refuse to recognize that not all employees have the same ability. For the Union to recognize that fact would destroy the whole purpose of a Unions existance, in addition to reducing their power over the individual employee.
You must think that I am anti-union from my post. Far from it. I truly believe in the concept of Unions. I was born into a Teamster household. My father was a Teamster shop steward. One of my uncles also was a Teamster shop steward. Another of my uncles was the Teamster Business Agent for UPS, who by the way was responsible for me becoming a driver for UPS in the first place. I joined the Teamsters at eighteen when I got a job as a helper on a Sears delivery truck, so I have a lifetime of experience with the Teamsters. I am aware of both the good, and the bad, the Teamsters represent. I am also aware that each of us are individuals, whos biases are based on our own life experiences, both good and bad.
OK NOW..........RANT AWAY!!
The main reason some parts of the country don't have Bonus is because the Union is opposed to it. You ask why would "MY" Union be opposed to Bonus? Well, one reason is that it takes the control of a drivers earnings away from the Union and gives it to the individual driver. The driver would have the ability to increase his/her earnings over and beyond what the Union had negotiated, based on that driver's skills. As you all know, Unions refuse to recognize that not all employees have the same ability. For the Union to recognize that fact would destroy the whole purpose of a Unions existance, in addition to reducing their power over the individual employee.
You must think that I am anti-union from my post. Far from it. I truly believe in the concept of Unions. I was born into a Teamster household. My father was a Teamster shop steward. One of my uncles also was a Teamster shop steward. Another of my uncles was the Teamster Business Agent for UPS, who by the way was responsible for me becoming a driver for UPS in the first place. I joined the Teamsters at eighteen when I got a job as a helper on a Sears delivery truck, so I have a lifetime of experience with the Teamsters. I am aware of both the good, and the bad, the Teamsters represent. I am also aware that each of us are individuals, whos biases are based on our own life experiences, both good and bad.
OK NOW..........RANT AWAY!!
retired2000
Well-Known Member
do not know that much about buffalo and jamestown area. sorry.
from what i have heard about the bonus thing i am glad we never had it.
from what i have heard about the bonus thing i am glad we never had it.
U
UPS Vet
Guest
Bonus was put in our center in the early 80's. We worked under this Bonus system for about 4 years until all the drivers were tired of it. Our dispatches became longer. I believe the reason you see bonus just in some area is the company is hoping to prolong the building of new buildings. We voted out the bounus twice. The District manager at that time refused to take the bonus system out. Our local 509 filed with the National Labor Board to get it out. A gentleman was sent from Washington D. C. to interview 5 drivers and take their statements. I was one of them as I started with the company in 1978 and so was a junior driver. He also interview 2 older drivers. and 2 more junior drivers. Six months later just before the National Labor board was going to make it ruling again Ups and make them take the Bonus system out they removed it from our Center. You have to stick to your guns with Ups and hold their feet to the fire. Good luck on Centers trying to get rid of Bonus. I have never heard one driver say they regretted getting rid of bonus and with that I wish everybody a good career with Ups as I will be turning 57 this year and will retire with 28 years on December 29 of this year. Stand up for your rights and you will never regret it.
Soon to Retire
Soon to Retire
Ruralbrownman
Well-Known Member
UPS Vette
I am not quite sure I follow your reasoning on a driver making more than the union negotiated. All the bonus plan does is pay a driver if he runs under allowed. It is not an increase in his hourly rate. If his dispatch is a 9.2 and he finishes in 8 , he still gets the pay for the 9.2.
There has been alot of good posts on this topic. In our building , if it comes to a vote , I dont think it will pass. Alot of guys talk about voting it out , but if put to a vote , most will listen to the company propaganda , which I am sure will come, and vote no. There are only a few drivers left in our building that still make bonus , and there are alot of questions about how they can still make a hour-plus of bonus. One question is using miles to boost their planned day. On most routes a swing driver will run more miles than the regular driver. However that is not the case here , on two drivers that make bonus they will always run 20 to 30 miles more than the swing driver. The management team will not address the issue because making bonus makes them the golden boys. We just got DIAD 4 and have been told the GPS function is not working yet , or so they say , it should be interesting when it becomes operational to see how it effects their miles.
I am not quite sure I follow your reasoning on a driver making more than the union negotiated. All the bonus plan does is pay a driver if he runs under allowed. It is not an increase in his hourly rate. If his dispatch is a 9.2 and he finishes in 8 , he still gets the pay for the 9.2.
There has been alot of good posts on this topic. In our building , if it comes to a vote , I dont think it will pass. Alot of guys talk about voting it out , but if put to a vote , most will listen to the company propaganda , which I am sure will come, and vote no. There are only a few drivers left in our building that still make bonus , and there are alot of questions about how they can still make a hour-plus of bonus. One question is using miles to boost their planned day. On most routes a swing driver will run more miles than the regular driver. However that is not the case here , on two drivers that make bonus they will always run 20 to 30 miles more than the swing driver. The management team will not address the issue because making bonus makes them the golden boys. We just got DIAD 4 and have been told the GPS function is not working yet , or so they say , it should be interesting when it becomes operational to see how it effects their miles.
yeldrab.....Do you seriously believe none of your "brother" Teamsters are dishonest, in a non Bonus Center? Are only drivers in a Bonus Center dishonest? Do you think that only in a Bonus Center a driver will "pad" his/her milage to increase the planned day? I guess you also believe that no driver in a non Bonus Center has ever falsified the number of stops he/she had on a particular day? Of course you must also be of the opinion that only drivers in a Bonus Center steal packages. According to you, only drivers in Bonus Centers are dishonest because Bonus is the reason drivers are dishonest, and without Bonus every driver would be honest. GET REAL!!
Ruralbrown...... Allow me to explain how Bonus gives a driver the opportunity to earn more than the contractual agreed pay rate. In your example, a driver has a 9.2 dispatch and actually works 8.0 hours. Using $27 a hour as the contractual pay rate, the driver's contractual pay for that day would be (8.0x$27) $216. Under the Bonus system the drivers pay would be (8.0x$27) $216+(1.2x$40.5) $48.60 =$264.60. The $264.60 earned for 8.0 hours actually worked is the same as working for $33.07 per hour, which is more than the contractual hourly pay rate of $27 per hour.
Ruralbrown...... Allow me to explain how Bonus gives a driver the opportunity to earn more than the contractual agreed pay rate. In your example, a driver has a 9.2 dispatch and actually works 8.0 hours. Using $27 a hour as the contractual pay rate, the driver's contractual pay for that day would be (8.0x$27) $216. Under the Bonus system the drivers pay would be (8.0x$27) $216+(1.2x$40.5) $48.60 =$264.60. The $264.60 earned for 8.0 hours actually worked is the same as working for $33.07 per hour, which is more than the contractual hourly pay rate of $27 per hour.
No. I believe there is dishonesty. However, would there be a reason for drivers to pad miles, or pad stops if it didnt add a bonus? I know of drivers that take in 2 packages. One NDA, the other ground. Get two signatures, at the same stop. That wouldnt happen. I am all about an honest days work for an honest days pay. There are routes around mine that have less work than I on a regular basis, because of little things they do to increase their plan. That is fine. I can sleep at night, because I know if they have an eye on me, I have nothing to worry about. UPSVette, what part of "encourages" confused you? I am not saying that without bonus, there wouldnt be dishonesty. However, there is no need to pad, if it wouldnt make a difference. You said "Stuff like that" what part of that referred to stealing packages? Enlighten me. I said we had a driver get fired for padding miles to get a bigger bonus. You make it sound like I claim that is the only form of dishonesty at UPS. To repeat what you said, GET REAL
yeldarb....You ask why would a dirver add miles or stops if not for Bonus. You answered your own question, the same reason a Bonus driver would, to increase the planned day.
In a Bonus situation the driver would increase his/her wages. In a non Bonus center it would be, as you stated, to not have to work as hard and keep management "off his/her back" about performance. Shocking as it may be to you, but there have been drivers who padded their miles and stops in order to spend some "extra" time over and beyond their contractual allowed meal and break periods. A driver running up and down an Interstate for an additional 5 or 10 miles could add 15 to 30 minutes of planned on area travel allowance.
In a Bonus situation the driver would increase his/her wages. In a non Bonus center it would be, as you stated, to not have to work as hard and keep management "off his/her back" about performance. Shocking as it may be to you, but there have been drivers who padded their miles and stops in order to spend some "extra" time over and beyond their contractual allowed meal and break periods. A driver running up and down an Interstate for an additional 5 or 10 miles could add 15 to 30 minutes of planned on area travel allowance.
tieguy
Banned
same point could be made with the standard overtime system.
crazygill
Active Member
BONUS ? well pass gps on and all the years of not keeping up with changing times larger area no time study guess what guyes we are screwd. bonus or not does not make any dif, they have been keeping time on all of us for the last 2 years anyone on pass get ready if you are on gps hang on it only gets better. hope all of you have a good sence of humor.
RockdaleEddie
Optimized
I work as a driver in central IL and have one of those bonus routes. I did my route by the book and got a fair allowance and my short cuts are my business. My customers have no concerns and have a great relationship with all of them. Figure it out and bonus can be a very profitable thing. I say it is not our game it is there game...Game on!
New Englander
Well-Known Member
Wouldn't it also include less drivers collecting pension?
UPS Lifer
Well-Known Member
Bottom Line - Why would any driver refuse extra money (bonus) for working under allowed?
If you are a scratch or over-allowed driver you don't get bonus but why would you want to take that away from some one else who wants to make bonus?
I do see a legitimate argument from a union official's perspective. No bonus system means more drivers on the payroll which = more dues! It isn't going to change the pension but it will add to the fat cat's coffers.
If the company can continue to be lean and mean, it may be around another 100 years which means ... so will the union and so will all our pensions.
I don't know... It is probably the ex-California mentality kicking in! LOL!
If you are a scratch or over-allowed driver you don't get bonus but why would you want to take that away from some one else who wants to make bonus?
I do see a legitimate argument from a union official's perspective. No bonus system means more drivers on the payroll which = more dues! It isn't going to change the pension but it will add to the fat cat's coffers.
If the company can continue to be lean and mean, it may be around another 100 years which means ... so will the union and so will all our pensions.
I don't know... It is probably the ex-California mentality kicking in! LOL!
What'dyabringmetoday???
Well-Known Member
Perhaps something else is kicking in.
UPS VETTE,
You must think that I am anti-union from my post. Far from it. I truly believe in the concept of Unions. I was born into a Teamster household. My father was a Teamster shop steward. One of my uncles also was a Teamster shop steward. Another of my uncles was the Teamster Business Agent for UPS, who by the way was responsible for me becoming a driver for UPS in the first place.
Your post reminds of Marisa Tomei in "My Cousin Vinny"
Lisa ... "My father was a mechanic. His father was a mechanic. My mother's father was a mechanic. My 3 brothers are mechanics. Four uncles on my father's side are mechanics."
Thanks for reminding me of one of my favorite movies.
And great post by the way.
You must think that I am anti-union from my post. Far from it. I truly believe in the concept of Unions. I was born into a Teamster household. My father was a Teamster shop steward. One of my uncles also was a Teamster shop steward. Another of my uncles was the Teamster Business Agent for UPS, who by the way was responsible for me becoming a driver for UPS in the first place.
Your post reminds of Marisa Tomei in "My Cousin Vinny"
Lisa ... "My father was a mechanic. His father was a mechanic. My mother's father was a mechanic. My 3 brothers are mechanics. Four uncles on my father's side are mechanics."
Thanks for reminding me of one of my favorite movies.
And great post by the way.
soberups
Pees in the brown Koolaid
I might support the idea of bonus if there was an impartial and trustworthy entity doing the time studies upon which the bonus would be based, and some sort of contractual language that spelled out how and when a bonus would be paid. Only an idiot would trust UPS to create a fair and realistic time standard.
The reality of bonus...is that it is little more than a cash bribe being paid to the driver to falsify his timecard and indicate that he took a lunch when in fact he did not. The purpose of bonus is not to "benefit" the driver...it is to reduce paid overtime, reduce pension contributions, reduce the number of bid routes and reduce the number of employees on the payroll.
To characterize union officials who oppose bonus as "fat cats" worried about their "coffers" displays an obvious predjudice towards unions and an ignorant belief in stereotypes. Do you also believe in the stereotype that all black people like watermelon, or that all successful career women are man-hating bitches? Please....lets keep the stupid stereotypes in the "B" movies where they belong.
