Why Senior Employees Should Be Pro-Union

[vantexan]

Not in this case. 50% signed cards means a guaranteed victory. 35% is a crap shoot.

But if you only needed 35% to sign then you could hold a vote which you'd win most likely as it's just a simple majority of 1 needed. Having to get half of all couriers to sign before holding a vote means going into anti-union areas and trying to convince people. Believe it or not many couriers don't see it the way you do. That's why moving the % from 35% to 50% made it much more difficult.

 

[MAKAVELI]

Not in this case. 50% signed cards means a guaranteed victory. 35% is a crap shoot.

But if you only needed 35% to sign then you could hold a vote which you'd win most likely as it's just a simple majority of 1 needed. Having to get half of all couriers to sign before holding a vote means going into anti-union areas and trying to convince people. Believe it or not many couriers don't see it the way you do. That's why moving the % from 35% to 50% made it much more difficult.

Again, is it an uphill battle? Definitely. Is it still possible? Definitely. There will always be some that are against any union representation. Each person has to decide for themselves if they want to accept the way FedEx does business and be treated with disrespect and not deserve anything for your hard work. Or you can stand up for yourself and demand to be heard. I'll choose the latter. Things are not going to get any better without representation. Only worse. I'll say it again. The biggest obstacle we face is not Fred S, or the RLA. It's ourselves. If everyone thinks like you that it's impossible then Fred wins.

 

[MrFedEx]

But everyone knows the Republicans are anti-union. Our only chance to get a union in at Express was if the Democrats got control of both houses of Congress and the Presidency. They had 2 years to get it done but kept kicking the can down the road with Fred S's assistance. Bottom line, no chance to get a union in. But y'all go ahead and prove me wrong. Get that union in. Too late for me, but would still get a kick out of seeing it happen. I'd be willing to bet that it won't happen though.

You're right about weak-kneed Democrats failing with the FAA Act, failing with Card Check, and failing in general to support labor. Obama has been miserably weak when it comes to supporting pro-union legislation. Republicans hate unions as a matter of principle, and having a Republican House means little chance of relief.

So where does that leave us? On our own, and we have to do the best with what we have.

But being passive/aggressive about unionizing isn't helpful either. If you want a union, you're going to have to get dirty and take some chances. You want a union, and criticize FedEx for being the oppressive employer that is is, and then rationalize that poor Fred cannot afford to pay us more and that the economy is bad etc. Which is it?

Sooner or late you have to pull the trigger.

 

[vantexan]

You're right about weak-kneed Democrats failing with the FAA Act, failing with Card Check, and failing in general to support labor. Obama has been miserably weak when it comes to supporting pro-union legislation. Republicans hate unions as a matter of principle, and having a Republican House means little chance of relief.

So where does that leave us? On our own, and we have to do the best with what we have.

But being passive/aggressive about unionizing isn't helpful either. If you want a union, you're going to have to get dirty and take some chances. You want a union, and criticize FedEx for being the oppressive employer that is is, and then rationalize that poor Fred cannot afford to pay us more and that the economy is bad etc. Which is it?

Sooner or late you have to pull the trigger.

My point about pay is people falsely believe that FedEx can pay just as much as UPS, it's just a matter of forcing them to with a union. Unless FedEx becomes something close to what UPS is, it won't be able to pay that kind of pay and benefits. And FedEx is moving towards a UPS model but with severely underpaid, no benefits workers. You'll have Ground vs Express and since it's Ground that will produce the bulk of the profit they'll be the ones that get rewarded first, and most. Everything the company is doing with Express points toward keeping a union out, and minimizing it's effect if it gets in. It's all academic for me, I'll be gone before y'all can get a union going. But it looks like alot of wasted effort from this angle. If you think you can pull it off go for it.

 

[MrFedEx]

My point about pay is people falsely believe that FedEx can pay just as much as UPS, it's just a matter of forcing them to with a union. Unless FedEx becomes something close to what UPS is, it won't be able to pay that kind of pay and benefits. And FedEx is moving towards a UPS model but with severely underpaid, no benefits workers. You'll have Ground vs Express and since it's Ground that will produce the bulk of the profit they'll be the ones that get rewarded first, and most. Everything the company is doing with Express points toward keeping a union out, and minimizing it's effect if it gets in. It's all academic for me, I'll be gone before y'all can get a union going. But it looks like alot of wasted effort from this angle. If you think you can pull it off go for it.

Fred can buy lots of new planes and vehicles. He can pay himself and his upper crust buddies exorbitant salaries. He continues to purchase other companies, particularly off-shore, and he takes care of his pilot buddies. He has saved hundreds of millions by killing the pension, screwing us with market levels and glacial wage progression, and his opcos have been very profitable, except for Kinko's.

Nobody, including me, has ever said we were going to get UPS-level wages, but we should be pretty close, especially based on current demands to perform at even higher levels. Even if we did get UPS wages, we're still paying for expensice medical and have a crap "pension" plan. If you add-up how much less we are paid, taking into account the things I just mentioned, the compensation disparity is huge...and growing.

Fred can afford to pay more. We need to do whatever it takes to make that happen.

Don't make excuses for what Fred has done to us.

 

[vantexan]

Fred can buy lots of new planes and vehicles. He can pay himself and his upper crust buddies exorbitant salaries. He continues to purchase other companies, particularly off-shore, and he takes care of his pilot buddies. He has saved hundreds of millions by killing the pension, screwing us with market levels and glacial wage progression, and his opcos have been very profitable, except for Kinko's.

Nobody, including me, has ever said we were going to get UPS-level wages, but we should be pretty close, especially based on current demands to perform at even higher levels. Even if we did get UPS wages, we're still paying for expensice medical and have a crap "pension" plan. If you add-up how much less we are paid, taking into account the things I just mentioned, the compensation disparity is huge...and growing.

Fred can afford to pay more. We need to do whatever it takes to make that happen.

Don't make excuses for what Fred has done to us.

Not making excuses, just being realistic. Alot of those purchases you mention involve the company taking on debt to pay for them. They don't just pay cash. And new planes and vehicles need to be bought from time to time. He doesn't completely replace our fleet when he purchases new planes, just replaces as needed and the newer purchases are for more economical operating planes. Purchasing new companies, just as in the past, opens up new avenues of growth and profit. They can't all be winners, Kinko's being a prime example. By channeling most of the company's revenue into payroll how are you going to replace needed equipment?

Any union negotiations will at some point involve better benefits, especially medical and pension. And I'm assuming you'll have one payscale across the board which would bring up many couriers $12-$15hr above their current pay. So you're going to pay a courier $30,000 more a year on just 40 hrs? Jackpot!

As is FedEx could do better by us. But nowhere near what you guys believe they can do. If they operate much like UPS they can do much better, but most of it will most likely go to Ground to keep building them up and making their drivers happier.

 

[MAKAVELI]

Fred can buy lots of new planes and vehicles. He can pay himself and his upper crust buddies exorbitant salaries. He continues to purchase other companies, particularly off-shore, and he takes care of his pilot buddies. He has saved hundreds of millions by killing the pension, screwing us with market levels and glacial wage progression, and his opcos have been very profitable, except for Kinko's.

Nobody, including me, has ever said we were going to get UPS-level wages, but we should be pretty close, especially based on current demands to perform at even higher levels. Even if we did get UPS wages, we're still paying for expensice medical and have a crap "pension" plan. If you add-up how much less we are paid, taking into account the things I just mentioned, the compensation disparity is huge...and growing.

Fred can afford to pay more. We need to do whatever it takes to make that happen.

Don't make excuses for what Fred has done to us.

Not making excuses, just being realistic. Alot of those purchases you mention involve the company taking on debt to pay for them. They don't just pay cash. And new planes and vehicles need to be bought from time to time. He doesn't completely replace our fleet when he purchases new planes, just replaces as needed and the newer purchases are for more economical operating planes. Purchasing new companies, just as in the past, opens up new avenues of growth and profit. They can't all be winners, Kinko's being a prime example. By channeling most of the company's revenue into payroll how are you going to replace needed equipment?

Any union negotiations will at some point involve better benefits, especially medical and pension. And I'm assuming you'll have one payscale across the board which would bring up many couriers $12-$15hr above their current pay. So you're going to pay a courier $30,000 more a year on just 40 hrs? Jackpot!

As is FedEx could do better by us. But nowhere near what you guys believe they can do. If they operate much like UPS they can do much better, but most of it will most likely go to Ground to keep building them up and making their drivers happier.

You just fell for the anti union propaganda. Hook, line, sinker. Nobody in their right mind would expect a jump in pay of $ 30,000 in one contract let alone one year. The whole point in contract negotiations is to improve what we have from contract to contract. Just because we have representation doesn't mean FedEx is going to fold and make us all able to buy Mercedes and big Chevy trucks. Having a a contract would mean the company would have to set aside some of their billions in profit for wages and benefits. It's called the cost of doing business. The contract would be negotiated to be fair for both workers and company. If FedEx had just stopped taking from its workers a while back I don't think we would be having this conversation right now. Sure some people would never be happy with what they get but that is a two way street. The company will never be happy with the amount of profit they make. There has to be a balance there.

 

[vantexan]

You just fell for the anti union propaganda. Hook, line, sinker. Nobody in their right mind would expect a jump in pay of $ 30,000 in one contract let alone one year. The whole point in contract negotiations is to improve what we have from contract to contract. Just because we have representation doesn't mean FedEx is going to fold and make us all able to buy Mercedes and big Chevy trucks. Having a a contract would mean the company would have to set aside some of their billions in profit for wages and benefits. It's called the cost of doing business. The contract would be negotiated to be fair for both workers and company. If FedEx had just stopped taking from its workers a while back I don't think we would be having this conversation right now. Sure some people would never be happy with what they get but that is a two way street. The company will never be happy with the amount of profit they make. There has to be a balance there.

One of the things railed against here is the number of payscales instead of having one hourly pay for everyone like UPS does with it's 5 year contracts. Another thing is the amount of time needed to top out. Well let's say the union negotiated pay to $30hr after 3 years from being hired. Someone currently at $15hr and already at 3 years would see his pay go up over $31,000 a year after getting a $15hr raise with the new union contract. That's an extreme example, but plenty would see their pay go up $10hr, even more. $10hr would increase pay over $20k on 40 hours. If you say ok, $27hr, why would those in the highest 2 payscales support a union and pay dues if their pay isn't going to go up significantly if they are already topped out? Not that the company has the $Billions to pay all that, but why let a little math get in the way?

 

[MAKAVELI]

You just fell for the anti union propaganda. Hook, line, sinker. Nobody in their right mind would expect a jump in pay of $ 30,000 in one contract let alone one year. The whole point in contract negotiations is to improve what we have from contract to contract. Just because we have representation doesn't mean FedEx is going to fold and make us all able to buy Mercedes and big Chevy trucks. Having a a contract would mean the company would have to set aside some of their billions in profit for wages and benefits. It's called the cost of doing business. The contract would be negotiated to be fair for both workers and company. If FedEx had just stopped taking from its workers a while back I don't think we would be having this conversation right now. Sure some people would never be happy with what they get but that is a two way street. The company will never be happy with the amount of profit they make. There has to be a balance there.

One of the things railed against here is the number of payscales instead of having one hourly pay for everyone like UPS does with it's 5 year contracts. Another thing is the amount of time needed to top out. Well let's say the union negotiated pay to $30hr after 3 years from being hired. Someone currently at $15hr and already at 3 years would see his pay go up over $31,000 a year after getting a $15hr raise with the new union contract. That's an extreme example, but plenty would see their pay go up $10hr, even more. $10hr would increase pay over $20k on 40 hours. If you say ok, $27hr, why would those in the highest 2 payscales support a union and pay dues if their pay isn't going to go up significantly if they are already topped out? Not that the company has the $Billions to pay all that, but why let a little math get in the way?

You are really reaching bro. We would not get 30 in the first contract and topout probably closer to 10 years. Topout could be phased in . All these things are negotiated and nobody here is saying that we would get UPS pay. You are just repeating the fear mongering that the company spews out. What UPS has in its contract doesn't equate to what we would get especially a first contract. Here is my example. What if pay was equal per your job title based on years of service. Setting aside the different pay scales right now, which is a joke right now. Topout could be phased in during the length of the contract.Increases in medical benefits and retirement over the life of the contract. Again all this is negotiated as far as amounts. The company doesn't care how the money is spent, they only look at it in terms of $ per hour per employee. I don't think that is asking for the world for a company that is in the top 100 of the Fortune 500 list.

 

[MAKAVELI]

Somebody brought it up in another thread when discussing organizing another company. Number one question was how much they would make. Honest organizers had to say they had no idea. Negotiating is from square one

This is one the biggest lies these union buster throw out there to put fear in union supporters. It is illegal to for a company to say you will be negotiating from scratch. A first contract will start at what pay and benefits you have currently. Then you negotiate changes from there.

 

[FedExcrement]

But everyone knows the Republicans are anti-union. Our only chance to get a union in at Express was if the Democrats got control of both houses of Congress and the Presidency. They had 2 years to get it done but kept kicking the can down the road with Fred S's assistance. Bottom line, no chance to get a union in. But y'all go ahead and prove me wrong. Get that union in. Too late for me, but would still get a kick out of seeing it happen. I'd be willing to bet that it won't happen though.

Talk about a Debbie Downer...Ive followed this site and seen your posts for years and I have to say im disappointed with your posts the past few days...All your negative posts trying to trick people or discourage them from doing something about our ever degrading working conditions is sad....You seem as Pro-Fedex as Management....No one is asking for the things you are posting...It baffles me as to why you would do this....Company Plant? Argue to Argue? A Hater since your on your way out and that you would miss out on finally being treated fairly if the miracle could be pulled off??

What better plan do you have?? I would rather try for something better for my family,Win or Lose then to just come on this forum and bark with no bite...

 

[MAKAVELI]

But everyone knows the Republicans are anti-union. Our only chance to get a union in at Express was if the Democrats got control of both houses of Congress and the Presidency. They had 2 years to get it done but kept kicking the can down the road with Fred S's assistance. Bottom line, no chance to get a union in. But y'all go ahead and prove me wrong. Get that union in. Too late for me, but would still get a kick out of seeing it happen. I'd be willing to bet that it won't happen though.

Talk about a Debbie Downer...Ive followed this site and seen your posts for years and I have to say im disappointed with your posts the past few days...All your negative posts trying to trick people or discourage them from doing something about our ever degrading working conditions is sad....You seem as Pro-Fedex as Management....No one is asking for the things you are posting...It baffles me as to why you would do this....Company Plant? Argue to Argue? A Hater since your on your way out and that you would miss out on finally being treated fairly if the miracle could be pulled off??

What better plan do you have?? I would rather try for something better for my family,Win or Lose then to just come on this forum and bark with no bite...

Yea he has certainly changed his tune. Management probably put the fear of god in him. You know, unions are evil, we are a poor company who really can't afford to pay our employees, we'll go bankrupt if the union is voted in, we don't need a third party to get involved, the teamsters just want your dues, etc, etc.

 

[Ricochet1a]

All this back and forth completely misses the point for the Express wage employee.

Things are getting worse, not better. Things aren't going to get better, they are only going to continue to get worse.

Go back to 2009, when Fred kicked his 'shearing operation' into high gear. Have things gotten worse or remained about the same in the past 4 years? Do you think things will remain as they are now, or will they continue to get worse?

If you answered, "Got/get worse" to both questions - then by necessity you are faced with one of two possible courses of action. Either get the hell out of Express as soon as you can (there are greener pastures out there, believe me), OR end the denial and excuse making and start organizing. It is as simple as that, no further debate needed.

You don't need a MBA to realize that Express is pulling a monumental 'fast one' on its wage employees, and that Express - if forced into the corner of a negotiating table - could substantially sweeten its compensation package for its career wage employees. The debate as to whether that amount would be equal to UPS compensation is irrelevant - the issue is that the compensation would RISE in comparison to what is currently being offered. Comparing what Express employees would get in a INITIAL labor contract to what UPS has in their current labor contract is a classic 'red herring' You would NOT get what UPS has in their contract - but that doesn't change the fact one bit that you (as an Express wage employee) would get MORE that you are getting now.

Just because the Wright brothers couldn't make the first aircraft they designed capable of flying across the Atlantic, didn't mean that they should've given up trying to fly in the first place ("Orville, we just can't fly across the Atlantic in this thing we have, so let's go back to making bicycles and leave it at that").

As an Express wage employee, right now you are focused on just trying to get off the ground. MAYBE in the coming years, after having gotten into the air, then you can start looking to get across the Atlantic in one flight. Your goal right now is to get into the air, not to cross the Atlantic. DON'T listen to the 'nay sayers' that focus on the fact that you don't stand a snowball's change in hell of getting across the Atlantic right now - they are right, you don't stand a snowball's chance in hell in getting across the Atlantic RIGHT NOW. Your focus is on getting off the ground and getting some experience in 'flying', and who knows, in the future, you may very well be on your way across the Atlantic non-stop.

I will tell you this (I've said this well over a year ago), ONCE Dynamic ROADS is fully implemented and reasonably perfected, it IS OVER for you as a Courier. If you are in a station right now that is working up DRA, you realize what a threat DRA is to the career Courier. Express is having a hell of a time getting it to work correctly, but they are making steady progress. With DRA, they will no longer need a Courier that is capable of any thinking whatsoever. Pull the freight that has the route number on it (already perfected), look at the stop order number on the tag (work in progress), then place the freight in your truck in sequential order (again, work in progress). Follow the delivery manifest on the powerpad, pull the pieces that match with the stop number - proceed to next stop. Continue till the truck is empty then RTB.

With a reasonably perfected DRA, if Express Couriers were to organize, Fred would merely declare a lock out, pull in Ground drivers who could pass the background, residency, drug, credit, criminal record, tattoo checks and get his volume off. He'd immediately pull the trigger on getting non-overnight volume over to Ground to deliver, and since DRA is so simple that virtually anyone that can lift a package and drive a truck can use it - he'd get in replacement workers (scabs) to fill in any remaining vacancies. Then he'd offer incentives to any represented Couriers to cross the picket line in order to effectively break any strike. It would be OVER for the career Courier.

That is why time is rapidly RUNNING OUT for you. Every day you delay, you play Fred's game. You give him more time to perfect his plans to make you obsolete - and capable of ignoring any potentially organized workforce with a lockout.

I'll say it again, if you can't get out of Express and have no choice but to make Express your career, you by NECESSITY are compelled to organize and do it now. Delays are only hurting you, NOT Fred.

Those wage employees who are doing everything they can to argue against a union are looking at their self interests. They want to ride it out till THEY can leave/retire from Express, then those in their 20s and 30s are on their own to face Fred - bye bye suckers.... They know they are at risk of injury of having some issue come up which could result in their losing Express employment, but they are of they opinion that if they 'play it safe' they can make it through till THEY are ready to leave, then to hell with those left behind.

 

[MAKAVELI]

All this back and forth completely misses the point for the Express wage employee.

Things are getting worse, not better. Things aren't going to get better, they are only going to continue to get worse.

Go back to 2009, when Fred kicked his 'shearing operation' into high gear. Have things gotten worse or remained about the same in the past 4 years? Do you think things will remain as they are now, or will they continue to get worse?

If you answered, "Got/get worse" to both questions - then by necessity you are faced with one of two possible courses of action. Either get the hell out of Express as soon as you can (there are greener pastures out there, believe me), OR end the denial and excuse making and start organizing. It is as simple as that, no further debate needed.

You don't need a MBA to realize that Express is pulling a monumental 'fast one' on its wage employees, and that Express - if forced into the corner of a negotiating table - could substantially sweeten its compensation package for its career wage employees. The debate as to whether that amount would be equal to UPS compensation is irrelevant - the issue is that the compensation would RISE in comparison to what is currently being offered. Comparing what Express employees would get in a INITIAL labor contract to what UPS has in their current labor contract is a classic 'red herring' You would NOT get what UPS has in their contract - but that doesn't change the fact one bit that you (as an Express wage employee) would get MORE that you are getting now.

Just because the Wright brothers couldn't make the first aircraft they designed capable of flying across the Atlantic, didn't mean that they should've given up trying to fly in the first place ("Orville, we just can't fly across the Atlantic in this thing we have, so let's go back to making bicycles and leave it at that").

As an Express wage employee, right now you are focused on just trying to get off the ground. MAYBE in the coming years, after having gotten into the air, then you can start looking to get across the Atlantic in one flight. Your goal right now is to get into the air, not to cross the Atlantic. DON'T listen to the 'nay sayers' that focus on the fact that you don't stand a snowball's change in hell of getting across the Atlantic right now - they are right, you don't stand a snowball's chance in hell in getting across the Atlantic RIGHT NOW. Your focus is on getting off the ground and getting some experience in 'flying', and who knows, in the future, you may very well be on your way across the Atlantic non-stop.

I will tell you this (I've said this well over a year ago), ONCE Dynamic ROADS is fully implemented and reasonably perfected, it IS OVER for you as a Courier. If you are in a station right now that is working up DRA, you realize what a threat DRA is to the career Courier. Express is having a hell of a time getting it to work correctly, but they are making steady progress. With DRA, they will no longer need a Courier that is capable of any thinking whatsoever. Pull the freight that has the route number on it (already perfected), look at the stop order number on the tag (work in progress), then place the freight in your truck in sequential order (again, work in progress). Follow the delivery manifest on the powerpad, pull the pieces that match with the stop number - proceed to next stop. Continue till the truck is empty then RTB.

With a reasonably perfected DRA, if Express Couriers were to organize, Fred would merely declare a lock out, pull in Ground drivers who could pass the background, residency, drug, credit, criminal record, tattoo checks and get his volume off. He'd immediately pull the trigger on getting non-overnight volume over to Ground to deliver, and since DRA is so simple that virtually anyone that can lift a package and drive a truck can use it - he'd get in replacement workers (scabs) to fill in any remaining vacancies. Then he'd offer incentives to any represented Couriers to cross the picket line in order to effectively break any strike. It would be OVER for the career Courier.

That is why time is rapidly RUNNING OUT for you. Every day you delay, you play Fred's game. You give him more time to perfect his plans to make you obsolete - and capable of ignoring any potentially organized workforce with a lockout.

I'll say it again, if you can't get out of Express and have no choice but to make Express your career, you by NECESSITY are compelled to organize and do it now. Delays are only hurting you, NOT Fred.

Those wage employees who are doing everything they can to argue against a union are looking at their self interests. They want to ride it out till THEY can leave/retire from Express, then those in their 20s and 30s are on their own to face Fred - bye bye suckers.... They know they are at risk of injury of having some issue come up which could result in their losing Express employment, but they are of they opinion that if they 'play it safe' they can make it through till THEY are ready to leave, then to hell with those left behind.

Very well put. In other words you can either live on your knees or die on your feet.

 

[Ricochet1a]

Yea he has certainly changed his tune. Management probably put the fear of god in him. You know, unions are evil, we are a poor company who really can't afford to pay our employees, we'll go bankrupt if the union is voted in, we don't need a third party two get involved, the teamsters just want your dues, etc, etc.

He hasn't changed his tune one bit. You need to go WAY BACK in posting history to get his angle. Whenever there is some remotely serious talk of organizing, he gets all nervous that things MIGHT just actually change, placing HIS little scheme to survive Express at risk. He wants to be paid more, but he is in no way willing to risk what he has, in order to get it.

His whole angle is that he has been morally wronged by Express, since HE has put out so much effort for Express over the years (he is super Courier after all), that he DESERVES better compensation. The rest of you can fend for yourselves, since you haven't gone through as much blood, sweat and tears as he has for Fred. He deserves more, the rest of you... He'll come up with any excuse he can to try to prevent the rest of you from rocking the boat too much, since that might threaten his plan to run away to some far off land when he can be super Courier no more.

He'll get on here and bitch and moan about the compensation, working conditions, etc., but no way in hell does he want a union to get into Express until AFTER he is long gone. He came right out and admitted years ago that he was 'glad that a union didn't get into Express'. He ISN'T your ally in attempting to get Express organized, he is an enabler of Fred, since he wants the status quo to exist till he can get out. Oh yes, he'll bitch and moan with the rest of you when it comes to pay and benefits, but should talk of the Couriers actually doing something to address it comes up, he'll flip on his back, wet himself and start spouting corporate talking points.

 

[bbsam]

This is one the biggest lies these union buster throw out there to put fear in union supporters. It is illegal to for a company to say you will be negotiating from scratch. A first contract will start at what pay and benefits you have currently. Then you negotiate changes from there.

That is absolutely, positively incorrect. You are talking about a contract and nobody is required to start anywhere. You are either pulling things out of your ass or simply lying to fortify your own position.

 

[Ricochet1a]

That is absolutely, positively incorrect. You are talking about a contract and nobody is required to start anywhere. You are either pulling things out of your ass or simply lying to fortify your own position.

On this one, you are incorrect. Negotiating labor contracts are unlike any other contract. There are specific rules and procedures under NLRA

National Labor Relations Act | NLRB

Specifically....

(d) [Obligation to bargain collectively] For the purposes of this section, to bargain collectively is the performance of the mutual obligation of the employer and the representative of the employees to meet at reasonable times and confer in good faith with respect to wages, hours, and other terms and conditions of employment, or the negotiation of an agreement or any question arising thereunder, and the execution of a written contract incorporating any agreement reached if requested by either party, but such obligation does not compel either party to agree to a proposal or require the making of a concession: Provided, That where there is in effect a collective- bargaining contract covering employees in an industry affecting commerce, the duty to bargain collectively shall also mean that no party to such contract shall terminate or modify such contract, unless the party desiring such termination or modification--


An employer entering into the very structured bargaining process by attempting to state, "We start at minimum wage and go from there", is not bargaining in good faith. Don't want to get into a convoluted legal argument - since it would serve no purpose, but rest assured, the 'starting point' in the bargaining process under NLRA/RLA is current wages, hours, and other terms and conditions of employment. The organized employee's don't start from 'scratch'.

 

[MAKAVELI]

This is one the biggest lies these union buster throw out there to put fear in union supporters. It is illegal to for a company to say you will be negotiating from scratch. A first contract will start at what pay and benefits you have currently. Then you negotiate changes from there.

That is absolutely, positively incorrect. You are talking about a contract and nobody is required to start anywhere. You are either pulling things out of your ass or simply lying to fortify your own position.

Look it up bro. It's the law. Your employer can not intimidate you into not voting a union in. What you are talking about is intimidation.

 

[Ricochet1a]

The Railway Labor Act

§ 152. General duties
First. Duty of carriers and employees to settle disputes
It shall be the duty of all carriers, their officers, agents, and employees to exert every reasonable effort to make and maintain agreements concerning rates of pay, rules, and working conditions, and to settle all disputes, whether arising out of the application of such agreements or otherwise, in order to avoid any interruption to commerce or to the operation of any carrier growing out of any dispute between the carrier and the employees thereof.

Carriers are companies covered under RLA (Express for instance)

'Carriers' can't threaten to cut existing pay and benefits as a consequence of being forced into collective bargaining. This was one of the major sticking points in the legislation back when it was originally passed, it COMPELLED employers to take certain actions which would NOT usually be in their best interest in a contract negotiation.

 

[MAKAVELI]

Any other lie you want to put out there bb? A worker who knows his rights is terrible thing isn't it?