Contract Boogieman

[panther]

Totally valid. That is if you don’t already have a two tier driver. Many areas already have them for a long time and as you can see from this thread they are called by different names and use different rules depending on the area. 22.4 is basically a better two tier language for people that have them and makes it a universal name. Do you know how many people regurgitated the TDU flyer saying “22.4 driver are two tier, $6 bucks less doing sane work, no 9.5 protection and gonna steal our work”.
The reality is here we already have a two tier driver. For 2/3 of the members they have been living with that position since they started work at UPS and the other 1/3 voted it in back in 1997. Now right, wrong or indifferent my answer is truth “We already have a two tier driver that make $10 less an hour doing the same work, making part time pension,no 9.5 protection and we had them 20 years and we still have plenty of work.” So as you see it is an upgrade here in pay, pension and progression pay.
In short if you never had a two tier driver in your supplements or riders it is a big no no for you but if you do have them it makes for an improvement. The 22.4 language did not change any workday workweek rules in the country but it exposes regions that don’t have strong workweeks guarantees like we have here. So once again it really depends on language you have and on your supplements and riders

Lets pretend for a second the only thing you had to vote on was the master. no supplements or riders. How would you vote? Yes or no?

 

[LagunaBrown]

Lets pretend for a second the only thing you had to vote on was the master. no supplements or riders. How would you vote? Yes or no?

No offense but this is hard enough for people to grasp without pretending and opens a rabbit hole of what if’s.

 

[Bubblehead]

Lets pretend for a second the only thing you had to vote on was the master. no supplements or riders. How would you vote? Yes or no?

No offense but this is hard enough for people to grasp without pretending and opens a rabbit hole of what if’s.

No....it's really just that simple.

....at least it is supposed to be, "Me-ster"???

 

[LagunaBrown]

No....it's really just that simple.

....at least it is supposed to be, "Me-ster"???

Funny because from where I am standing YOUR the Me-ster that wants me to sell out my family, my retirees and my co workers in the west for you. How long till you want our pension money to bail you out too. Get lost.

 

[DELACROIX]

What would happen to you and your family if these tentative contract is voted down? The Western's pension benefit is almost twice that of what we would get under the IBT/UPS pension with the same number of service years. Those earned service years are protected under ERISA laws and will grow considering the amount of contributions that it will receive.

We been told that UPS is paying 22 dollars per hour divided equally into our Pension and Health and Welfare benefits. If that is true why is it that the IBT/UPS pension benefits not up to those in the Western conference, or why we have not see a major increase beyond 400 dollars in 2020?

It is not your money that will bail out the Central, that money is supposedly being contributed by the company. It is the SAME monetary contributions that you get in the West, it has nothing to do with taking money from you to help another brother or sister. It is a matter of getting a straight answer to where that money is going or went off to.

Bottom line is for anybody in the Central or South under the IBT/UPS pension plan thinking of retirement who votes for this Master or Central Supplement would be plain stupid. I am glad you are secure with your pension benefits, like I have stated earlier if we in the Central and South had your pension formula I would probably vote "yes" too. We don't and the reasons for that have never been explained.

 

[LagunaBrown]

Keeping it real

 

[Bubblehead]

View attachment 208623
Keeping it real

Just because your Local and Region weren't successful in preventing the Company from using these "Cover Drivers" outside of the prescribed time frames, doesn't justify this carte blanche 22.4 year round language.

It's garbage language and we all know it.

 

[Mooseknuckle]

Just because your Local and Region weren't successful in preventing the Company from using these "Cover Drivers" outside of the prescribed time frames, doesn't justify this carte blanche 22.4 year round language.

It's garbage language and we all know it.

Amen!!!!

 

[Mooseknuckle]

What would happen to you and your family if these tentative contract is voted down? The Western's pension benefit is almost twice that of what we would get under the IBT/UPS pension with the same number of service years. Those earned service years are protected under ERISA laws and will grow considering the amount of contributions that it will receive.

We been told that UPS is paying 22 dollars per hour divided equally into our Pension and Health and Welfare benefits. If that is true why is it that the IBT/UPS pension benefits not up to those in the Western conference, or why we have not see a major increase beyond 400 dollars in 2020?

It is not your money that will bail out the Central, that money is supposedly being contributed by the company. It is the SAME monetary contributions that you get in the West, it has nothing to do with taking money from you to help another brother or sister. It is a matter of getting a straight answer to where that money is going or went off to.

Bottom line is for anybody in the Central or South under the IBT/UPS pension plan thinking of retirement who votes for this Master or Central Supplement would be plain stupid. I am glad you are secure with your pension benefits, like I have stated earlier if we in the Central and South had your pension formula I would probably vote "yes" too. We don't and the reasons for that have never been explained.

I hope you know that there are plenty of us in the west that totally agree with you.

 

[LagunaBrown]

Just because your Local and Region weren't successful in preventing the Company from using these "Cover Drivers" outside of the prescribed time frames, doesn't justify this carte blanche 22.4 year round language.

It's garbage language and we all know it.

What time frame is that? Once again your making crap up. This is language that has been in since our strike in 1997. That’s 20 years already!!!! The fact is is Today, RIGHT NOW, this contract it is an upgade to that position no matter how you try to spin it. If you vote no you get less. Anyone that agrees to your comment is clueless to reality.

 

[542thruNthru]

We been told that UPS is paying 22 dollars per hour divided equally into our Pension and Health and Welfare benefits. If that is true why is it that the IBT/UPS pension benefits not up to those in the Western conference, or why we have not see a major increase beyond 400 dollars in 2020?

Do you have a lot of orphans on your plan? Companies that are no longer contributing?
Your pension is multi-employer right?

 

[Pizza]

What time frame is that? Once again your making crap up. This is language that has been in since our strike in 1997. That’s 20 years already!!!! The fact is is Today, RIGHT NOW, this contract it is an upgade to that position no matter how you try to spin it. If you vote no you get less. Anyone that agrees to your comment is clueless to reality.

If the company already has the same thing in a PT cover driver why do they want 22.4's?

 

[LagunaBrown]

If the company already has the same thing in a PT cover driver why do they want 22.4's?

22.4’s are all about the Saturday and Sunday work. They have been forcing RPCD’s and cover drivers in at time and a halt. Even some 6 day punches.

 

[Pizza]

22.4’s are all about the Saturday and Sunday work. They have been forcing RPCD’s and cover drivers in at time and a halt. Even some 6 day punches.

Why are they forcing and not using the T-S guys?

 

[LagunaBrown]

Why are they forcing and not using the T-S guys?

Too much work. We have a big Center. Max Vacations and FHP’s is 19 drivers plus disability and FMLA. T-S get forced Monday.

 

[Pizza]

Too much work. We have a big Center. Max Vacations and FHP’s is 19 drivers plus disability and FMLA. T-S get forced Monday.

Still does not make sense. Why would the company put on a 22.4 when they can just put on another PT cover?

What I am asking is why is it more advantageous for the company to have a 22.4 that is guaranteed 40 and FT pension over PT cover.

 

[LagunaBrown]

Still does not make sense. Why would the company put on a 22.4 when they can just put on another PT cover?

What I am asking is why is it more advantageous for the company to have a 22.4 that is guaranteed 40 and FT pension over PT cover.

Is what I told you about eliminating weekend work for RPCD’s and eliminating overtime not enough of a reason? Like I said in another post they won’t hire more 22.4’s than they need on Saturday and if they didn’t try to phase out the RPCD with cover drivers what makes you think they would with a 22.4? Your see cars on road is a big factor.

 

[Bubblehead]

22.4’s are all about the Saturday and Sunday work. They have been forcing RPCD’s and cover drivers in at time and a halt. Even some 6 day punches.

Why has it never been a concern for feeder drivers who are required to work Saturdays and Sundays???
Where is the "concern" for the part time preloaders, who were hired originally for a Monday thru Friday schedule, who are now forced to work Saturdays?

Please stop patronizing fledgling package car drivers, still in progression, pretending to care if they are being made to work Saturdays.
It's a comical.
This whole weekend and excessive OT excuse, for the 22.4 proposal, is nothing more than a smoke screen for the biggest proposed concession of the millennium.

I say we vote down the Master and every other Supplement until 22.4 jobs are off the table and out of any contract.

@LagunaBrown is very conscious of the charms (emojis as he calls them) we award in these threads.
So lets show him where we are with this by lighting up this post with thumbs up (likes), green check mark (agrees), or even a gold star (winner)???

 

[Pizza]

Is what I told you about eliminating weekend work for RPCD’s and eliminating overtime not enough of a reason? Like I said in another post they won’t hire more 22.4’s than they need on Saturday and if they didn’t try to phase out the RPCD with cover drivers what makes you think they would with a 22.4? Your see cars on road is a big factor.

I don't know why anyone can not answer a simple question.

The company could eliminate overtime and weekend work with the PT cover language we have now and they have not done it.

Why would they do it with a higher cost employee?

 

[Bubblehead]

I don't know why anyone can not answer a simple question.

The company could eliminate overtime and weekend work with the PT cover language we have now and they have not done it.

Why would they do it with a higher cost employee?

Because the answer is not in line with the script he reads from.