Herman Cain

[moreluck]

Here trinklepinkle, from a Fox reporters own words :

Juan Williams is a writer, author and Fox News political analyst.

Juan was brought in from NPR.....remember, he got fired. He's always the counterpoint Democratic side (the liberal left)of the "fair & balanced" Fox. Again, 9-9-9 is just Phase 1 and not the "end all" plan, so why do you dwell on it ????

 

[over9five]

Juan was brought in from NPR.....remember, he got fired. He's always the counterpoint Democratic side (the liberal left)of the "fair & balanced" Fox. Again, 9-9-9 is just Phase 1 and not the "end all" plan, so why do you dwell on it ????

Maybe he's going to tax Canadians as well?

 

[toonertoo]

I like Juan basically I think he is a good person. He is right on a lot of stuff, I dont happen to agree on this one!

 

[trplnkl]

Here trinklepinkle, from a Fox reporters own words :

Juan Williams is a writer, author and Fox News political analyst.

ahhhh ahhhhh CHOOOOOO...someone pass me a Kleinex I need to blow my nose.

 

[wkmac]

First of all, because I have read Marx among many other alternative views does not mean I am a Marxist. I think Marx is bloody brilliant in some regards but unfortunately he is correlated with regimes which were twisted out of control and not the classical definition of socialsm.

Interestingly I find much more value in ideas such as Tuckers "Individual Liberty", than anything Marx

Secondly, you avoiding alternative views including Marx, does mean that you don't have any ground to argue with anyone about it. Speaking of slavery - in your posts, you prove over and over again to be a slave to the mainstream by not being able to address anything except mainstream.

Thirdly, our "superpower status" was, has and is clearly impinging on others rights, globally, and any type of "super power" will is nearly always going to reflect negatively upon others - aka forcing ones will into someone else's lives who don't want it there, which in effect speaks against everything you are saying.
Fourth, "President Cain" WOULD in fact promote others being slaves - no different than what has been going on for decades.
Being a slave to business and corporate political leaders, corporate lobbyists, big banks, big oil...it goes on and on... Be it big or small gov't, if you are an American and you support people like Herman Cain and Perry and ROmney , you are a slave to mainstream politics no matter how large or small the government entity. And mainstream politics, beliefs and ideas are where being a "slave" to something begins - so deep engrained, you're officially are no longer thinking for yourself without even knowing it.

Tucker is a lost American treasure IMO and his "unterrified Jeffersonianism" was so refreshing. Sad that contemporary America can't read and grasp the 19th century socialist that is Tucker who was also anti-state and radical laissez faire ie absolute freed markets from both the State and the control of the ruling class we call capitalist. Tucker saw no distinction between the State and the capitalist ruling class and from our 100 plus year perspective now, he was correct in doing so IMO. Sheldon Richman in writing for the Future of Freedom Foundation said the following concerning Tucker:

It is worth pointing out here that the word “socialism” also has undergone change from earlier days. Tucker, who proudly accepted the description “consistent Manchester man” (Manchesterism denoted the laissez-faire philosophy of the English free-traders Cobden and Bright), called himself a socialist. “Capitalism” was identified with state privileges for owners of capital to the detriment of workers, and hence was despised as an exploitative system. Interventions such as taxes, regulations, subsidies, tariffs, licensing, and land policy restricted competition and hence limited the demand for labor as well as opportunities for self-employment. Such measures reduced labor’s bargaining power and depressed wages, which for the Left libertarians constituted state-sponsored plunder. Their solution was a thoroughgoing laissez faire, freeing competition and maximizing workers’ bargaining power. (Unions were seen as a way for workers to help themselves, at least until laissez faire could be ushered in. Later, the big government-connected unions were suspected of being part of an effort to co-opt the labor movement and lull it safely into the establishment.)

Thanks for bringing up Tucker!

 

[klein]

So instead of Moose Tracks, it'll be Moose Tax ????

http://images.search.yahoo.com/imag...b=13hen515h&sigi=12sih41ng&.crumb=C00vTbAOHX1

Don't laugh, that's what a National Sales Tax does, including the moose tax.
Pay tax on the tag you need to hunt it, the taxes for gasoline to get there, the tax to lodge or camp, pay taxes on the bullets, guns, you need to kill it, pay taxes if you need to have the moose slaughtered or otherwise use a butcher or meat plant to cut it, or make burgers, sausages out of it.

Pay a "moose tax" to go see one at the zoo, or in a movie. Or if you just want to eat it at a restaurant.

Go vote for it, and then be happy.
Students and college goers should also become more indebt, as even paper, books, pens and pencils are subject to that 9% NST.
Oh yeah, even the bus ticket to get there is, too.

Why not take it even further and have Zero corperate taxes and make it a 15-15 plan ? 15% income taxes from gross earnings, and 15% everything you buy with a NST ?
Now you can really make the rich richer, and let the poor houses grow quicker !

 

[brett636]

First of all, because I have read Marx among many other alternative views does not mean I am a Marxist. I think Marx is bloody brilliant in some regards but unfortunately he is correlated with regimes which were twisted out of control and not the classical definition of socialsm.

Interestingly I find much more value in ideas such as Tuckers "Individual Liberty", than anything Marx

Secondly, you avoiding alternative views including Marx, does mean that you don't have any ground to argue with anyone about it. Speaking of slavery - in your posts, you prove over and over again to be a slave to the mainstream by not being able to address anything except mainstream.

Thirdly, our "superpower status" was, has and is clearly impinging on others rights, globally, and any type of "super power" will is nearly always going to reflect negatively upon others - aka forcing ones will into someone else's lives who don't want it there, which in effect speaks against everything you are saying.
Fourth, "President Cain" WOULD in fact promote others being slaves - no different than what has been going on for decades.
Being a slave to business and corporate political leaders, corporate lobbyists, big banks, big oil...it goes on and on... Be it big or small gov't, if you are an American and you support people like Herman Cain and Perry and ROmney , you are a slave to mainstream politics no matter how large or small the government entity. And mainstream politics, beliefs and ideas are where being a "slave" to something begins - so deep engrained, you're officially are no longer thinking for yourself without even knowing it.

I like how you deny being a Marxist then claim Karl Marx was "bloody brilliant". In theory perhaps he had something right, but in a practical sense he was a fool. The twisted regimes you speak of were merely his ideas being put into action in the real world, and the end result, millions upon millions killed, were the result of his "great" ideas up against the very core of human behavior. As imperfect as capitalism is, it is the best economic model the world has ever known in terms of its ability to allow the individual to choose how they want to live. Some only want to work for what they feel they need while others strive for more. In the end it is the free market economic model that determines who succeeds and who doesn't instead of some group of government bureaucrats only interested in maintaining and growing their own power.

Cain is probably the most ideal Presidential candidate because he does not have a political background, only real world experience with real world positive results to show for it. The best politician is someone who doesn't strive to be one, but is someone who understands that individual liberty is the core of a successful nation. This is where Karl Marx and his ideas failed because it will always lead to some politician who just desires more power and as the old saying goes "power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely" which leads to the logical conclusion of all true Communist regimes which is an oppressed people who live and die by the whims of their eccentric leaders.

As far as your ramblings about being a slave go I would also have to disagree. I am a slave to nobody whether it be a corporation, politician, or an ideal. A slave is someone who is forced into a situation that they would otherwise not wish to be in, and there is nothing about my life that falls into this definition. In your ideal world the average citizen would be forced to abide by the will of their government leaders whether they like it or not, and that is slavery no matter how you want to cut it.

 

[Babagounj]

Just got my cell phone bill;
Federal-Univ Serv Assess Non-LD { what ever that is }
Administrative Charge
Regulatory Charge

 

[wkmac]

I like how you deny being a Marxist then claim Karl Marx was "bloody brilliant". In theory perhaps he had something right, but in a practical sense he was a fool. The twisted regimes you speak of were merely his ideas being put into action in the real world, and the end result, millions upon millions killed, were the result of his "great" ideas up against the very core of human behavior. As imperfect as capitalism is, it is the best economic model the world has ever known in terms of its ability to allow the individual to choose how they want to live. Some only want to work for what they feel they need while others strive for more. In the end it is the free market economic model that determines who succeeds and who doesn't instead of some group of government bureaucrats only interested in maintaining and growing their own power.

Cain is probably the most ideal Presidential candidate because he does not have a political background, only real world experience with real world positive results to show for it. The best politician is someone who doesn't strive to be one, but is someone who understands that individual liberty is the core of a successful nation. This is where Karl Marx and his ideas failed because it will always lead to some politician who just desires more power and as the old saying goes "power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely" which leads to the logical conclusion of all true Communist regimes which is an oppressed people who live and die by the whims of their eccentric leaders.

As far as your ramblings about being a slave go I would also have to disagree. I am a slave to nobody whether it be a corporation, politician, or an ideal. A slave is someone who is forced into a situation that they would otherwise not wish to be in, and there is nothing about my life that falls into this definition. In your ideal world the average citizen would be forced to abide by the will of their government leaders whether they like it or not, and that is slavery no matter how you want to cut it.

[video=youtube;BbCG3cZBKrc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BbCG3cZBKrc[/video]

 

[UnconTROLLed]

[video=youtube;BbCG3cZBKrc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BbCG3cZBKrc[/video]


View attachment 5911

 

[The Other Side]

I hate tea and don't play cards. You do know that people sit around buying and selling options and can make $6-15,000 a day if it works out OK ? Or are you unaware of that activity??

Obama is done............ he's had 3 years and is ruining my country.

Guess what, Cain's plan would tax ALL !!! Spread the responsibility!!!

So you deny the card playing, deny the liking of tea, but dont say anything about illegals grooming your fairways.... Hmmm, I guess you dont dispute having illegals grooming the golf course on the old retirement fairways, eh?

Peace.

 

[UPS Lifer]

I am degree holding and think his plan would be an utter failure and joke, and many others with far greater sophistication than myself or Cain agree.

Sleeve,
You are entitled to your opinion about 999. I on the other hand, believe that our tax code is broken and needs a complete overhaul. I keep an open mind on anyone willing to tackle this nightmare. Actually, I admire those who will work hard to throw it out and start from scratch to replace it with a FAIR and equitable system for all Americans.

My beef is with those who think that anyone with a degree is smarter than someone without a degree. BTW - I am not putting you in that category but your comment reminded me that there are a lot of people who absolutely believe that. Some of the smartest people I know, do not have degrees. Having an education and a degree is just part of the total package. Life experience - common sense - and application of that education or degree on a routine basis are also necessary.

I am also reminded of my career at UPS, especially managing package centers. The first 2 questions asked by drivers, "Did you drive and for how long?".

A degree shows that you have fulfilled the requirements of a college or university and are granted all the "Rights, Privileges, and Honors" that are conferred upon you. An undergraduate degree means nothing if you do not put it to good and practical use.

To summarize; Cain has common sense, experience and has shown a successful application of his education and leadership skills. I believe he will bridge the gap between ideologues of the left and right and do what is best for all Americans and not a chosen few.

 

[MrFedEx]

So you deny the card playing, deny the liking of tea, but dont say anything about illegals grooming your fairways.... Hmmm, I guess you dont dispute having illegals grooming the golf course on the old retirement fairways, eh?

Peace.

Herman Cain= Token Republican Black Guy (so they can say they have one). A maroon, in so many different ways, kind of like a choice of toppings on a greasy, low-quality pizza. I laughed out load when I heard his religious album. Talk about sucking up to evangelicals. The Right Wing, pathetic in so many ways. 9-9-9 upside down is 6-6-6.

 

[wkmac]

Sleeve,
You are entitled to your opinion about 999. I on the other hand, believe that our tax code is broken and needs a complete overhaul. I keep an open mind on anyone willing to tackle this nightmare. Actually, I admire those who will work hard to throw it out and start from scratch to replace it with a FAIR and equitable system for all Americans.

My beef is with those who think that anyone with a degree is smarter than someone without a degree. BTW - I am not putting you in that category but your comment reminded me that there are a lot of people who absolutely believe that. Some of the smartest people I know, do not have degrees. Having an education and a degree is just part of the total package. Life experience - common sense - and application of that education or degree on a routine basis are also necessary.

I am also reminded of my career at UPS, especially managing package centers. The first 2 questions asked by drivers, "Did you drive and for how long?".

A degree shows that you have fulfilled the requirements of a college or university and are granted all the "Rights, Privileges, and Honors" that are conferred upon you. An undergraduate degree means nothing if you do not put it to good and practical use.

To summarize; Cain has common sense, experience and has shown a successful application of his education and leadership skills. I believe he will bridge the gap between ideologues of the left and right and do what is best for all Americans and not a chosen few.

Why not scrap the entire income tax system to begin with? Gone! Done Away With! We didn't have one until 1913' and the first withholding income tax on wages until 1942' so why can't we return to that kind of tax model?

Cain's 999 plan has IMO one major flaw other than the many obvious from my POV. It's revenue neutral. It gives gov't the same level of revenue as the current system does now so where is the incentive to cut spending? Why not for example reduce the size of gov't back to the same size and cost as it was under Bill Clinton in the 1990's? We'd not return to the stone age, you'd still have your baby blanket, mommie hold me state and the savings if you like could be paid down to debt reduction and as the principle reduced, start rebating those excess tax savings back to the taxpayers. As more money remained in the private sector, consumer spending would increase and the fear of debt burden from taxation and future inflation would build confidence to the point in the business community that expansion would begin and jobs would begin to increase. As more jobs came into play and more consumer spending, greater tax revs. would reduce the debt faster and the cycle blah, blah. I'd even stabilize social security to remove the fear factor from bothsides.

With society more stable across the board, fear is not the driving factor for anyone so now a rational and honest national conversation could take place on how we want to go forward.

If up to me I'd burn it all to the ground personally but why you statists can't figure this whole thing out with such an easy and obvious solution is just beyond me but then this is not about doing something right but rather about achieving power and thus the reason radicals like me have leverage in the first place arguing to burn the whole damn mess to the ground. Besides, keep your present course and you guys will do it for me, all I have to do is keep baiting you in fear to maintain present course!

 

[moreluck]

So you deny the card playing, deny the liking of tea, but dont say anything about illegals grooming your fairways.... Hmmm, I guess you dont dispute having illegals grooming the golf course on the old retirement fairways, eh?

Peace.

Oh I don't golf either !! You sure like to stereotype people.......that's hatred in disguise, you know.

 

[UPS Lifer]

Why not scrap the entire income tax system to begin with? Gone! Done Away With! We didn't have one until 1913' and the first withholding income tax on wages until 1942' so why can't we return to that kind of tax model?

Cain's 999 plan ...Besides, keep your present course and you guys will do it for me, all I have to do is keep baiting you in fear to maintain present course!


View attachment 5912

First of all, you won't get any argument from me...
I am very open to that idea! BUT - I want to see what we have scrapped PERIOD ...and I believe we do need to go back to levels of government spending when Clinton was in office... and most importantly hold the line. Our revenue stream needs to be simple and fair for everyone.

 

[wkmac]

First of all, you won't get any argument from me...
I am very open to that idea! BUT - I want to see what we have scrapped PERIOD ...and I believe we do need to go back to levels of government spending when Clinton was in office... and most importantly hold the line. Our revenue stream needs to be simple and fair for everyone.

OK, you got folks here on the otherside of the fence so to speak who think the Clinton years hung the moon and now you're willing to go back to that level so why not build a consensus on that and start a discussion towards that goal? They keep a level of gov't they like and you get a smaller gov't so seems to me from you guys POV, you both win the day.

Why not start an OccupyElectionPoles movement with that kind of consensus and see where it might go?

Damn, how "friend'ing" hard was that to solve?

 

[UnconTROLLed]

First of all, you won't get any argument from me...
I am very open to that idea! BUT - I want to see what we have scrapped PERIOD ...and I believe we do need to go back to levels of government spending when Clinton was in office... and most importantly hold the line. Our revenue stream needs to be simple and fair for everyone.

The 999 has so many holes, it's swiss cheese.

Anyone denying this denies basic economic sensibilities and any type of verification responsibility.

The plans cohorts remain nameless...

A 9% sales tax? Extortion of the poor and middle class who already pay too much state taxes

(For example: ZERO% state tax here, ...how's that 9% jump going to help the middle and lower working classes, who are already segregated in this state and paying extraordinary high property, town, veh registration etc taxes )

Sales tax is a drop in the bucket for the wealthy, makes little impact.

Show me some meaningful calculations, show me a balanced projection of deficit and debts...show me how the sudden surge of wealth to the top income brackets, under 999, will trickle down to those in the bottom 70%...

After about 5 seconds we see it's just another way for businesses to attain and hold onto more wealth and the poor to pay up money they don't have enough of.

I don't claim to be a savvy economics pro, and I don't think anyone here is (unless I'm mistaken, correct me). However I talk with people far more intelligent than Cain on a daily basis, on many levels. They for the most, except for a few far righties, snicker at the 999 proposal as more of the same class warfare.

 

[UnconTROLLed]

My bottom line, for what little it's worth:

It's a theory, unproven and untested, anonymous, with little methodologies nor figures to be openly examined and critiqued.

That is NOT to say it couldn't work; but AS IS and DESCRIBED, it really shouldn't be taken seriously until the "war and peace" of it is transparent.

 

[moreluck]

My bottom line, for what little it's worth:

It's a theory, unproven and untested, anonymous, with little methodologies nor figures to be openly examined and critiqued.

That is NOT to say it couldn't work; but AS IS and DESCRIBED, it really shouldn't be taken seriously until the "war and peace" of it is transparent.

Nothing is written in stone......we know that from Obama's campaign. Things will get tweaked, but at least Cain is addressing it and wants to do away with the IRS and make the process simpler for all.