Management found a new loophole..

[Skooney]

Long story short, I needed help finishing off my route here recently, Sup sends me a guy with a already loaded EDD of my full route. Instead of me transferring my EDD to his, he just delivers from from the already loaded EDD. I called said sup and asked why, was told it gives dispatch a raise, so it looks like nobody had to help anybody, and appears on paper that work is evened out. Also looks as if it was delivered from the original route. We don't even scan anything to transfer. Just give him the boxes and he already has a loaded EDD.. Don't get me wrong it's a hell of a lot quicker, but now it's going to mess with my numbers and Orion percentage. Also, those boxes are my responsibility until they get delivered. God forbid the help loses a box, it would come right back on me. No record of the transfer. Seems like dishonesty/falsifying numbers!? I hate to be that guy, but can anyone provide some language on this?

Oh well. Some things are beyond your control.

They'll continue to mask their numbers, and your check will still show up Friday. You'll still get the same raise we all do Aug 1st. So really, who gives a ?

Or maybe thats the 43 months left until I retire talking.

 

[MyTripisCut]

Not quite.

This^^^^
and this^^^^^


My question, for anyone who wants to answer, is if a driver in a bonus center benefits from the numbers being combined in a “Yourname2” Diad. Example JohnDoe does 170 stops, but avoid showing another route someone coded as safety does an additional 40 stops as JohnDoe2. The numbers are combined, as JohnDoe, original. The “real JohnDoe”, now gets bonus pay, based on the reports showing he did 210 stops in 9 hours. He is paid 10.5, knows he didn’t do 210, but will look the other way as he is benefiting from a free hour and half of OT. Question is this, Is this stealing from the company?

@Bubblehead curious about your thoughts on this one specifically.

 

[Utahloader]

I have answered your accountability concern several times in this thread. Management eliminated their ability to hold you accountable for any missing packages on your car that day when they did what they did. You seem determined to find every fault with management you can, to the point of making some up out of sheer fantasy. So, you insist on believing that management increased you exposure to discipline when they actually did the opposite.

Clearly you are not going to believe me. Management are all heartless, stealing, lying, baby eaters. They're also literally Hitler. Carry on.

No, just holding their feet to the fire. I appreciate your opinion, but it's just that. Also you missed when I said I help them whenever possible. No most management aren't heartless, most are spineless. They can't take the heat, so they find whatever work around they can, while putting the driver in jeopardy. Sad!

 

[UPSER1987]

Not quite.

This^^^^
and this^^^^^


My question, for anyone who wants to answer, is if a driver in a bonus center benefits from the numbers being combined in a “Yourname2” Diad. Example JohnDoe does 170 stops, but avoid showing another route someone coded as safety does an additional 40 stops as JohnDoe2. The numbers are combined, as JohnDoe, original. The “real JohnDoe”, now gets bonus pay, based on the reports showing he did 210 stops in 9 hours. He is paid 10.5, knows he didn’t do 210, but will look the other way as he is benefiting from a free hour and half of OT. Question is this, Is this stealing from the company?

But that’s not what the op described. This is an easy management integrity issue that has and will get management people in trouble. The op is going on and on about an issue that is not his and trivial at best. He asked for help and got it. If it doesn’t impact his pay, what’s the concern?

 

[Bubblehead]

My question, for anyone who wants to answer, is if a driver in a bonus center benefits from the numbers being combined in a “Yourname2” Diad. Example JohnDoe does 170 stops, but avoid showing another route someone coded as safety does an additional 40 stops as JohnDoe2. The numbers are combined, as JohnDoe, original. The “real JohnDoe”, now gets bonus pay, based on the reports showing he did 210 stops in 9 hours. He is paid 10.5, knows he didn’t do 210, but will look the other way as he is benefiting from a free hour and half of OT. Question is this, Is this stealing from the company?

@Bubblehead curious about your thoughts on this one specifically.

Blatantly dishonest, no other explanation stands up....period.

 

[Utahloader]

But that’s not what the op described. This is an easy management integrity issue that has and will get management people in trouble. The op is going on and on about an issue that is not his and trivial at best. He asked for help and got it. If it doesn’t impact his pay, what’s the concern?

It's my route, my packages to deliver. I have every right to be concerned. Made it clear today I will not being doing that shadiness anymore. I will transfer, if I have to file, I'll file. He had no problem with that, and told me to transfer whenever I need to. Funny what can happen if you speak up. Also, been lighter than normal past couple days. Don't want a extra route in, don't overload the truck. Plain and simple.

 

[UPSER1987]

It's my route, my packages to deliver. I have every right to be concerned. Made it clear today I will not being doing that shadiness anymore. I will transfer, if I have to file, I'll file. He had no problem with that, and told me to transfer whenever I need to. Funny what can happen if you speak up. Also, been lighter than normal past couple days. Don't want a extra route in, don't overload the truck. Plain and simple.

Actually it’s not. It’s Ups’ route you won the bid on and their packages you are being paid to deliver. Transfer until you’re blue in the face. You wanna make sure “your” packages get delivered? Don’t ask for help- deliver them yourself.

 

[Utahloader]

Actually it’s not. It’s Ups’ route you won the bid on and their packages you are being paid to deliver. Transfer until you’re blue in the face. You wanna make sure “your” packages get delivered? Don’t ask for help- deliver them yourself.

Me

 

[RolloTony Brown Town]

Wish that worked with management, you want your stops delivered, they got delivered. So what, what order they got delivered in? Who cares? I go outside of my way to help sups whenever possible. This however, is a bit too far. You also completely avoided the accountability issue. Not hard to see how this could bite a driver back big time. Not me. No sir.

If you’re being told to follow it then follow it. Fact of the matter is, another driver helping you does not affect your Orion numbers. It changes your planned day because you’ll drive less miles and deliver less stops and pieces. Nothing more and nothing less.

 

[MyTripisCut]

But that’s not what the op described. This is an easy management integrity issue that has and will get management people in trouble. The op is going on and on about an issue that is not his and trivial at best. He asked for help and got it. If it doesn’t impact his pay, what’s the concern?

I was asking if anyone thought the driver described in my scenario was stealing time.

 

[MyTripisCut]

Blatantly dishonest, no other explanation stands up....period.

Is the driver guilty of stealing time in this scenario even though working as directed?

 

[oldngray]

Is the driver guilty of stealing time in this scenario even though working as directed?

I saw similar things a couple of times and they did a correction on the time card. UPS doesn't give away money if they can help it. If they don't mess with the numbers I would be tempted to say its on them for screwing up.

 

[Bubblehead]

I was asking if anyone thought the driver described in my scenario was stealing time.

Is the driver guilty of stealing time in this scenario even though working as directed?

"In your scenario", I would argue that the driver was not dishonest (although obviously complicit unless they are a complete maroon), while management was certainly dishonest....since they were the ones actually combining the delivery records from the two DIAD's under one name and employee number.

After all, the bonus system is dishonest, arbitrary, and absolutely the single biggest hypocrisy perpetrated by UPS and the Teamsters.

That being said, in the Central Region at least, the Company can ask for the "bonus money" back, but only for the previous 90 days.

....and yes @brownIEman, I have seen this very scenario play out, minus the driver paying back the officious bonus money.

 

[RolloTony Brown Town]

"In your scenario", I would argue that the driver was not dishonest (although obviously complicit unless they are a complete maroon), while management was certainly dishonest....since they were the ones actually combining the delivery records from the two DIAD's under one name and employee number.

After all, the bonus system is dishonest, arbitrary, and absolutely the single biggest hypocrisy perpetrated by UPS and the Teamsters.

That being said, in the Central Region at least, the Company can ask for the "bonus money" back, but only for the previous 90 days.

....and yes @brownIEman, I have seen this very scenario play out, minus the driver paying back the officious bonus money.

I was under the impression that the supervisor just gave Driver B a DIAD loaded with driver A’s name. So drivers have their own time card and diad but it’ll show they both performed on the same route.

Did the OP say that the supervisor loaded the 2nd driver’s diad with the OPs name and info?

 

[brownIEman]

"In your scenario", I would argue that the driver was not dishonest (although obviously complicit unless they are a complete maroon), while management was certainly dishonest....since they were the ones actually combining the delivery records from the two DIAD's under one name and employee number.

After all, the bonus system is dishonest, arbitrary, and absolutely the single biggest hypocrisy perpetrated by UPS and the Teamsters.

That being said, in the Central Region at least, the Company can ask for the "bonus money" back, but only for the previous 90 days.

....and yes @brownIEman, I have seen this very scenario play out, minus the driver paying back the officious bonus money.

I've seen the very same scenario. Only usually in the scenario I've seen, the work merged was usually either management working with an insider (and yes, the insider was paid top driver rate). In the cases I saw, work was moved to a driver to keep it in the center numbers totals. If a driver made bonus he did not earn, so be it. Stealing time? The company representatives made the decision in those cases that the solution to several conflicting priorities was to add the work and if that meant a driver made a slight bump that day so be it. So the company decided to steal it's own time for service and expediency. (That by the way is a huge difference from a pissed off driver giving himself a bump by dragging his feet and running a 7.5 SPORH on work he could have safely run at 12, a scenario I've seen : edit- don't take my word for it, these forums are littered with drivers bragging about giving themselves just such bumps in pay.)

You will always assign dishonesty to everything you see management doing, so I suppose my trying to suggest it might not always be that is probably a wasted effort...

 

[brownIEman]

Is the driver guilty of stealing time in this scenario even though working as directed?

This would in no way be the driver stealing time.
If you walk into my house and take my TV and take it home as yours, you have stolen my TV. If you walk into my house and I hand you my TV and say"here, take this", you still wind up with a TV, but you have not stolen anything.

 

[Bubblehead]

This would in no way be the driver stealing time.
If you walk into my house and take my TV and take it home as yours, you have stolen my TV. If you walk into my house and I hand you my TV and say"here, take this", you still wind up with a TV, but you have not stolen anything.

The problem with this analogy is that it isn't really your house.....or your TV to give away.

 

[Bubblehead]

I've seen the very same scenario. Only usually in the scenario I've seen, the work merged was usually either management working with an insider (and yes, the insider was paid top driver rate). In the cases I saw, work was moved to a driver to keep it in the center numbers totals. If a driver made bonus he did not earn, so be it. Stealing time? The company representatives made the decision in those cases that the solution to several conflicting priorities was to add the work and if that meant a driver made a slight bump that day so be it. So the company decided to steal it's own time for service and expediency. (That by the way is a huge difference from a off driver giving himself a bump by dragging his feet and running a 7.5 SPORH on work he could have safely run at 12, a scenario I've seen : edit- don't take my word for it, these forums are littered with drivers bragging about giving themselves just such bumps in pay.)

You will always assign dishonesty to everything you see management doing, so I suppose my trying to suggest it might not always be that is probably a wasted effort...

It is absolutely a wasted effort in your above proposed scenario, because the Company was just duped by a dishonest supervisor who was trying to hide their shortcomings in order to provide a false metric....likely stops per car in this instance.

It's no different than a driver padding their miles, pickup pieces, or over 70's to look better on paper....which is also blatant dishonesty.

Do it enough and it might make the Center Team eligible for a bigger piece when they are doling out the annual MIP bonuses.

 

[UPSER1987]

The only metric saved here is drtp- different route than planned. Makes it look like all the work assigned to the route was delivered by that route, because both diads have the same route id. Also easier and faster for the drivers to exchange packages. It’s a futile internal measurement for the dispatcher. The dispatcher puts the “right” work on the car, only to have the pm supervisor override that by sending help. It’s nothing new- it’s been done for years. Doesn’t impact driver pay, or center spc-stops per car, because the driver was already on road. It’s not a driver issue at all. It is a management dispatch/accountability issue. For a driver- nothing to see here.

 

[Frankie's Friend]

Actually it’s not. It’s Ups’ route you won the bid on and their packages you are being paid to deliver. Transfer until you’re blue in the face. You wanna make sure “your” packages get delivered? Don’t ask for help- deliver them yourself.

The pkgs do not belong to ups. They belong to the shipper. Get a grip. His bid described area is his area. Seniority has to mean something today.

If I read this right (139 posts ago) the dude was wondering if there was a a pkg not sheeted and stolen, rolled, or stolen out of if it could possibly come back on him since it was still in his edd, not transferred.

Transferring and counting the pkgs transferred afterwards in this day and age is good insurance for the original driver and the second driver as well.

No one likes to be accused of dishonesty if they are honest and that's a virtue in short supply today.