Religion

[El Correcto]

What you are basing this on is infallible?

To within a certain degree of accuracy absolutely and there isn’t a margin of error that puts human beings on this planet with dinosaurs.

 

[El Correcto]

Experience and testimony is enough for me.

None of those things are evidence and only fuel your assumptions.
If assumptions are good enough for you I can’t change your mind, but going out of the way to deny facts to bolster your assumptions is pretty dumb if I’m being honest.

 

[Integrity]

None of those things are evidence and only fuel your assumptions.
If assumptions are good enough for you I can’t change your mind, but going out of the way to deny facts to bolster your assumptions is pretty dumb if I’m being honest.

 

[El Correcto]

View attachment 473928

Yeah I know you pointed at me and accused me of making claims based off assumptions ignorantly while that is exactly what you do.

Glad you recognize what you’re doing with the three fingers pointing back picture.

 

[Integrity]

To within a certain degree of accuracy absolutely and there isn’t a margin of error that puts human beings on this planet with dinosaurs.

Yes. Fact based on theory.

I get it.

 

[Integrity]

Yeah I know you pointed at me and accused me of making claims based off assumptions ignorantly while that is exactly what you do.

Glad you recognize what you’re doing with the three fingers pointing back picture.

All good!

 

[El Correcto]

Yes. Fact based on theory.

I get it.

No that’s not how theories work. Theories are based on facts and observation, what we are discussing is a fact based on evidence, irrefutable evidence.

 

[Integrity]

No that’s not how theories work. Theories are based on facts and observation, what we are discussing is a fact based on evidence, irrefutable evidence.

That’s a fine theory.

 

[BrownFlush]

The idea that you can prove what is written is a theory. In my view at least.

"In my view it's a theory at least''..there's a guy with firm, provable conviction! lol

 

[vantexan]

Genesis one is not based on what Peter wrote. I don't care what man does with primitive technology. Do you need it? If so, why?Too much evidence that the days of creation were days of ordinary length. If the days were thousands or millions of years it would be a problem. In Genesis 1:16, two great lights were made, one to rule the day and the lesser to rule the night. Since these days were divided, according to Genesis 1:15 into “evening and morning” you ready to assume the sun came up but didn't go down for a few thousand or a few million years? There's another problem, if the “days” were eons of time, the plants were brought about on the third day of creation and the sun on the fourth day. Plants must have sunlight in order to produce their food through photosynthesis. Animals are dependent upon plants as a basic source of food. Plants and animals existing millions of years without the sun? Maybe while you're at it, since I'm legalistic and you don't like the 24 hour day, change the order that things happened in your eons of time.

Stop there? Why are jumping to Leviticus and the Law and the gospel? Absolutely no comparison about what we're addressing.
Legalistic? Funny you charge me with that because you don't agree. Everyone one this forum would charge you as a legalist with your position on baptism. Sad.

I support baptism because every example of conversion in the New Testament required it. You know the verses.

A creation story. Every culture on Earth has one. Stories of great heroes. Every culture on Earth has them. Allegories. All to explain the world around them. The writer of Genesis put everything in terms of the knowledge of the time. There's no great revelation there.

You've argued that the Earth is 6000-8000 years old. You have to in order to make your theology work. The lineage from Adam. And to make it work you have to say there were dinosaurs coexisting among men. And that God got rid of them with the Flood. You want to say the Bible covers it all but there you are making up stuff to make it work. It's mythology. Mythology is creating stories to explain the world. To teach lessons.

Take Cain and Abel. After Cain murdered his brother he was driven out. He had a wife. Where did she come from? To explain that it's said people married their brothers and sisters. It's the only way you can explain that and make the theology work. Apparently God made sure that hemophilia wouldn't be a problem. You have to make up stuff to make it work.

No doubt people actually wrote the books. And there are great truths within. Beautiful psalms. Things of a historical nature. The Babylonians did take the Jews into captivity. But a lot of it is also myth. We have advanced enough to where we've learned a lot more about the age of the Earth. There was a time when men believed that the entire universe revolved around the Earth. To say differently was to question authority and deny the existence of God. But eventually overwhelming evidence proved otherwise. The sun and moon aren't just two lights in the sky put there for us. If the moon was intended as a night light then why isn't it full all of the time?

But I know this doesn't matter. OK to research everything as long as we never even remotely suggest anything in the Bible isn't absolute fact. If we find anything out in research that suggests otherwise it must be stopped and the researchers vilified. Given brains to think with but must not use them to think outside the box. And you and others like you are the only ones who can legitimately define the box.

 

[BrownFlush]

A creation story. Every culture on Earth has one. Stories of great heroes. Every culture on Earth has them. Allegories. All to explain the world around them. The writer of Genesis put everything in terms of the knowledge of the time. There's no great revelation there.

Uh..the scriptures also support Creation.
Moses (a Prophet of God) certainly did put in perspective. Direct revelation from God with what happened.
The Bible teaches that the earth was created before the sun and stars (Gen. 1:1, 16). The theory of evolution (in its full scientific context) teaches that the sun and stars existed in some cases for billions of years before the earth.
Plants existing for millions of years before there is a sun, moon, day or night ( 1:11), a veritable botanical — not to mention scientific absurdity. The theory of evolution, and any other theory that postulates long periods of time between the days of Genesis, cannot reconcile these facts. Plant life could not have survived without these light sources.
Then, if insects and birds were created millions of years after plants, pollination would have been quite impossible and many plants would have died out. Once more, this presents a scientific conundrum for anyone who is honest. So, the Bible will somehow have to be “adjusted” to make this fit.
The Bible teaches that birds were created before insects (1:20, 24). The theory of evolution demands that the insects precede the birds. Of course, many birds survive primarily upon the insects which they ingest, so once again a problem of survival is created by this.
The Bible teaches that land plants preceded marine life (1:11, 20). The theory of evolution demands that marine life appeared before dry land plants.
The Bible teaches that whales were created before reptiles (or any other land animals), Gen. 1:21, 24. But the theory of evolution not only alleges that reptiles came before whales, but that whales are in fact land animals that have returned to the water.
The Bible teaches that birds were created before reptiles (1:20, 24). Evolution, on the other hand, insists that birds were the direct descendants of reptiles.
The Bible teaches that man was created before rain fell on the earth (2:5-7). The theory of evolution demands that rain fell on the earth for millions of years before man. (The terms for the plants of 2:5 are apparently used in reference to cultivated plants such as were grown in the garden, and not to the general vegetation of 1:11).
The Bible teaches that death and suffering are the result of sin, and that sin entered the world with Adam and Eve (2:17). But the theory of evolution asserts that the process of life-and-death struggle had been going on for millions of years before man appeared on the earth, and that man’s most immediate ancestors were part of that struggle.
The Bible teaches that man was made first, and then the woman was made from his side (2:18-22). This is the crowning blow to any attempt to reconcile the theory of evolution with the Bible. Evolution demands that the sexes evolved together.
Finally, if day six (when Adam was created) was thousands or even millions of years long, Adam’s age at death would have numbered in the thousands or millions of years, instead of merely hundreds, as Genesis 5 clearly teaches.

 

[BrownFlush]

You've argued that the Earth is 6000-8000 years old.

No. This is not a true statement.
You have brought up 6-8 thousand years several times.

 

[vantexan]

No. This is not a true statement.
You have brought up 6-8 thousand years several times.

It's because it's what the Church of Christ fundamentalists teach. You have to in order to make the lineage timeline work.

 

[El Correcto]

No. This is not a true statement.
You have brought up 6-8 thousand years several times.

How old do you think the earth is, how old do you think life is, how old do you think humanity is?

 

[oldngray]

It's because it's what the Church of Christ fundamentalists teach. You have to in order to make the lineage timeline work.

The Bible doesn't say the Earth is that old. Some people got that date by adding up the ages of people mentioned in the Bible. Are they correct? I don't know and won't try to argue the point either way. I would place it more in the same category as numerologists that try to get more meaning from numbers in the Bible than is what is clearly written.

 

[vantexan]

Uh..the scriptures also support Creation.
Moses (a Prophet of God) certainly did put in perspective. Direct revelation from God with what happened.
The Bible teaches that the earth was created before the sun and stars (Gen. 1:1, 16). The theory of evolution (in its full scientific context) teaches that the sun and stars existed in some cases for billions of years before the earth.
Plants existing for millions of years before there is a sun, moon, day or night ( 1:11), a veritable botanical — not to mention scientific absurdity. The theory of evolution, and any other theory that postulates long periods of time between the days of Genesis, cannot reconcile these facts. Plant life could not have survived without these light sources.
Then, if insects and birds were created millions of years after plants, pollination would have been quite impossible and many plants would have died out. Once more, this presents a scientific conundrum for anyone who is honest. So, the Bible will somehow have to be “adjusted” to make this fit.
The Bible teaches that birds were created before insects (1:20, 24). The theory of evolution demands that the insects precede the birds. Of course, many birds survive primarily upon the insects which they ingest, so once again a problem of survival is created by this.
The Bible teaches that land plants preceded marine life (1:11, 20). The theory of evolution demands that marine life appeared before dry land plants.
The Bible teaches that whales were created before reptiles (or any other land animals), Gen. 1:21, 24. But the theory of evolution not only alleges that reptiles came before whales, but that whales are in fact land animals that have returned to the water.
The Bible teaches that birds were created before reptiles (1:20, 24). Evolution, on the other hand, insists that birds were the direct descendants of reptiles.
The Bible teaches that man was created before rain fell on the earth (2:5-7). The theory of evolution demands that rain fell on the earth for millions of years before man. (The terms for the plants of 2:5 are apparently used in reference to cultivated plants such as were grown in the garden, and not to the general vegetation of 1:11).
The Bible teaches that death and suffering are the result of sin, and that sin entered the world with Adam and Eve (2:17). But the theory of evolution asserts that the process of life-and-death struggle had been going on for millions of years before man appeared on the earth, and that man’s most immediate ancestors were part of that struggle.
The Bible teaches that man was made first, and then the woman was made from his side (2:18-22). This is the crowning blow to any attempt to reconcile the theory of evolution with the Bible. Evolution demands that the sexes evolved together.
Finally, if day six (when Adam was created) was thousands or even millions of years long, Adam’s age at death would have numbered in the thousands or millions of years, instead of merely hundreds, as Genesis 5 clearly teaches.

You're proving my point, not disproving it. Using Genesis as the basis to deny the reality that research has revealed. Stating your beliefs as irrefutable fact because of what Genesis states.

 

[BrownFlush]

Take Cain and Abel. After Cain murdered his brother he was driven out. He had a wife. Where did she come from? To explain that it's said people married their brothers and sisters. It's the only way you can explain that and make the theology work. Apparently God made sure that hemophilia wouldn't be a problem. You have to make up stuff to make it work.

Cain in fact married his own sister in the flesh is a very logical and reasonable conclusion. If his wife was not his own sister, who were her parents? Was she, or were her parents, the objects of additional specific creation And, if so, God did not see fit to reveal it. There is no record of God's ever having created anyone other than Adam and Eve. Don't forget the purity of the blood.
If you can't conceive of Cain's having married his own sister, but bear in mind that there were then no prohibitions against such. It would be as wrong to judge Cain by a law that did not exist then as to judge us by a law, which does not exist now. For more than 2500 years it was not wrong to marry one's sister.

 

[vantexan]

The Bible doesn't say the Earth is that old. Some people got that date by added up the ages of people mentioned in the Bible. Are they correct? I don't know and won't try to argue the point either way. I would place it more in the same category as numerologists that try to get more meaning from numbers in the Bible than is what is clearly written.

If Brownflush points out that all was created in 6 24 hr days and the lineage from Adam down is stated then he is very much stating that the Earth is 6000-8000 years old. And he backs that up by saying that dinosaurs coexisted with men, who started with Adam. That somehow men managed to not be eaten by the dinosaurs before God took them out with the flood. Never makes allowances for other people who didn't worship the God of Abraham. Different races. The Biblical account is of the Hebrews/Jews. It's their mythology.

 

[vantexan]

Cain in fact married his own sister in the flesh is a very logical and reasonable conclusion. If his wife was not his own sister, who were her parents? Was she, or were her parents, the objects of additional specific creation And, if so, God did not see fit to reveal it. There is no record of God's ever having created anyone other than Adam and Eve. Don't forget the purity of the blood.
If you can't conceive of Cain's having married his own sister, but bear in mind that there were then no prohibitions against such. It would be as wrong to judge Cain by a law that did not exist then as to judge us by a law, which does not exist now. For more than 2500 years it was not wrong to marry one's sister.

2500 years? You don't marry your sister not because it's icky, which it is, it's because it causes birth defects and hemophilia. But there you are explaining away something that's not in the text.

 

[BrownFlush]

No doubt people actually wrote the books. And there are great truths within. Beautiful psalms. Things of a historical nature. The Babylonians did take the Jews into captivity. But a lot of it is also myth.

Pitiful.

We have advanced enough to where we've learned a lot more about the age of the Earth.

Sure we have. lol

There was a time when men believed that the entire universe revolved around the Earth. To say differently was to question authority and deny the existence of God. But eventually overwhelming evidence proved otherwise.

So?

The sun and moon aren't just two lights in the sky put there for us. If the moon was intended as a night light then why isn't it full all of the time?

Lol! I wonder? lol!

But I know this doesn't matter.

You got something right.

And you and others like you are the only ones who can legitimately define the box.

Go personal when you have nothing.
Predictable, sad, and pitiful.