Union Fight for Better Peak?

[brownIEman]

Complete BS.
What kind of fuzzy math does IE use?
Even if we use your numbers (8-10%) which are suspect...
9% increase in payroll cost (only) for hourly domestic employees (only) would not result in putting UPS overall in the red.

Paying H&W on an hour or two of overtime per day for hour-lies only does not increase the overall center payroll by 10%. And certainly not a 10% increase in overall costs. Give me a break! The propaganda machine has started...

Get real.
We are not drinking the Kool-Aid

Well, notice I did say AND or on the double time OT and extending the pension and HW payments to all hours worked?
Add that in, and you make it MUCH more expensive for UPS to keep 50% or more of a center out 10.5 or 11 hours every day.
Which might have the effect of actually incentivizing the company to add routes and drivers and drop the paid day to more like
8.5-9. In a 70 car center that might require adding around 7 routes, which means adding that many drivers to staff on average,
which would increase costs probably around 10%. More if you add in the package car fuel and mileage costs.
According to the UPS 2014 SEC fillings, UPS had Compensation and benefits costs of $32.045B and total net revenue (profit) of $3.021B, less
that 10% of the compensation and benefits costs, so you increase those by 10% keeping everything the same, you wipe out the profits.

Look, I get that this is all very speculative. And it may be total BS. But it is at least based on my experience helping to run a center and plan
staffing and evaluating staffing needs and staffing costs in running a center. Your objection, while possibly valid, is nevertheless based on your emotion and your total ignorance of actually staffing and running a center.

You sir are clearly not only drinking the Kool-Aid, your are guzzling it. You just happen to prefer the IBT Kool-aid to the UPS kind, which is fine, that is your choice. But it is just as ignorant.

Having said all that, since 2014 UPS has managed to improve the the Compensation costs as a total percentage of costs (thanks automation) and does stand to gain from the lowered tax rates in the recently passed tax overhaul. So this would be the year to go for the jugular on Pension payments for all hours worked and double time - Likely you won't get both, but anything you can get to help the pensions would be probably be worth fighting for.

 

[35years]

According to the UPS 2014 SEC fillings, UPS had Compensation and benefits costs of $32.045B and total net revenue (profit) of $3.021B, less
that 10% of the compensation and benefits costs, so you increase those by 10% keeping everything the same, you wipe out the profits.
You are including non-hourly compensation, which is disingenuous. Also Part time employees, hub employees etc. would not have their compensation increase since they generally don't work 10 hours. This is a large part of the workforce.

Your objection, while possibly valid, is nevertheless based on your emotion and your total ignorance of actually staffing and running a center.
Not based on emotion, just calling out the flaws in your argument

You sir are clearly not only drinking the Kool-Aid, your are guzzling it. You just happen to prefer the IBT Kool-aid to the UPS kind, which is fine, that is your choice. But it is just as ignorant.
Show me where I am ignorant. You presented the proposition that UPS overall profits would quite possibly be wiped out. It is incumbent upon you to defend your stipulation.
.

 

[brownIEman]

Yes that does include non hourly compensation. Non hourly compensation is a small percentage. The vast majority of compensation cost goes to hourlies (as it should be).

I have stated it's likely a 10% increase in compensation costs would wipe out the package operation profit and possibly total profit. I've given my reasons for thinking this is possible. You think my reasons are total BS. What is your basis for that assertion? Do you have an estimate of the break out of just hourly compensation is and what a 10 % increase in that cost would amount to?

 

[35years]

Yes that does include non hourly compensation. Non hourly compensation is a small percentage. The vast majority of compensation cost goes to hourlies (as it should be).

I have stated it's likely a 10% increase in compensation costs would wipe out the package operation profit and possibly total profit. I've given my reasons for thinking this is possible. You think my reasons are total BS. What is your basis for that assertion? Do you have an estimate of the break out of just hourly compensation is and what a 10 % increase in that cost would amount to?

I have given you ample reasons why your argument is flawed.

It is incumbent upon you to defend your speculation. You made the original claim, not me.

Also, part time employee compensation (which are a large part of the workforce) would not for the most part be affected by the changes. Also International employees would also not be affected. So extrapolating your speculative 10% cost figure for full time hourly employees to equate to a 10% increase in total costs company wide is nonsense.

UPS estimates there are 55,000 package car drivers in the USA, add the feeder drivers in and you have perhaps 80,000 out of a total worldwide workforce of 445,000. So your estimate of costs would have to be divided by 4 or 5. So an increase of compensation costs of perhaps 2%, not 10%.

I suspect you realize this, and are just spouting the company propaganda in anticipation of the upcoming contract.

 

[35years]

Of course all of this speculation about how much it would cost UPS to respect the dignity of the drivers by dispatching reasonable hours misses the point.

Drivers have families...children who have the innate right to have their dads around. This is a basic human right which is being denied by an employer...UPS.

It was not always so..When I started we were dispatched with a 8.3 average day.
We also started at 8:15 AM.

UPS should make a profit, but not at the cost of the employee's basic human rights.

UPS Inc. increased the total compensation package for its Chief Executive Officer, David Abney, by 21 percent in 2016, according to the company’s latest filing with the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission.
Overall, Abney’s compensation for the year grew to $13.7 million, including a 10 percent base salary bump to $1.1 million and stock option awards of $10.2 million.
The increase comes after UPS upped Abney’s pay by 35 percent in 2015 and nearly 105 percent in 2014.
UPS ups CEO compensation again in 2016 | News | American Shipper

 

[35years]

If we strike I will be printing hundreds of copies of the same picket sign to be carried by our kids, it will say...

"I never get to see my dad anymore."

Thanks UPS for bringing the issue front and center this peak season.

 

[Box Ox]

It was not always so..When I started we were dispatched with a 8.3 average day.
We also started at 8:15 AM.

Man, Millenials would eat that up! @Wally wouldn’t have to regulate as often! All they do right now is whine and bi*ch about their 12 hour days!

 

[35years]

Man, Millenials would eat that up! @Wally wouldn’t have to regulate as often! All they do right now is whine and bi*ch about their 12 hour days!

Lines at the gas pumps everyday at 4:15
I was a runner-gunner. Off at 3:15 on a full route.
Time studies were also more realistic.

 

[Coldworld]

What in the hell does Apple have to do with UPS? Abney would strangle Tim Cook in Madison Square Garden for Apple's margins.

Tim Cook vs. abney...lol.. that’s like saying Wally vs. rod or future vs. gumby...my point is these corporations are going to be saving billions along with ups... so stfu IE biotch!!

 

[Blackadder 2]

For those of you who have had a bad peak being forced to work excessive hours do you think there is any hope of the Union fighting for less hours worked in the upcoming contract? This year is nothing short of ridiculous.

No, Hoffa will sell us out for a ham sandwich.

 

[BakerMayfield2018]

 

[Brownslave688]

I didn't say people who like money are shameful. What you did there, basically, was create a new argument by twisting what I said. aka strawman logical fallacy

Because you "like" money does not mean you need to brag about it, post paystubs, and basically seek attention. Additionally, when you do this to knock down those who do not want OT, do not want to "stick it to the company", it is even worse.

I have no problem with people wanting endless overtime, really, until it affects me and others. I have zero interest in soaking the company and soaking up overtime.

JMO

You said people that brag about OT at ups are idiots and those that need OT are shameful. Not my words yours




I think what we have here is a serious case of mind your own damn business.

 

[Coldworld]

NO ONE CARES! It's not always about you! You 10 car supe!

He’s the “resident suit”....and feels like he has to carry the cool aid keg for the company on brown cafe.... just wait til he starts his new “assignment “ as an IE flunkie.... you think he has a know it all attitude now 542, just wait six months...

 

[Brownslave688]

He’s the “resident suit”....and feels like he has to carry the cool aid keg for the company on brown cafe.... just wait til he starts his new “assignment “ as an IE flunkie.... you think he has a know it all attitude now 542, just wait six months...

God he will be soooooo annoying then.

 

[Coldworld]

God he will be soooooo annoying then.

Yep...should be fun..: getting to hear how ups has been doing these “time studies” for years and they are designed to be right 90% of the time for 90% of the workgroup...I might have to get my ignore button ready...

 

[UnconTROLLed]

You said people that brag about OT at ups are idiots and those that need OT are shameful. Not my words yours




I think what we have here is a serious case of mind your own damn business.

If you post something on a public forum, guess what, it's EVERYONE's business. That is not difficult to understand. And I stand by the fact that it is IMO idiotic to brag about working for UPS, never mind how much you make, to make yourself seem like the better man/woman than someone who doesn't go for OT and makes less, and has a life and ambition (gasp) outside of UPS.

In operations at UPS, the union mentality is not much different than UPS; they despise ambition and people who are intelligent. And you aren't going to better yourself. other than financially, working 80 hours a week.

secondly, what I said was that I AM ASHAMED to work at UPS, and working endless overtime is only adding to that feeling of shaming and lack of respect by both the company and union. THAT has nothing to do with anyone else but myself and MY opinion.

Try responding to posts at face value, instead of creating straw men to satisfying your need to tear everyone down around you

 

[olroadbeech]

For those of you who have had a bad peak being forced to work excessive hours do you think there is any hope of the Union fighting for less hours worked in the upcoming contract? This year is nothing short of ridiculous.

god, you people are always complaining.

i worked 55-60 hours year round for years. and that is nothing compared to the 80's and 90's when I first started and used 2 log books and worked 15-16 hours a day sometimes 7 days a week to feed my family.

if it's so bad , why don't you quit?

FUH

 

[brownIEman]

If we strike I will be printing hundreds of copies of the same picket sign to be carried by our kids, it will say...

"I never get to see my dad anymore."

Thanks UPS for bringing the issue front and center this peak season.

My sense of irony would LOVE that. In '97 it was "Part Time Work Doesn't Work". Essentially UPS you are not giving is enough work. Flash forward to 2018 and the strike will be "whoa, whoa UPS, you're giving us too much work!"



Now if I was really a UPS Kool-aide peddler here's I'd inform you if you did your job fairly by the methods you would not be 2.5 hours over allowed and would get to spend all the time with your kids.

 

[Coldworld]

god, you people are always complaining.

i worked 55-60 hours year round for years. and that is nothing compared to the 80's and 90's when I first started and used 2 log books and worked 15-16 hours a day sometimes 7 days a week to feed my family.

if it's so bad , why don't you quit?

FUH

To be fair 55 hours in feeder is a hell of a lot different than package...

 

[HEFFERNAN]

god, you people are always complaining.

i worked 55-60 hours year round for years. and that is nothing compared to the 80's and 90's when I first started and used 2 log books and worked 15-16 hours a day sometimes 7 days a week to feed my family.

if it's so bad , why don't you quit?

FUH

TTKU

Package Car driving and Feeder driving are not the same.

Drove 14 hours 3 times this peak, didn't even break a sweat.