T
trickpony1
Guest
What's the difference between UPS and the Boy Scouts?
The Boy Scouts have adult supervision.
The Boy Scouts have adult supervision.
U
upsdawg
Guest
air upser--good questions about management and the union---looks like everyone is willing to comment on management and not on the behavior of their beloved Teamsters---who have been convicted and replaced.
There are good Management people and I have seem some less than acceptable management people---the good ones always stay and the bad ones eventually leave-----what goes around comes around?
I have also seen soem horrible Business Agents over the years--and know that the rules always change with every contract and it gets harder and harder to be a good management person and comply with the contract----kind of like damned if you do or don't!!
There are good Management people and I have seem some less than acceptable management people---the good ones always stay and the bad ones eventually leave-----what goes around comes around?
I have also seen soem horrible Business Agents over the years--and know that the rules always change with every contract and it gets harder and harder to be a good management person and comply with the contract----kind of like damned if you do or don't!!
O
ok2bclever
Guest
upsdawg,
What a bunch of hogwash.
This is one of the most vocally anti-Teamster forums on the net.
It goes without saying we don't trust Teamster upper management for as you say most of them have, will or should spend time in prison.
The telling point might be how few have more positive comments regarding management in comparison.
Please name the parts of the contract where "the rules always change with every contract" that make it hard for you to be a good management person.
I would be extremely interested in what you consider bad changes in the contract language and why.
Air, Not sure if you consider me anti-management, I certainly don't consider myself that way.
I don't feel speaking up about a lot of corporate crap that comes down the pipe at us or objecting to the hokum that is pablum fed to us about how the corporation cares about us is anti-management.
Action speaks louder and truer than words and the words fall far short of the actions over and over and over.
Is the company evil and the workers always innocent or right, nope to both counts.
Are there good managers, yep, lots of them.
I guess it depends on your definition of anti-management.
I will say most of the workers with negative attitudes in my center have reasons similar to those stated by wornout.
It doesn't take many bad apples to spoil a bushel.
What a bunch of hogwash.
This is one of the most vocally anti-Teamster forums on the net.
It goes without saying we don't trust Teamster upper management for as you say most of them have, will or should spend time in prison.
The telling point might be how few have more positive comments regarding management in comparison.
Please name the parts of the contract where "the rules always change with every contract" that make it hard for you to be a good management person.
I would be extremely interested in what you consider bad changes in the contract language and why.
Air, Not sure if you consider me anti-management, I certainly don't consider myself that way.
I don't feel speaking up about a lot of corporate crap that comes down the pipe at us or objecting to the hokum that is pablum fed to us about how the corporation cares about us is anti-management.
Action speaks louder and truer than words and the words fall far short of the actions over and over and over.
Is the company evil and the workers always innocent or right, nope to both counts.
Are there good managers, yep, lots of them.
I guess it depends on your definition of anti-management.
I will say most of the workers with negative attitudes in my center have reasons similar to those stated by wornout.
It doesn't take many bad apples to spoil a bushel.
A
air_upser
Guest
I really appreciate all of you taking the time to provide feedback. Some of the incidents you have described are just flat out disgusting. Others are the result of the dilemma of servicing customers and meeting commitments versus taking care of the employee. When senior management looks at the day, they see a bunch of numbers. When customers see the 8pm pickup, they see service. Neither thinks about the 12 hour day or missed family dinner the UPSer experienced.
Are there solutions? I think so, but there are always limits. Contract language can't cover every incident. There will always be bad managers and bad employees. And, you can't please everyone.
I am not in the operation so my expereince is limited to peak, talking with friends and neighbors, and listening to people on this board. But, I do have technicians below me and managers above. If I could suggest one thing to everyone, management and hourly alike, is to treat others as you want to be treated.
clever, unfortunately the intent of the post is sometimes lost in the words. I don't consider questioning decisions and offering solutions to be anti-management. I just get frustated when I read and hear opinions on issues where the facts are not known. It's like I can say "I just fired a driver" and some folks will automatically call me a jerk and call a rally to save the union brother. Don't ask why because you might find out they raped someone while on the clock or something. That's an extreme example but that's the impression I get sometimes. And the same things happen in management. How can you motivate employees when you don't know the reason behind the decisions?
Anyway, hopefully we will get the overworked conditions fixed. I believe in UPS and our ability to work together and continue to be a successful company.
Treat others as you want to be treated. That's my message of the day.
Now back to my car.....
Are there solutions? I think so, but there are always limits. Contract language can't cover every incident. There will always be bad managers and bad employees. And, you can't please everyone.
I am not in the operation so my expereince is limited to peak, talking with friends and neighbors, and listening to people on this board. But, I do have technicians below me and managers above. If I could suggest one thing to everyone, management and hourly alike, is to treat others as you want to be treated.
clever, unfortunately the intent of the post is sometimes lost in the words. I don't consider questioning decisions and offering solutions to be anti-management. I just get frustated when I read and hear opinions on issues where the facts are not known. It's like I can say "I just fired a driver" and some folks will automatically call me a jerk and call a rally to save the union brother. Don't ask why because you might find out they raped someone while on the clock or something. That's an extreme example but that's the impression I get sometimes. And the same things happen in management. How can you motivate employees when you don't know the reason behind the decisions?
Anyway, hopefully we will get the overworked conditions fixed. I believe in UPS and our ability to work together and continue to be a successful company.
Treat others as you want to be treated. That's my message of the day.
B
bamboonga
Guest
Well, my experience is a bit of a long one, and I don't know if you're still reading these, but it bears repeating...
Approximately 3 years ago I joined the U.S. Army reserves (please note my avatar photo). This was mostly because of 9/11 and all...I informed my supervisor that I had joined and would be gone for about 6 months for basic training and AIT. He assured me I would have my job waiting for me when I got home. Upon returning home, I found that not only had I been fired, but for not showing up to work, of all things. I had to threaten to go to the federal government before management would even take my call. Eventually I did get my job back, and worked peacefully for UPS until about November of that same year, when I applied for a management position. I put in my letter of intent, gave them my grades (I was a business/financial accounting major maintaining a 3.85 GPA), etc. etc. I would occasionally ask my supervisor (different guy by the time) what the status of it was, were they considering me, etc. The last time I asked him, his response was 'Well, that all depends...are you going to be sent to the Middle East anytime soon?'. At that time I didn't know, so I told him so. His reply was that he didn't know how my promotion was doing. Before and after this happened, I had been repeatedly told that I was a UPS employee first and joined the army second, and that I needed to put UPS before the army at all times.
This seemed/felt very wrong to me, but at that time I didn't think much of it until I was passed over for management. This also didn't really get to me too much until I began speaking to the other employees who applied for management positions. What I found out was actually what pushed me over the edge. Apparently, even the people who had been passed over for the position were given some kind of 'consistency test' and granted a panel interview. I was never given any test, and I hadn't been interviewed for anything since just before my hire date.
I went to my supervisor and asked him why I had been passed over for promotion - he claimed he had no idea. The next day I called human resources and asked them why. They claimed they didn't know. The following day when I showed up to work I was presented with a piece of paper stating that the reason I was passed over was because of excessive absences and tardies from work.
I asked to see my personnel file. After being given the runaround on a daily basis for almost a month, they finally produced my personnel file with a record of all my so-called 'absences'. The absences to which they referred were actually my drill dates and duty dates, and the latenesses were dates I was in class for which I had gotten prior approval from my supervisor (verbal approval, unfortunately).
When I attempted to straighten this out by asking them to refer to the military orders I had provided them and the memorandum including my drill dates, my supervisor claimed there weren't any and that I had never turned any in (basically they had been lost). Lost along with my home address, rank, social security number, and everything else an identity thief would need to become me. I was furious, but provided them with another complete set, which they subsequently lost and blamed on me. I told them the orders would not be replaced and asked my commanding officer to issue a memorandum stating the dates I was on some form of military duty for. He gave me my memorandum which I provided to UPS. They cleared up my Pittsburgh report and things seemed fixed.
I still felt I hadn't been given a fair shake as far as even being considered for management, so I consulted a JAG officer (military lawyer) who informed me that what UPS had done was in violation of USERRA (Uniformed Servicemembers Employment Re-employment Rights Act) and that I was entitled to equal consideration. He told me I needed to file a complaint with the U.S. government, which I did.
The very day UPS got the letter from the government, an 'investigation' was opened on me by a UPS management employee who just happened to be a member of the Provost Marshall's office at my reserve base (it's basically like having a cop in your pocket). They seemed to be trying to prove all my orders were bogus and that I wasn't even in the army to begin with - that my reserve dates I was actually just screwing around with my friends. They demanded another set of orders from me, which I refused to give. They then demanded copies of all my reserve pay stubs (so not only would they have my identity to lose, but my bank account number too). This is when I finally filed a complaint with the union and informed the Department of Labor what they were doing.
The Teamsters basically told UPS that my memorandum was good enough and if they wanted more proof than that, tough nuggets. UPS agreed, though they continued 'investigating'. Finally they called my reserve unit and badmouthed me to them, saying things such as 'does he ever show up to reserve duty or does he just blow you guys off like he does us?' I began getting calls from my reserve unit telling me to stop UPS from calling them anymore. The lieutenant who was investigating me (he works in loss prevention at my center) finally called somebody who was willing to give them copies of my orders - the company conveniently told him to leave out the parts about my work for our unit's family readiness group, which was where roughly half of my time was spent.
I was called into an office and more or less told that if I didn't quit right there that day, they would turn over what they had found to the army. Ordinarily I would have told them to go pound sand, but being that they had a MP working for them, and that MP undoubtedly knew the people who would be doing most of the investigating, I decided to resign. What I didn't know was that this day was the exact day they were supposed to reply to the Department of Labor complaint I had filed against them. Since my employment was terminated, the DOL had to drop my case but told me I could re-open it under a 'wrongful termination' complaint. This was also two weeks after I informed my supervisor I was, in fact, being sent to Iraq.
So, in the end I did get sent to Iraq, where I am now. While here I got word that UPS had agreed with the union to re-hire me (make me whole) under the conditions that they never attempt an investigation such as this again and I promise not to sue them for wrongful termination. UPS admitted no wrongdoing in these events.
So, in answer to your question, this is why I am suspicious of mose moves management makes. I don't believe all of UPS management is corrupt, but I can't get past the actions of the ones I worked for. This entire experience gave me a deep-seeded mistrust of UPS management that I think I'm going to have a hard time looking past in the future. I asked for advice on this site around the time this 'investigation' was commencing...most people were very supportive, even most people I've come to find are UPS management - but a couple, such as afups and one other fellow whose screen name I forget at the moment, basically said it was all my own fault and that I just should have accepted it and waited until I was out of the military to even apply for management.
I don't feel this is right...it's bad enough being out here in the middle of the damn desert...crummy food, oppressive heat, bugs and animals that will kill you with a single bite/sting, sand that burns your eyes and lungs and never seems to stop getting kicked up into the air...and also these terrorist guys occasionally try to kill us with mortars, rockets, suicide bomb vests, infected needles, guns, knives, roadside bombs, and pretty much anything else you can imagine...this place isn't fun at all but at least right now while I'm out here I have a job and can take care of my family. I really don't know what's going to happen once I get home - if I can get my job back or not...if I even want to work in a place that let people like this become managers in the first place...
Anyway...you wanted an answer...there it is...hope it's not too long for you to take the time to read.
Approximately 3 years ago I joined the U.S. Army reserves (please note my avatar photo). This was mostly because of 9/11 and all...I informed my supervisor that I had joined and would be gone for about 6 months for basic training and AIT. He assured me I would have my job waiting for me when I got home. Upon returning home, I found that not only had I been fired, but for not showing up to work, of all things. I had to threaten to go to the federal government before management would even take my call. Eventually I did get my job back, and worked peacefully for UPS until about November of that same year, when I applied for a management position. I put in my letter of intent, gave them my grades (I was a business/financial accounting major maintaining a 3.85 GPA), etc. etc. I would occasionally ask my supervisor (different guy by the time) what the status of it was, were they considering me, etc. The last time I asked him, his response was 'Well, that all depends...are you going to be sent to the Middle East anytime soon?'. At that time I didn't know, so I told him so. His reply was that he didn't know how my promotion was doing. Before and after this happened, I had been repeatedly told that I was a UPS employee first and joined the army second, and that I needed to put UPS before the army at all times.
This seemed/felt very wrong to me, but at that time I didn't think much of it until I was passed over for management. This also didn't really get to me too much until I began speaking to the other employees who applied for management positions. What I found out was actually what pushed me over the edge. Apparently, even the people who had been passed over for the position were given some kind of 'consistency test' and granted a panel interview. I was never given any test, and I hadn't been interviewed for anything since just before my hire date.
I went to my supervisor and asked him why I had been passed over for promotion - he claimed he had no idea. The next day I called human resources and asked them why. They claimed they didn't know. The following day when I showed up to work I was presented with a piece of paper stating that the reason I was passed over was because of excessive absences and tardies from work.
I asked to see my personnel file. After being given the runaround on a daily basis for almost a month, they finally produced my personnel file with a record of all my so-called 'absences'. The absences to which they referred were actually my drill dates and duty dates, and the latenesses were dates I was in class for which I had gotten prior approval from my supervisor (verbal approval, unfortunately).
When I attempted to straighten this out by asking them to refer to the military orders I had provided them and the memorandum including my drill dates, my supervisor claimed there weren't any and that I had never turned any in (basically they had been lost). Lost along with my home address, rank, social security number, and everything else an identity thief would need to become me. I was furious, but provided them with another complete set, which they subsequently lost and blamed on me. I told them the orders would not be replaced and asked my commanding officer to issue a memorandum stating the dates I was on some form of military duty for. He gave me my memorandum which I provided to UPS. They cleared up my Pittsburgh report and things seemed fixed.
I still felt I hadn't been given a fair shake as far as even being considered for management, so I consulted a JAG officer (military lawyer) who informed me that what UPS had done was in violation of USERRA (Uniformed Servicemembers Employment Re-employment Rights Act) and that I was entitled to equal consideration. He told me I needed to file a complaint with the U.S. government, which I did.
The very day UPS got the letter from the government, an 'investigation' was opened on me by a UPS management employee who just happened to be a member of the Provost Marshall's office at my reserve base (it's basically like having a cop in your pocket). They seemed to be trying to prove all my orders were bogus and that I wasn't even in the army to begin with - that my reserve dates I was actually just screwing around with my friends. They demanded another set of orders from me, which I refused to give. They then demanded copies of all my reserve pay stubs (so not only would they have my identity to lose, but my bank account number too). This is when I finally filed a complaint with the union and informed the Department of Labor what they were doing.
The Teamsters basically told UPS that my memorandum was good enough and if they wanted more proof than that, tough nuggets. UPS agreed, though they continued 'investigating'. Finally they called my reserve unit and badmouthed me to them, saying things such as 'does he ever show up to reserve duty or does he just blow you guys off like he does us?' I began getting calls from my reserve unit telling me to stop UPS from calling them anymore. The lieutenant who was investigating me (he works in loss prevention at my center) finally called somebody who was willing to give them copies of my orders - the company conveniently told him to leave out the parts about my work for our unit's family readiness group, which was where roughly half of my time was spent.
I was called into an office and more or less told that if I didn't quit right there that day, they would turn over what they had found to the army. Ordinarily I would have told them to go pound sand, but being that they had a MP working for them, and that MP undoubtedly knew the people who would be doing most of the investigating, I decided to resign. What I didn't know was that this day was the exact day they were supposed to reply to the Department of Labor complaint I had filed against them. Since my employment was terminated, the DOL had to drop my case but told me I could re-open it under a 'wrongful termination' complaint. This was also two weeks after I informed my supervisor I was, in fact, being sent to Iraq.
So, in the end I did get sent to Iraq, where I am now. While here I got word that UPS had agreed with the union to re-hire me (make me whole) under the conditions that they never attempt an investigation such as this again and I promise not to sue them for wrongful termination. UPS admitted no wrongdoing in these events.
So, in answer to your question, this is why I am suspicious of mose moves management makes. I don't believe all of UPS management is corrupt, but I can't get past the actions of the ones I worked for. This entire experience gave me a deep-seeded mistrust of UPS management that I think I'm going to have a hard time looking past in the future. I asked for advice on this site around the time this 'investigation' was commencing...most people were very supportive, even most people I've come to find are UPS management - but a couple, such as afups and one other fellow whose screen name I forget at the moment, basically said it was all my own fault and that I just should have accepted it and waited until I was out of the military to even apply for management.
I don't feel this is right...it's bad enough being out here in the middle of the damn desert...crummy food, oppressive heat, bugs and animals that will kill you with a single bite/sting, sand that burns your eyes and lungs and never seems to stop getting kicked up into the air...and also these terrorist guys occasionally try to kill us with mortars, rockets, suicide bomb vests, infected needles, guns, knives, roadside bombs, and pretty much anything else you can imagine...this place isn't fun at all but at least right now while I'm out here I have a job and can take care of my family. I really don't know what's going to happen once I get home - if I can get my job back or not...if I even want to work in a place that let people like this become managers in the first place...
Anyway...you wanted an answer...there it is...hope it's not too long for you to take the time to read.
T
trickpony1
Guest
Why would you want to join a management "team" that so clearly illustrated the perfect execution of a cluster
?
I would stay as far away from that as I could.
None of the PT supervisors in my hub seem happy.
Is the status worth it? Maybe an evaluation of one's ego and values would be in order.
? I would stay as far away from that as I could.
None of the PT supervisors in my hub seem happy.
Is the status worth it? Maybe an evaluation of one's ego and values would be in order.
R
rushfan
Guest
I am a union member and my opinion about management doesn't come from them. It comes from personal experience:
In my center our lunch hour is automatically deducted from our pay each day. If you work through lunch hour, you screw yourself out of pay.
So one day, I was eating lunch and all of a sudden the center manager and an on road supervisor show up. The both look at me as if I was ripping off ups for taking my hour lunch break. The Center manager said to me, "lunch breaks are overrated, and I never took mine". I was pissed. I told him, "My hour lunch is taken from me, so I take it". More words were exchanged. To make a long story short, the center manager was transferred to a place where everyone is required to take a lunch hour. Serves him right.
I have been lied to many times by them, too many times to take up time on this board.
We also have had problems with them "misplacing" notes from doctors stating drivers have surgical dates, military letters, etc.
So in a nutshell, that is why I never trust those who "lead" our company locally.
In my center our lunch hour is automatically deducted from our pay each day. If you work through lunch hour, you screw yourself out of pay.
So one day, I was eating lunch and all of a sudden the center manager and an on road supervisor show up. The both look at me as if I was ripping off ups for taking my hour lunch break. The Center manager said to me, "lunch breaks are overrated, and I never took mine". I was pissed. I told him, "My hour lunch is taken from me, so I take it". More words were exchanged. To make a long story short, the center manager was transferred to a place where everyone is required to take a lunch hour. Serves him right.
I have been lied to many times by them, too many times to take up time on this board.
We also have had problems with them "misplacing" notes from doctors stating drivers have surgical dates, military letters, etc.
So in a nutshell, that is why I never trust those who "lead" our company locally.
W
wily_old_vet
Guest
Bamboonga-First I just want to say THANK YOU for serving your country and hope that you make it through your tour in Iraq in good shape. As a recently retired UPSer (driver) I am sorry that UPS has put you through what they did. If I was in your position I don't think I could return to work for them. You know they will be gunning for you but everyone has to make their own choice. May God watch over you in Iraq and help you make the right decision once you return.
T
trickpony1
Guest
rush,
The next day I would have filed a harassment grievance to document their actions and start a paper trail.
Behavior like this from management is inexcusable and will continue unless documentation occurs and the proper people are made aware of it.
The next day I would have filed a harassment grievance to document their actions and start a paper trail.
Behavior like this from management is inexcusable and will continue unless documentation occurs and the proper people are made aware of it.
U
upsdawg
Guest
Bambonga---God Bless You-----I am proud to live in a country where we have our freedoms---especially speech, which this thread would be a good example----and don't take the price that is paid for that freedom litely! I will not ever forget "911" and if I were young enough I would think about enlisting just to lead by example--I wish you God's Speed and apologize on behalf of UPS for all that you have endured!!
Sounds like you got the official run-a-round---and I have been there and know others that have also----I AM IN MANANGEMENT AND WE HAVE THE SAME PROBLEMS!! My opinion is that whatever is decided by the Human Resource Manager flows downhill---and being the good UPS Soldiers the "HR Orders" have to be carried out!!
Our thoughts and prayers are with you...hurry back!
Sounds like you got the official run-a-round---and I have been there and know others that have also----I AM IN MANANGEMENT AND WE HAVE THE SAME PROBLEMS!! My opinion is that whatever is decided by the Human Resource Manager flows downhill---and being the good UPS Soldiers the "HR Orders" have to be carried out!!
Our thoughts and prayers are with you...hurry back!
A
air_upser
Guest
bamboonga, first of all, thank you for serving your Country and putting yourself in harms way. I can't find the words to express my appreciation for your service.
As far as UPS goes, I don't know what your management folks were thinking. Of the 50 or so people in my department, 15 are veterans, and 4 are in active reserves. Them, myself, and every other reasonable person would be extremely upset by your experience. You have every right to be suspicious of managment. Hopefully, you will continue to pursue a management position, and get one instead of the person who shouldn't be in management(and apparently tried to screw you).
I'm not sure how many opportunities you have to get online, but I'm sure everyone here would love to hear how you are doing and share some positive brown stories with you. Until then, be safe.
As far as UPS goes, I don't know what your management folks were thinking. Of the 50 or so people in my department, 15 are veterans, and 4 are in active reserves. Them, myself, and every other reasonable person would be extremely upset by your experience. You have every right to be suspicious of managment. Hopefully, you will continue to pursue a management position, and get one instead of the person who shouldn't be in management(and apparently tried to screw you).
I'm not sure how many opportunities you have to get online, but I'm sure everyone here would love to hear how you are doing and share some positive brown stories with you. Until then, be safe.
T
toonertoo
Guest
Bambooga, I can only say that what is happening to you, should not and you should fight it and make UPS internal face up to what they did, and explain it, even if you do not want to continue with them. Take your leave when you get back, and in between having a ball back in the USA, and catching up with family and friends, bone them on what they have done to you for doing what you are doing.
It is pure and simple discrimination
"The last time I asked him, his response was 'Well, that all depends...are you going to be sent to the Middle East anytime soon?'.
That to me is openly admitting putting UPS before your duty to your country, and to something you volunteered to do, and should never suffer repercussion because of it.
I do not think UPS corporate would be too pleased to hear of this, you should write directly to Eskew, and tell him of your plight. You may get a really big promo when you get back to cover this idiot blunder, and those responsible should pay with their livelihoods. Give him names and dates, and after what you have gone through and are going through I know You Aint Scared. I will be keeping you and all the soldiers in my prayers and when you are done you deserve the best, not the crap thrown at you thus far.
I am a Mom of a military man, and I dont think what they have done to you deserves anything but reprimand.
And then take it one further if you get no satisfaction and go to the media. Im sure some of the guys with their own shows, would love to hear of this. People get their fifteen minutes of fame from A LOT less, I for one will be looking for your story. Its a damn shame you got treated this way
Thoughts and prayers Tooner
(Message edited by toonertoo on August 05, 2005)
It is pure and simple discrimination
"The last time I asked him, his response was 'Well, that all depends...are you going to be sent to the Middle East anytime soon?'.
That to me is openly admitting putting UPS before your duty to your country, and to something you volunteered to do, and should never suffer repercussion because of it.
I do not think UPS corporate would be too pleased to hear of this, you should write directly to Eskew, and tell him of your plight. You may get a really big promo when you get back to cover this idiot blunder, and those responsible should pay with their livelihoods. Give him names and dates, and after what you have gone through and are going through I know You Aint Scared. I will be keeping you and all the soldiers in my prayers and when you are done you deserve the best, not the crap thrown at you thus far.
I am a Mom of a military man, and I dont think what they have done to you deserves anything but reprimand.
And then take it one further if you get no satisfaction and go to the media. Im sure some of the guys with their own shows, would love to hear of this. People get their fifteen minutes of fame from A LOT less, I for one will be looking for your story. Its a damn shame you got treated this way
Thoughts and prayers Tooner
(Message edited by toonertoo on August 05, 2005)
F
formerbrown
Guest
Toonertoo hit it right on the button!
Write your Congressman and Senator. UPS needs all the help they can get from Washington and I am sure this won't settle well with the current administration.
We had three from our center in Iraq when I retired. My former manager was just deployed. No one in our District had anything but praise and respect for those over there.
Stay safe - my prayers are with you!
Write your Congressman and Senator. UPS needs all the help they can get from Washington and I am sure this won't settle well with the current administration.
We had three from our center in Iraq when I retired. My former manager was just deployed. No one in our District had anything but praise and respect for those over there.
Stay safe - my prayers are with you!
O
over9five
Guest
Stories like that make you proud to be an employee, don't they?
How do they live with themselves? How can they look in the mirror? How can they call themselves men?
They say you give a lot away when you put on the tie. But your honor? Your self respect? I don't get it. I could never do it.
How do they live with themselves? How can they look in the mirror? How can they call themselves men?
They say you give a lot away when you put on the tie. But your honor? Your self respect? I don't get it. I could never do it.
A
air_upser
Guest
Over9, putting on a tie does not make us all equal. Some of us are proud, hardworking, men and women who treat you as team mates. We both have jobs to do, and when the day is done we're still just Mike and Joe. I am learning not to stereotype a union worker, and I hope you do the same for management. There are many good ones out there that really do care about the company AND the employee.
O
over9five
Guest
air_upser,
You're right, of course.
I retract the 3rd paragraph, and the 2nd is directed at the people bamboonga dealt with.
You're right, of course.
I retract the 3rd paragraph, and the 2nd is directed at the people bamboonga dealt with.
E
ezrider
Guest
Bamboonga
I've seen some lousy things happen every so often but I have NEVER come across something as despicable as what you described. I agree with much of the advice given. I can only say that if it had been me, I'd first let corporate get a crack at cleaning the mess up. You can always go to plan-b if that doesn't work, but this is something that they should be made aware of so they can be at least given the opportunity to take appropriate steps to make sure these particular individuals responsible for your situation NEVER GET THE CHANCE TO TRY IT ON SOMEONE AGAIN.
In the end it's your call, since after all it's your life and you have to live it the best that you can. But for what it's worth, I hope you do come back safe to begin with and that you DO return to UPS because it's people like yourself that DO help make it a better place for most everybody else working alongside you.
It's a big company, and none of us alone can reshape it to how it would look best to our own eyes overnite. But I wouldn't be surprised if there were some in management that also have had crummy occurences happen to them, and then set out to make positive changes to help ensure that what happened to them doesn't happen to other employees in the future.
The wrong thing certainly happened in your case, but that doesn't neccessarily mean some good management can't make it right for you with your help. Hey if you can get thru college with a 3.85 GPA while working a job, you can come out of this and still land on your feet and the ordeal might even make you better for having weathered it. Good luck to you and those serving alongside you. I know that there's got to be more than a few managers that would be as glad to have you serving with them as well.
I've seen some lousy things happen every so often but I have NEVER come across something as despicable as what you described. I agree with much of the advice given. I can only say that if it had been me, I'd first let corporate get a crack at cleaning the mess up. You can always go to plan-b if that doesn't work, but this is something that they should be made aware of so they can be at least given the opportunity to take appropriate steps to make sure these particular individuals responsible for your situation NEVER GET THE CHANCE TO TRY IT ON SOMEONE AGAIN.
In the end it's your call, since after all it's your life and you have to live it the best that you can. But for what it's worth, I hope you do come back safe to begin with and that you DO return to UPS because it's people like yourself that DO help make it a better place for most everybody else working alongside you.
It's a big company, and none of us alone can reshape it to how it would look best to our own eyes overnite. But I wouldn't be surprised if there were some in management that also have had crummy occurences happen to them, and then set out to make positive changes to help ensure that what happened to them doesn't happen to other employees in the future.
The wrong thing certainly happened in your case, but that doesn't neccessarily mean some good management can't make it right for you with your help. Hey if you can get thru college with a 3.85 GPA while working a job, you can come out of this and still land on your feet and the ordeal might even make you better for having weathered it. Good luck to you and those serving alongside you. I know that there's got to be more than a few managers that would be as glad to have you serving with them as well.
P
plisken
Guest
Three years ago, I was hired with two other guys, both of them had just been discharged from the Marines. They had just returned home from Afghanistan.
About a year later, UPS awarded them, (and others at our hub who serve in the military) with a plaque and recognition. It wasn't much, it happened at break-time, but it was a show of appreciation.
Bamboonga, the so-called, managers you are talking about are as un-American as it gets. I hope the get disappeared from the company we all work for.
Stay out of the bullet,s way, and thanks.
About a year later, UPS awarded them, (and others at our hub who serve in the military) with a plaque and recognition. It wasn't much, it happened at break-time, but it was a show of appreciation.
Bamboonga, the so-called, managers you are talking about are as un-American as it gets. I hope the get disappeared from the company we all work for.
Stay out of the bullet,s way, and thanks.
B
bamboonga
Guest
Dawg, yes I know about having to follow crummy orders...but then that makes me wonder if the order came from closer to the top than I originally thought...what really sucks is that the guy who helped them do it wears the same uniform as I do and he used that to help them...
Tooner, I've seriously considered this...I never could understand why they would do something like this when I have a pile of papers thick enough to stop a bullet that say UPS is guilty and were informed of it 100 times over...I actually thought of going to the media as well - The O'Reilly Factor has already told me if I get home and this isn't resolved they'd love to hear from me...(one of their biggest advertisers happens to be Fed Ex teehee) but I still don't know...I did like working there when I did...and if it's true that I can be 'made whole' when I get back, I'd almost have enough seniority to go for driver...from what I read on here the money is good (even if the hours do seem to suck). One question though - who is 'Eskew'? Was he around 2 yrs ago (I haven't been home for awhile)
One question - a lot of people are saying 'go to corporate'. I thought of this many times DURING the ordeal, but once it was over I got deployed pretty quick and was busy buying a year's supply of EVERYTHING (soap, toilet paper, razor blades, cash, etc)...fighting this whole thing went to the bottom of my priorities list. So how DOES one get in touch with corporate (if it ever comes to that)?
Thanks everyone...this is a much better response than I got the first time I brought this issue up on this board...well, more positive anyway. At least now I have some idea how to clean up this mess when I get home...
Tooner, I've seriously considered this...I never could understand why they would do something like this when I have a pile of papers thick enough to stop a bullet that say UPS is guilty and were informed of it 100 times over...I actually thought of going to the media as well - The O'Reilly Factor has already told me if I get home and this isn't resolved they'd love to hear from me...(one of their biggest advertisers happens to be Fed Ex teehee) but I still don't know...I did like working there when I did...and if it's true that I can be 'made whole' when I get back, I'd almost have enough seniority to go for driver...from what I read on here the money is good (even if the hours do seem to suck). One question though - who is 'Eskew'? Was he around 2 yrs ago (I haven't been home for awhile)
One question - a lot of people are saying 'go to corporate'. I thought of this many times DURING the ordeal, but once it was over I got deployed pretty quick and was busy buying a year's supply of EVERYTHING (soap, toilet paper, razor blades, cash, etc)...fighting this whole thing went to the bottom of my priorities list. So how DOES one get in touch with corporate (if it ever comes to that)?
Thanks everyone...this is a much better response than I got the first time I brought this issue up on this board...well, more positive anyway. At least now I have some idea how to clean up this mess when I get home...
D
dannyboy
Guest
First off, there are many of us that have been around that have seen all of this done either to us personally or to someone else in our center. Especially the not notifying the driver of deaths or other family crisis even when it was very easy to do so. I have also seen management try and screw over a driver just for the heck of it. This is where a true union is invaluable. Not the teamsters, but all the drivers and part timers in the center gathering to the aid of one worker that has been singled out for the heat.
But I have also seen management that has stuck thier necks out for drivers and some have taken big hits trying to do the right things, and upper management thinks differently.
Managements roll at ups is to allow us to do our jobs to the best of our ability. It is also their jobs to remove barriers that interfere with our rapid completion of that job.
unfortunatly, instead of removing barriers, they have placed them in our way. Some new technologies are great and do much to help out the driver and the customer. Others are done just to please the management structure and have no benifit to the customer or the driver.
So go figure.
Currently, the management team we have here now is one of the best ever. But it stops at the district it would seem.
d
But I have also seen management that has stuck thier necks out for drivers and some have taken big hits trying to do the right things, and upper management thinks differently.
Managements roll at ups is to allow us to do our jobs to the best of our ability. It is also their jobs to remove barriers that interfere with our rapid completion of that job.
unfortunatly, instead of removing barriers, they have placed them in our way. Some new technologies are great and do much to help out the driver and the customer. Others are done just to please the management structure and have no benifit to the customer or the driver.
So go figure.
Currently, the management team we have here now is one of the best ever. But it stops at the district it would seem.
d
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