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[my2cents]

I'm no expert on the aviation industry, although the current health of it doesn't seem great. It looks like some airlines are looking for concessions from their unions.

 

[kjones514]

Yes, good thing UPS is a trucking company not an airline, UPS should have had I.E. study more before purchasing large commerical jets. With Kelley's and Asskew's large payroll and stock bonuses it is hard to justify paying anyone descent wages. We all "pick up a check" at UPS, just think do you deserve it.

 

[lr1937]

Frank
What makes you think air mechanics tasks are any more important that tasks that thousands of people perform daily in thousands of other critical and important jobs. To question whether gsx has done or not done some routine mechanics task is unfair. Sometime people in the air buseness believe that air is synonymous with superiority.
Air mechanics are part of a team that make things happen in China. They are not the only reason and we would be there with or without the present team of mechanics. They are like the 80k supervisor you are talking about, they can be replaced. By the way that 80k sup has as much if not more responsiblily that any mechanic and earns every penny of his pay just like you do. To infer as you have that they don't earn their keep just like you do is close to being ignorant.
I respect your right to your opinion and hope that the respect is mutual.
By the way air mechanics don't have monopoly on being pooped on. Your just pooped all over air hub supervisors.

 

[gsx1990]

Frank,
I'm not a mechanic, but have alot of friends that are. I know its hard work. I never said
it wasn't. However, Mexican farm workers in
California get paid $5 a day for much more physically demanding jobs. You are an important
part of UPS, but like LR said, so is EVERYONE
else. As I said, I tend to think $80k a year
base for mechanics is very fair. You obviously
think your worth much more. Just wait till some
of the big airlines go under due to excessive
demands from their Unions. They there will be
an oversupply of aircraft mechanics, and you
can be replaced. What I'm trying to say is that
you are part of the UPS team. Why dont you think
aboutit that way instead of just me me me me
all the time. I can't belive this "superior"
attitude some of you guys take. You are human,
just like me and everyone else. No one is
non replaceable. Period!

 

[gsx1990]

Frank,
The old question? IF your are being <FONT COLOR="ff0000">••••</FONT>
upon so bad, why do you stay? Is it because
you have no other education? You could not make
it at any other career? I dont want to hear
this old excuse. If the job is so bad...LEAVE!

I'm sure there are lots of other junior mechanics
that would be happy to move up to a $40 an hour
job. Problem is, your union only promotes senority, not performance. I'd love to see you
be the boss of your own company that imposed the
rules that unions impose. Maybe then you would
see things differntly.

 

[gsx1990]

kjones...

WHAT THE H$%L do you define as decent wages?

PLEASE ANSWER ME? IS $80K a year not DECENT?

What has become of this world??

 

[greasymech]

Some things that need to be understood


Aircraft Technitions are becoming shorter in supply as the demand for experienced technitions is growing. Aircraft produced within the last 10 years are increasingly more advanced requiring higher degrees of training and aptitude for todays technition. This is a simple matter of supply and demand no more no less. Todays Auto Mechanic can make the same money as an Aircraft Mechanic.

 

[gsx1990]

greasy,

Understood. However, doesnt UPS pay for all
the training that these mechanics receive? Its
not like they spend $50k of their own to get the
training.....

 

[greasymech]

"Aircraft Mechanics" as government and big business have labeled, require Airframe and Powerplant licenses granted by the Federal Aviation Administration. These licenses allow an Aircraft Technition to return and aircraft to service after maintenance is preformed. Both licenses can be obtained by completeing 30 months of "on the job training" or thru an FAA approved technical school. Training thru an A&amp;P school takes approximatly 2 years for both licences. Once an individual completes the OJT or A&amp;P school he must take 3 written and 2 oral and practical tests administered by an FAA designee. Returning and aircraft to service in effect takes the liability off the company and places it on the licensed individual signing off the work preformed. UPS, as most major airlines do, hire only aircraft mechanics holding both licences.
So, to answer your question, no UPS does not pay for the training we must have to obtain our licenses. A&amp;P schools can cost anywhere from $5000 to $30,000. When I went to school 15 years ago it cost me $12,000. Airlines are required by the FAA to train their Technitions on the type aircraft they operate. They must also give recurent training at certain intervals. For instance, most recently UPS was required to train a certain number of its Technitions on the MD11 before the FAA would allow UPS to operate that aircraft type. This training consisted of 2 weeks of systems, 2 weeks of avionics, 3 days of engine run and taxi. The powerplant was common to the 767 we currently operate so most techs have that 1 week school previously.

 

[vgpa]

gsx,
Obviously, you are management. If you work for UPS you mean to tell me you didn't know that UPS doesn't pay for the mechanics training. Are you ticked off because they would make $80G for a 40 hr. week and a sup in management would make the same for working a 60 hr. week? They would get paid for OT regardless of their performance. Management gets paid/rewarded with stock, depending on there centers numbers/performance. If any of the big airlines go under,it would be for other reasons not from the demands from the union. Are the big airlines showing a profit comparible to UPS? It seems like everyone wants a piece of the pie , the problem is management dislikes teamsters and vice versa. BTW, I wouldn't go selling your stock because you will be on the you know what list. JMO

 

[gsx1990]

greasy,
Thanks for your information. I respect the
mechanics, but still think that an 80k base salary
is very fair.

 

[gsx1990]

vgpa,
Obviously, you are wrong. I don't work for UPS,
never have, never will.

Tell me why the big airlines will go under if
not from demands from unions?

Tell me why one of the really successfull airlines, Southwest, is non-union. Tell me why
the employees there have voted not to go union...

Mangement at UPS has the problem of trying to
motivate union workers who have no threat of
recourse. Thiers is a very tough job just like
the mechanics. But when everyone works together
as a TEAM, the entire organization succeeds.
Luckily the vast majority of the teamsters are
hardworkers who value their jobs and expect a
decent wage. I'm of the opinion that $80k a year
base for mechanics is very fair. Apparantly
you don't. Fine, we agree to dissagree.

 

[kjones514]

Wrong again SWA AMTs are IBT Local 19 and pilots are alpa. You my friend, are just making yourself look more like a FDX person, trying to stir the pot when you know nothing and speak nothing.

 

[goatmonster]

gsx1990 said:
"I don't work for UPS,
never have, never will."
Well, that explains a lot. I had a feeling I should just ignore you, and now I will.

 

[kjones514]

the-mechanic.com is a website run by an UAL AMT, to see a sample of Aviation Union at its best check it out. 1990 you can go there but remember these are professional people so read dont speak.

 

[gsx1990]

kjones,
Not a FDX person here either. Used to be a long
term UPS investor. Not anymore. Think I'm gonna
invest my money in a company that won't be
brought down by ridiculous union demands.

One last time, I ask you if you think $80k
is a decent wage to live on. You refuse to answer
this question, because both you and I know the answer.

 

[gsx1990]

goatmonster,
Thanks. I'll ignore all of your usefull
posts as well.

 

[kjones514]

80k is nice, but I work on 727s, 747s, 757s, 767s,dc-8, md-11, and a-300s, for a company that pays full-time package supervisors 80k a year with no legal responsibilty to the FAA, NTSB, or DOT,(they do have responibilty for haz-mat, etc, and a commitment to service). If UPS ever needed a give-back, WE as employee-owners would help UPS to survive, but till that time comes, if ever, I want to share with them the profits. UPS is an investment that will pay forever, if you get out you are an idiot, but you have already shown me that. 80k is fair, BUT what about pension, work rules, and retirement medical, these are our main problem with the agreement. I work 3 days a week, tues, wed, thur, for 13 hours a day, but during that time I "move aircraft" full of packages during a Second Day and Next Day operation, and I want to share in the profits for my "spirt of cooperation".

 

[gsx1990]

kjones,
Thanks for finally answering my question. Despite what you think, I am not an idiot. Just
don't want to see the teamsters STEAL my "GOLDEN
EGG" as they have claimed they want to do.
(QUOTE from the HOFFA)

I am 100% behind UPS paying its employees a fair
wage. The profits should be shared. Its a shame
the teamsters would likely not allow profit sharing in UPS stock. There are bad apples in both management ranks and hourly ranks, we all know that. As I have said before, we agree
to disagree. I think unions have become WAY
too powerful. Just for your own knowlege, I
have worked in a union shop and seen what union
rules do to productivity.

Hopefully UPS will always pay "forever" as you claim. And I hope you share in the wealth.
However, I feel UPS will have a harder and harder
time competing with non-union companies and loose
its dominance. Time will tell.

 

[anonymous]

I don't know any sups that get 80K-

Where's my golden egg?